UKGTL - Season 0-B (GTC65) - Round 1, Anderstorp GP - Jan 29

[PaulW]

I would be really gutted if I would now be forced to miss races just because my comp is not up to spec on the darker races. I suffer because of the low FPS allready, why would I now have to skip races as well?
Please dont see this as an attitude of me wantingl to win everything - all I want is to have great battles, like the ones me and Ruskus and a few other guys had in the previous class.

Flip that around Pero and you could argue that a lot of us would be upset to miss being able to use the great lighting around the transition between night/dawn and dusk/night alongside the extra enjoyment the track-side lighting and headlights give. I like the idea of having to take extra care of your headlights in order not to loose them, for example. After all the work Simbin put in to this side of the game it would be a real shame not to make use of it. Not sure what the answer is 

[Aagramn]

I did take out the Night race from the schedule after Season 0-A's feedback and there is only one other non day race this week. For the GTC76 I will stick to day races, but wanted to see how people coped with at least Dawn, as the polls indicated that Dawn and Dusk were still possibilities for people (real figures rather than the people that shout loudest).

Yes, that's part of the point of season 0, to try these things out and see how they work in real race conditions. We've had some negative comments about dawn/dusk before, but not nearly as much as we had after tonight's race, it was definitely worth trying.

Sorry people are having low FPS in low light settings, but the lighting settings of the game is part of the game and if your system is not capable of running at decent FPS then maybe those people should skip the low light races as there are others that like racing in the low light conditions, it's part of the attraction. What's the point in Simbin adding nice day/night stuff and then nobody using it?!

You can still get nice lighting effects with the sun reflecting off the track by setting the time a bit later in the morning or earlier in the evening. Without car and trackside lights on it shouldn't effect people's frame rates. If people are competing in a league they don't want to have to miss races due to technical issues. My system can cope, I just don't enjoy groping for braking and turn-in points.

Possibly it would be better to save the low-light conditions for fun races or one-off special events. How about a night-racers cup?

[Dave 'Gizmo' Gymer]

Flip that around Pero and you could argue that a lot of us would be upset to miss being able to use the great lighting around the transition between night/dawn and dusk/night alongside the extra enjoyment the track-side lighting and headlights give. I like the idea of having to take extra care of your headlights in order not to loose them, for example. After all the work Simbin put in to this side of the game it would be a real shame not to make use of it. Not sure what the answer is 

You mean the work ISI put in. The only reason GTL has those effects is because it uses the gMotor 2 engine; I'm 99.9% sure that these historic cars aren't raced at dawn or dusk - they're too precious for that. When GTR2 comes out it's a different story.

Bottom line is that the quality and enjoyment of the racing comes first, and if low light is detracting from rather than adding to it then it won't happen.

[AdrianD]

I nearly missed last night as I was getting about 5fps on my normal nearly max settings and 1152 x 864 32bit

I have a yr old 9800PRO Athlon64 and I usually put up with a bit of judder to have it look great, but I had to drop out last night to put every setting to medium and had trouble getting back in but it ran smooth as anything after that, and I did'nt notice any changes I'd made really it looked just as good in the half light so I think I'll keep these settings.

I'm happy to knock them down even more if we do night races.

[Pero_Grozni]

Dont know about your point there Paul - comparing an extra effect for pleasure against not being able to race dosent hold much water in my book.  
EDIT: And the point about my sistem being old also is not really relevant  - it would be relevant if I wouldnt get any good FPS in the best of conditions, but I can race normaly on daytime races.
If I would be the only one with the problem I wouldnt even bother complaining as it that would clear that I just am not able to get racing, but there are more people with a simmilar problem.

[[ZiP]Tyf]

It's not just an extra effect imo. It's also another way of driving. Just as with the rain! Could be a rule added saying 1 or 2 headlights not working, u have to pit to get them repaired else u get penatly points, hence u need to be a bit more careful (again like in the rain).

I don't race in other leagues, so I don't know, but maybe someone else does, do they take into consideration the system specs of members? In about 6 years of online gaming I've never heard of that! LOL! In fps games u just have to live with that disadvantage of having 30 fps instead of 150, which is bad (I know and I'm cwap already! ) So the point is relevant imo, but all that being said I think this is exactly the league that would do it differently since it's about fun
I'm stepping out of this discussion btw else it will turn into the ranting we had on standing or rolling starts, lol! We got admins and mods for this and the Head MUPPET  already gave his opinion!

T

[fozzmeister]

Even more strange is that we havent even practised one rolling start before-many incidents were all down to these two facts.

This was a practice race really.

It's not just an extra effect imo. It's also another way of driving. Just as with the rain

Yeh I totally agree. When I first played rF with those shadows I realised I could not see my braking point at all, and when the shadows weren't there I was always looking around for alternate brake points, things like breaks in the trees, or slight bumps in the road, anything to give me a bearing on where I was. Nothing pumps up the fear level as the shadows slowly move across your braking points and you've got a guy right behind you. Even people who don't have low FPS compained about it, and maybe they were too dark in the day, but getting quite late when the sun is more directional it adds a whole new aspect.

<rant>Now as my RAM is permanently clocked at half speed yet again. I've got FPS problems so its all off. I'm sending off my Ballistix RAM back yet again, and I have to wait for a replacement, after over half a year of running at 1/2 speed most of the time, replacing shed loads of components to find out I've got bad RAM yet again, they still won't give me my money back  </rant>

[Mark J]

I had no frame rate probs or stutters, it ran very smoothly on my 1yr+ old system, using only a 6600gt card.
 I really like the lighting effects and think they do add an extra dimension to the racing, though i would have to admit that once i lost my headlights half way thru, it was a real strain on the eyes trying to make out the track and my eyes get bashed enough at work through the week. I also dropped about 1-2 secs a lap without lights.
Is the pit routine improved in GTL over GTR...ie if i pitted to get the lights fixed, is that all they'd do?...or would they bloody valet & service the car too as in GTR 

If there was a vote, i would vote to keep the odd dusk/dawn race purely for the variation it offers and the fact that it looks stunning seeing the cars lights and flames belching from exhausts. 

[fozzmeister]

You can't expect an online racing league to be backwards compatible with a PIII (for instance ).

You can't argue with a P3, Infact the Centrino is a P3 with nobs on and I think thier newer chips are based on it now! Have Intel done anything of note since the Centrino?

Fozz

[PaulW]

Bottom line is that the quality and enjoyment of the racing comes first, and if low light is detracting from rather than adding to it then it won't happen.

Ahh, but the bottom line for some, like me, is that night races with lighting are even more enjoyable.

Dont know about your point there Paul - comparing an extra effect for pleasure against not being able to race dosent hold much water in my book.  
EDIT: And the point about my sistem being old also is not really relevant  - it would be relevant if I wouldnt get any good FPS in the best of conditions, but I can race normaly on daytime races.

You aren't able to race though because, by your own admission, your system is "low end". I'm sure you can see that it's a shame for those with newer hardware not to be able to race with lights.

Of course everyone has their preference based on hardware and/or race style. At the end of the day it's what the majority want that will win out- and quite right too.

[Clarey]

Interesting disscusion so far, i've enjoyed reading the arguments, and i didn't even drive (broken wheel, replacement not due till next week)

I built a new system for sim racing, and thats what i intend to do "sim racing".  Rain, night, day any conditions.

In reallife i dont drive as quick in rain or at night, because i value my no claims bonus   I apply this to sim racing too.

This is simracing.org.uk? right? Not xbox arcade racers?
Maybe two leagues are needed? One for simracers who enjoy "sim" racing and one for just racing?

Hope you all enjoy the rest of 0-B anyway.

[Simon Gymer]

Ok, can we stop the dawn/dusk/night/day discussions please, or take it to this thread...
https://www.simracing.org.uk/smf/index.php?topic=1096.0

The feedback has been noted and GTC76 Season 0-C will be run with all day races. There is one more dusk/dawn race for Season 0-B.
When Season 0 is over we will then evaluate whether to run non-day races during Season 1 or not from the feedback received and what we want to achieve.

[[ZiP]Tyf]

Awww, u killed the convo Shark! U just bit it in half!  MEANIE!

Lol! 

T

[Simon Gymer]

Step into my bus sir...
 

[Paul968]

Well that was fun, although the start was a bit crazy - Mad-Ripp in front hardly moved off the line and everyone else seemed to be nipping past, which was frustrating, but things seemed to sort themselves out by the start of the race proper. The 275 was handling nicely, but it's lack of grunt meant I got killed down the straight by the swarms of TVRs that showed up. Luckily they were slowed down rather more by the corners. Had a nice tussle with Mark J, which ended when I nipped by at T4 as the car in front spun. The leaders had a bit of a gap on me and were at least as quick so no real prospect of catching, so the rest of the race was consolidation really, and I ended up a very satisfying 4th 

Can't make Dijon, but hope to be there at Modello - I think I may need an engine upgrade though if so many people take TVRs next time

Paul