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UKGPL => UKGPL Races => Topic started by: Cookie on December 30, 2011, 12:39:06 AM +0000



Title: UKGPL Season 22 - Monaco 65 and Silverstone 67 - Ferrari Challenge - Jan 03
Post by: Cookie on December 30, 2011, 12:39:06 AM +0000
The UKGPL Ferrari Challenge  Fun Races.


To celebrate the end of this great year 2011 and to do a first step to 60fps for some of you.
We will do 3 x 2 fun races with the Ferraris in all mods available in UKGPL atm.
 

The races will be run with the great 60fps patches of Petteri Pajunen (brr).
If you have not yet tried it please read this -> HOW-TO (https://www.simracing.org.uk/smf/index.php?topic=10298.0)
 
This will be the schedule:

   Date   Day  Time   Mod     Patch used     Car         Track   Laps  
   27/12/2011 Tuesday 20:30 UK  GT         60fpsV1    330/P4   Spa Francorchamps   7 Laps  
   27/12/2011 Tuesday 21:30 UK  69Xtra     60fpsV1     312     Watkins Glen  22 Laps  
   03/01/2012 Tuesday 20:30 UK  65         60fpsV2newmod     1512     Monaco    18 Laps  
   03/01/2012 Tuesday 21:30 UK  67         60fpsV2newmod     312       Silverstone 19  Laps  
   10/01/2012 Tuesday 20:30 UK  66         60fpsV2newmod     312       Monza   Laps  
   10/01/2012 Tuesday 21:30 UK  F2-67         60fpsV2newmod     166     Kyalami   Laps  

Let's find out who is the best Ferrari driver!

Who wants a drive should sign up here – everyone is welcome!

 
There will be 2 intermediate short races of 25-30 mins . The tracks are all original Papy and well known.
Unlimited Shift+R is permitted but each must be followed by a Stop & Go of a minimum 0,001sec.;)
Points Scoring (per race)
Standard Points Positions 1-19: 30 - 25 - 21 - 18 - 16 - 14 - 13 - 12 - 11 - 10 - 9 - 8 - 7 - 6 - 5 - 4 - 3 - 2 - 1


Our first race will be the 65 Mod at Monaco 18 Laps with the Ferrari 1512
followed by
the second race using the 67 (Mod) at Silverstone 19 Laps with the Ferrari 312


Race List = IGOR
Chatroom = UKGPL
Server = UKGPL_8
IP address = TBA
Race date = 03-01-2012
Variant = 65 and 67 F1
Chassis -  Ferrari
Tracks = Monaco 65 and Silverstone 67
Qually time = 25-30 minutes (server will start at 20:30 UK time)
Race length = 25-30 min
Damage Model = Intermediate
Password = TBA

GLA and FUN

Here you will get the replays (ftp://ukgpl3.dyndns.org/Replays/Fun_Races/)

Drivers so far



Marc Barresi    48
Axel "Cookie"   41
Nicky Ickx      37
Alex Barresi    35
Raoni Frizzo    30
Steve Bird      26
Juha            25
Fulvio          25
Axel Cordt      21
Dave Rainier    20
Albrecht K.     17
Jason Blito     14
BadBlood        14
Sergio"Clouds"  14
Göran           13
Bernie          11
Pierre D         9

EvilClive
MiniBlood
Al Heller
Ray
Hristo
Doni
Lorenzo Melli
Allan Davis


Title: Re: UKGPL Season 22 - Monaco 65 and Silverstone 67 - Ferrari Challenge - Jan 03
Post by: 1967driver on December 30, 2011, 07:01:59 AM +0000
Present at carnage, as usual.
Axel, cut & paste in first post, please:

Marc Barresi    48
Axel "Cookie"   41
Nicky Ickx      37
Alex Barresi    35
Raoni Frizzo    30
Steve Bird      26
Juha            25
Fulvio          25
Axel Cordt      21
Dave Rainier    20
Albrecht K.     17
Jason Blito     14
BadBlood        14
Sergio"Clouds"  14
Göran           13
Bernie          11
Pierre D         9


Title: Re: UKGPL Season 22 - Monaco 65 and Silverstone 67 - Ferrari Challenge - Jan 03
Post by: Cookie on December 30, 2011, 09:01:58 AM +0000
Thanks Alex,

the trick with the fonts convinced me, the order had been intentional accidentally  ;)


Title: Re: UKGPL Season 22 - Monaco 65 and Silverstone 67 - Ferrari Challenge - Jan 03
Post by: Phil Thornton on December 30, 2011, 09:24:19 AM +0000
I've got the 60fps stuff working OK now thanks to Axel's tips.  It would be a better test if we have a full grid so I'd like to take part if there is enough room.  If the grid is full then NP.


Title: Re: UKGPL Season 22 - Monaco 65 and Silverstone 67 - Ferrari Challenge - Jan 03
Post by: bernie on December 30, 2011, 10:37:16 AM +0000
Looking forward to this , 60fps and Monaco high res should be a gas  ;D


Title: Re: UKGPL Season 22 - Monaco 65 and Silverstone 67 - Ferrari Challenge - Jan 03
Post by: Geoff65 on December 30, 2011, 11:12:32 AM +0000
I'll have a go too if there's a second grid


Title: Re: UKGPL Season 22 - Monaco 65 and Silverstone 67 - Ferrari Challenge - Jan 03
Post by: BadBlood on December 30, 2011, 11:49:37 AM +0000
If there is a need I will run a second grid on the night (UKGPL3).


Title: Re: UKGPL Season 22 - Monaco 65 and Silverstone 67 - Ferrari Challenge - Jan 03
Post by: Hristo Itchov on December 30, 2011, 12:32:39 PM +0000
Again I'm a candidate for this, if I should make it.


Title: Re: UKGPL Season 22 - Monaco 65 and Silverstone 67 - Ferrari Challenge - Jan 03
Post by: jhalli on December 30, 2011, 03:30:47 PM +0000
i must get some minor penalty when i forgot to make stop and go on both races.  :oops:


Title: Re: UKGPL Season 22 - Monaco 65 and Silverstone 67 - Ferrari Challenge - Jan 03
Post by: Cookie on December 30, 2011, 05:02:08 PM +0000
i must get some minor penalty when i forgot to make stop and go on both races.  :oops:

Juha, you were not the only one!


But as this is a FUN series, I ask you all to take your stop and go in the future as a gesture of fairness ;)


Title: Re: UKGPL Season 22 - Monaco 65 and Silverstone 67 - Ferrari Challenge - Jan 03
Post by: s2173 on December 31, 2011, 12:07:24 AM +0000
OK, I'l race these... maybe I'll be able to see what so different about 60 fps. Tho I'll eat my socks if theres no wrap contacts... especially at t1 monza...

And the stop and go makes no sense... it should be atleast 0.00000005...  :laugh:


Title: Re: UKGPL Season 22 - Monaco 65 and Silverstone 67 - Ferrari Challenge - Jan 03
Post by: Cookie on January 01, 2012, 05:55:11 PM +0000
Here (http://vimeo.com/34429745) I posted a video from the start at Spa


Title: Re: UKGPL Season 22 - Monaco 65 and Silverstone 67 - Ferrari Challenge - Jan 03
Post by: Rainier on January 03, 2012, 07:27:54 PM +0000
Hello

Happy new year all !

I wish to race with you tonight !

see you
Dave


Title: Re: UKGPL Season 22 - Monaco 65 and Silverstone 67 - Ferrari Challenge - Jan 03
Post by: Cookie on January 03, 2012, 07:39:57 PM +0000
No Problem Dave, you are welcome ;)


PW: 60fps



Title: Re: UKGPL Season 22 - Monaco 65 and Silverstone 67 - Ferrari Challenge - Jan 03
Post by: NickyIckx on January 03, 2012, 10:58:10 PM +0000
 :D guess 5/84 5/132 did the trick ; to me server at 2nd Silver  run was brilliant .

 :(apart from that it looks like my 67mod is coruppted : long set 2nd gear spins my car 360° at 53kmh, rev needle still totally down , alll over nearly no brake effect , no matter what brake bias ,right front tyre overheats and same time GPL telling me left front tyre should have positive camber  ??? its a basicly righthander track isnt it ?  :D well havnt touched 67 mod since years , so hopefully a clean installl would spent some light on it ... ???
 ::)so Fezza Challange Cup to me is down after tonight : 2 times no results , doesnt fit to P3 and P5 ..

back to important things :  ;D thanks Cookie for hosting


Title: Re: UKGPL Season 22 - Monaco 65 and Silverstone 67 - Ferrari Challenge - Jan 03
Post by: bernie on January 03, 2012, 11:19:17 PM +0000
Out of interest I found tyre temps and cambers needed some strange settings , to get the temps correct across the tyres needed pressures rasing to silly levels and i couldn't get the brake balance righteither , was blaming my driving / set up skills  ::)


Title: Re: UKGPL Season 22 - Monaco 65 and Silverstone 67 - Ferrari Challenge - Jan 03
Post by: Cookie on January 04, 2012, 12:07:18 AM +0000
;D guess 5/84 5/132 did the trick ; to me server at 2nd Silver  run was brilliant .

Yes Nicky!
Sorry for this Monaco desaster :'( and thx to Fulvio who found the solution!!!
But never before I had such a desaster with 60fps on my server. We did the way more heavy GTs and 69X without such trouble...

I just edited the results of Monaco re the record laps.
It seems there is a bug in this track, as I remember the same strange things happened when we raced with the S21 Novs here!

Thank you all for racing and see you next week in Monza 66 and Kyalami 67F2 on a warpless server!


Title: Re: UKGPL Season 22 - Monaco 65 and Silverstone 67 - Ferrari Challenge - Jan 03
Post by: Cookie on January 04, 2012, 12:12:28 AM +0000
Out of interest I found tyre temps and cambers needed some strange settings , to get the temps correct across the tyres needed pressures rasing to silly levels and i couldn't get the brake balance righteither , was blaming my driving / set up skills  ::)

Yeah I had the same strange tire temps here, but I found that this low braking level made it.
The right front became red in prib because it blocked too often.
After reducing the BBias to 53 this was gone and the temps were normal...


Title: Re: UKGPL Season 22 - Monaco 65 and Silverstone 67 - Ferrari Challenge - Jan 03
Post by: s2173 on January 04, 2012, 12:33:48 AM +0000
So 60 fps needs different setup? Argh... No wonder then I didnt suffer from my usial front tyre overheat syndrome at monaco.

Anyway, I had fun at monaco, which is rare. Had to skip silvy, and I didnt manage to ruin my mood... lol.


Title: Re: UKGPL Season 22 - Monaco 65 and Silverstone 67 - Ferrari Challenge - Jan 03
Post by: Hristo Itchov on January 04, 2012, 01:59:28 AM +0000
Monaco results are still wrong. Some of the drivers are actually a lap down and others should be moved up to take their place. And no, I didn't notice any difference in handling with the 60 fps patch. I used the same setups. The car handles differently only if the FPS drop below 60, just like it does with normal GPL when FPS drops below 36.


Title: Re: UKGPL Season 22 - Monaco 65 and Silverstone 67 - Ferrari Challenge - Jan 03
Post by: Cookie on January 04, 2012, 02:11:29 AM +0000
I am aware that the Monaco results are wrong,

So please post here, so I can correct it.

There must be a "whole in the time" where some drivers can jump on this track.
The replay shows that 5 drivers had fastest laptimes of about 10 to 20sec...

This is for shure not 60fps related as this has allready happened in a 36fps race!


Title: Re: UKGPL Season 22 - Monaco 65 and Silverstone 67 - Ferrari Challenge - Jan 03
Post by: 1967driver on January 04, 2012, 07:17:00 AM +0000
"... Sorry for this Monaco desaster ... But never before I had such a desaster with 60fps on my server. We did the way more heavy GTs and 69X without such trouble ..."
I confirm, this is just one of many bugs in GPL and is happened to me and Marco in other occasions apart from the frames per second used (your server is very good, in my opinion).

"... I just edited the results of Monaco re the record laps ..."
Nooooo! Laptime of 12.6", i want my mega-record in Hall of Fame!


Title: Re: UKGPL Season 22 - Monaco 65 and Silverstone 67 - Ferrari Challenge - Jan 03
Post by: 1967driver on January 04, 2012, 07:24:22 AM +0000
And no, I didn't notice any difference in handling with the 60 fps patch.
I do not agree with you: the game's physic does not change, but, imho, the game is more quickly in response to input.


Title: Re: UKGPL Season 22 - Monaco 65 and Silverstone 67 - Ferrari Challenge - Jan 03
Post by: EvilClive on January 04, 2012, 08:27:47 AM +0000
I was looking forward to a fun race at Monaco and qualification went OK although I could not hook up a fast lap without traffic, but that is the nature of Monaco :-\
I suffered a little latency in qually, but when we went to the grid things got really serious. The two cars on the front row vanished just as the flag dropped, then ALL cars disappeared and I thought I was about to disco. Suddenly all the cars reappeared and I was about to rearend Hristo, so I eased off slightly and then more cars materialised on either side as we headed to St Devote!! :o. 
3 wide into St Devote does not work and there was an enormous pile up  :-\ Sorry guys but there was just nothing I could do about it.

Eventually I re-set, but as I started to catch cars in front they were winking on and off making any pass impossible. Also the latency was making driving difficult as I missed braking points and turn-ins until I gave up when I half spun at the hairpin.

From the comments above it looks like there might have been some server side issues which were sorted for the 67 race, but by then I had given up and gone to bed  ;D



Title: Re: UKGPL Season 22 - Monaco 65 and Silverstone 67 - Ferrari Challenge - Jan 03
Post by: NickyIckx on January 04, 2012, 09:43:05 AM +0000
 :) found the readme for 60fpsV2/60fpsV2newmod

outake:
The following Core.ini parameters are recommended (change them if you know what you are doing):


net_mdm_client_send_every = 5                ; Client packet freq on dialup
net_mdm_client_send_size = 84                ; Client packet size on dialup
net_mdm_server_send_every = 5                 ; Server packet freq on dialup
net_mdm_server_send_size = 384               ; Server packet size on dialup
net_server_port=0                             ; Server port number (0 = default)
net_use_mdm_bandwidth_for_tcp_ip=1            ; Use modem bandwidthfor TCP/IP - 1 = Use net_mdm_ settings *

The reason for using send_every = 5 instead of the commonly used 3 is that networking code is also speeded up. Send_every = 3 means sending data every third frame (12 times per second in original GPL). Using send_every = 5 means sending data every fifth frame, which is again 12 times per second when using the 60 fps patch. Send_size parameters are not affected by the 60 fps patch, so they can be chosen as before.


whole readme could be downloaded here:
README.txt for 60fpsV2/60fpsV2newmod
6.9 KB
www.megaupload.com/?d=1HSMSMM2


 ??? ??? does this mean , on both sides ( host /join ) above core.ini settings have to be used ?
not on server side only ?
I think yes...


Title: Re: UKGPL Season 22 - Monaco 65 and Silverstone 67 - Ferrari Challenge - Jan 03
Post by: Mark75 Barresi on January 04, 2012, 09:54:04 AM +0000
Axel, i'm finished in 2th position at monaco gp.
Ciao.


Title: Re: UKGPL Season 22 - Monaco 65 and Silverstone 67 - Ferrari Challenge - Jan 03
Post by: bernie on January 04, 2012, 10:08:57 AM +0000
Monaco results are still wrong. Some of the drivers are actually a lap down and others should be moved up to take their place. And no, I didn't notice any difference in handling with the 60 fps patch. I used the same setups. The car handles differently only if the FPS drop below 60, just like it does with normal GPL when FPS drops below 36.

Hristo I was refaring to the 67mod  Silver race , Monaco was fine for me apart from the latency issue  :)


Title: Re: UKGPL Season 22 - Monaco 65 and Silverstone 67 - Ferrari Challenge - Jan 03
Post by: Cookie on January 04, 2012, 10:37:01 AM +0000
:) found the readme for 60fpsV2/60fpsV2newmod

 ??? ??? does this mean , on both sides ( host /join ) above core.ini settings have to be used ?
not on server side only ?
I think yes...

I did change the numbers in the  server hosting window of IGOR and this seemed to work for all!
Maybe we can test this with BREASTS on a full grid with F2s and 65s tonight?

Mark I will correct the standings all in one  ;)


Title: Re: UKGPL Season 22 - Monaco 65 and Silverstone 67 - Ferrari Challenge - Jan 03
Post by: fpolicardi on January 04, 2012, 10:38:32 AM +0000
As well explained in the fpspatch readme:
"The reason for using send_every = 5 instead of the commonly used 3 is that networking code is also speeded up. Send_every = 3 means sending data every third frame (12 times per second in original GPL). Using send_every = 5 means sending data every fifth frame, which is again 12 times per second when using the 60 fps patch. Send_size parameters are not affected by the 60 fps patch, so they can be chosen as before."

So using 3 with 60fps we send data 20 times per second that is almost doubled respect to 36fps and this affects both clients and server.
The upload request on server with 19 clients (3/84 3/132 @36fps or 5/84 5/132 @60fps) is about 340 Kb/s. If we go with 3 @60fps we need about 570 Kb/s.
This is well explained here: http://westrab.home.xs4all.nl/gplol2.htm

Apart from this techi arguments, I've found that 67 cars request a more clean and soft drive to keep them on track with 60fps, particularly on braking where I have to adjust my usual braking points a bit early to not go wide at every corner.

Too bad I got a screen freeze with 7 laps to go while I was having fun with Alex for 3rd. :(
Ciao



Title: Re: UKGPL Season 22 - Monaco 65 and Silverstone 67 - Ferrari Challenge - Jan 03
Post by: fpolicardi on January 04, 2012, 10:42:03 AM +0000
Sorry Nicky, cross posting :)

If you join by Igor you don't need to set anything on client as usual, only if you join direct IP you need to set core.ini parameters.

Ciao
Edit: I had already post the readme in HOW TO thread but it seems it hasn't been read.


Title: Re: UKGPL Season 22 - Monaco 65 and Silverstone 67 - Ferrari Challenge - Jan 03
Post by: clouds on January 04, 2012, 11:15:16 AM +0000
Hi.
Like I said yesterday nite, at first I'm sorry to have rearended Bernie just at the last corner before the chequered flag because I misjudged the braking distance so my apologies to Bernie are due, and at second after the heap just a few meters after the green flag in wich I've involved I...unfortunately forgot to stop & go in the pitlane so take your decisions.

For the second race at Silverstone I've been suffering of a throttle command inversion (and this is not the only one case I've had). While I was slowing down approaching the Stowe turn chased by Hristo who was closing on me very fast, when I've raised the throttle and  pressed on the brake pedal, the trottle had a strange behaviour and seemed like to be pressed at maximum overreving the engine and making me hitting the wall just in front of me.
Fortunately my Ferrari seemed not having any damage but it has been difficult to get the car on track again because this kind of uncalibration in pedals has lasted after 4 or 5 seconds making me almost spinning out returning on track while the throttle pedal was having an On/Off behaviour.

And last but not least...why I was not been able to save my replay ?
When I try to run a replay in 60fps why GPL Crashes To Desktop ?

Thanks


Title: Re: UKGPL Season 22 - Monaco 65 and Silverstone 67 - Ferrari Challenge - Jan 03
Post by: Cookie on January 04, 2012, 11:23:18 AM +0000
Sergio,
please read the second post here (https://www.simracing.org.uk/smf/index.php?topic=10298.0) ;)

Fulvio and Nicky, thanks again for your help!
I never had this overload before with my server, and the races of last week did not show any signs of this.
But it worked fine in Silvy after the change!


Title: Re: UKGPL Season 22 - Monaco 65 and Silverstone 67 - Ferrari Challenge - Jan 03
Post by: fpolicardi on January 04, 2012, 11:57:19 AM +0000
Sergio,
please read the second post here (https://www.simracing.org.uk/smf/index.php?topic=10298.0) ;)

Fulvio and Nicky, thanks again for your help!
I never had this overload before with my server, and the races of last week did not show any signs of this.
But it worked fine in Silvy after the change!

Link doesn't work, see last post for the right link. ;)
Your welcome! :)
Ciao


Title: Re: UKGPL Season 22 - Monaco 65 and Silverstone 67 - Ferrari Challenge - Jan 03
Post by: clouds on January 04, 2012, 12:47:05 PM +0000
Rgr that Axel.

Thanks!


Title: Re: UKGPL Season 22 - Monaco 65 and Silverstone 67 - Ferrari Challenge - Jan 03
Post by: Hristo Itchov on January 04, 2012, 12:47:34 PM +0000
And no, I didn't notice any difference in handling with the 60 fps patch.
I do not agree with you: the game's physic does not change, but, imho, the game is more quickly in response to input.

That might be the case for some PC and wheel/pedal configurations, but I really didn't see any difference on my end. If anything, it even makes it easier to drive, because everything goes smoother.

@Axel - I know the Monaco times issue is not related to the 60 FPS patch, it was due to the bandwidth settings causing trouble. I'm not sure how you're going to correct the lap times, but I know we've done that before in UKGPL so somebody else knows how for sure. I know for certain that Kleinfeld, Sky and Bernie were actually lapped (nothing personal), but I don't know about the others down the order.


Title: Re: UKGPL Season 22 - Monaco 65 and Silverstone 67 - Ferrari Challenge - Jan 03
Post by: Cookie on January 04, 2012, 01:05:52 PM +0000
If anything, it even makes it easier to drive, because everything goes smoother.

@Axel - I know the Monaco times issue is not related to the 60 FPS patch, it was due to the bandwidth settings causing trouble. I'm not sure how you're going to correct the lap times, but I know we've done that before in UKGPL so somebody else knows how for sure. I know for certain that Kleinfeld, Sky and Bernie were actually lapped (nothing personal), but I don't know about the others down the order.

Thanks for this compliment!

As we all learn, and as I have never before seen those bandwidth settings on a 60fps server before, we hope that this problem is solved now!

About the Monaco results, we will find a solution, but it will need some time as I am a newbie in LM2...


Title: Re: UKGPL Season 22 - Monaco 65 and Silverstone 67 - Ferrari Challenge - Jan 03
Post by: NickyIckx on January 04, 2012, 02:22:40 PM +0000
Quote
Maybe we can test this with BREASTS on a full grid with F2s and 65s tonight?

good idea , I would then suggest 65s at Monaco  and F2s at Silverstone .

I will set up my server for both , using recommended settings outa mentioned readme.
( 5/84 5/384 ) .afaik my internet provides enough down/upload to handle 384 .

But , Axel , if you want to test your server , of course I will be fine with that .



 :) thx Fulvio for hint ! mostly I do join via IP . the moment I have to join my own server , I had to .
so (If you join by Igor you don't need to set anything on client as usual, only if you join direct IP you need to set core.ini parameters. ) was very important information to me


Title: Re: UKGPL Season 22 - Monaco 65 and Silverstone 67 - Ferrari Challenge - Jan 03
Post by: Cookie on January 04, 2012, 03:18:33 PM +0000
Great Nicky!

If Clive agrees:
Lets try your server ;)

I have this 6000 Internet by 1&1

I have set my server to 5/84 and 5/196 now for FC practice Kyalami  8)


Title: Re: UKGPL Season 22 - Monaco 65 and Silverstone 67 - Ferrari Challenge - Jan 03
Post by: Phil Thornton on January 04, 2012, 10:41:47 PM +0000
Firstly a big thanks to Axel for organizing this! 

The first race at Monaco was a bit of a disaster for me.  I arrived late and so had to start at the back of the grid.  When the flag dropped everyone disappeared and then it started raining Ferrari's.  Cars were appearing from everywhere.  When I did get going the field was pretty strung out so I couldn't tell if there was more or less warping.  When I did catch another car (and when I got lapped) the connection seemed pretty good and there was no discernable warp.  As far as car control was concerned, the steering was more precise and the braking more responsive.

The second race at Silverstone was much better.  The very tight grid resulted in me banging wheels with someone and I spun out shortly after the start.  However there wasn't any warp as far as I can remember.  If it hadn't been for the tight grid the start should have been pretty clean.  During the race the server was rock solid.  No warping and the cars were always visible (until I got left behind of course).  Again the car control was much improved.

Overall a good test for me but I suggest we need to do a few more tests before we consider running the 60fps patch for a league race.  Personally I think it is the way to go but we have to be sure. 

As far as I can ascertain the 60fps patch should (in theory) give us less warp contacts and (my experience so far confirms this) better car control.  Warp is the single most problematic issue in on-line racing as far as I'm concerned so anything that reduces it has to be worth investigating.  If the tests don't back up the theory then we'd have to decide if the extra complications with using the 60fps patch was worth the effort.

Good advice from Fulvio regarding the core.ini settings.  Particularly the bit about only having to change the client and server send rates from 3 to 5 for the client when connecting by IP.

However this is the bit that I don't quite understand about the 60fps patch.  The 384 is the bandwidth that sets the number of cars that you can see.  The 3 or 5 dictates how many ticks between the server or client sends,  i.e. the rate at which the server and client exchange data about the position of the cars.  To reduce warp we need better position data so surely we need less ticks between sends. 

According to Bart Westra (http://westrab.home.xs4all.nl/gplol2.htm#lat) "The time unit in GPL. 1 Tick = 1/36 seconds or ~27.778ms. When there are enough system resources, GPL displays a new frame every tick to give you 36 fps (frames per second)."

So using 5 with the 60fps patch means we have pretty much the same latency with the 60fps as we have with the standard 36fps.  So how is that going to help with the warp?



Title: Re: UKGPL Season 22 - Monaco 65 and Silverstone 67 - Ferrari Challenge - Jan 03
Post by: Hristo Itchov on January 04, 2012, 11:16:15 PM +0000
According to Bart Westra (http://westrab.home.xs4all.nl/gplol2.htm#lat) "The time unit in GPL. 1 Tick = 1/36 seconds or ~27.778ms. When there are enough system resources, GPL displays a new frame every tick to give you 36 fps (frames per second)."

So using 5 with the 60fps patch means we have pretty much the same latency with the 60fps as we have with the standard 36fps.  So how is that going to help with the warp?


Good point, it should produce the same kind of warp contacts as with 36 fps. Perhaps it's only less pronounced warp contacts when we run on setting 3 and 60 fps, but as we saw in these races, that requires less than 12-13 people on the server, at least on Axel's.


Title: Re: UKGPL Season 22 - Monaco 65 and Silverstone 67 - Ferrari Challenge - Jan 03
Post by: BadBlood on January 05, 2012, 01:44:59 AM +0000
I believe that part of the 60FPS patch is to make GPL reset the tick to 1/60th of a second.

We currently use send_every=3 so that give 12 updates a second. Using 5 with the 60fps would imply 5/60 of a second per update = 12. There is nothing to stop us trying other parameters but we are limited by bandwidth whatever we do so it is a case of finding a sweet spot.

I think when Cookie had it set to 3 he was trying to update 20 times a second - 4 would be 15 times a second. It may help with warp but lose with lag where frames are dropped. Case of suck it and see. I had noticeable 'wobble' at various points but connectivity has never been a big issue for me. The major effect of 60FPS is client side.



Title: Re: UKGPL Season 22 - Monaco 65 and Silverstone 67 - Ferrari Challenge - Jan 03
Post by: clouds on January 05, 2012, 09:48:13 AM +0000
Honestly speaking I've not noticed so much difference between 36 and 60fps in a stand alone stint, at least not so much like I was reading since the 1st exit of the 60fps patch. At monaco I had much warp and I've seen cars flashing in front of me while it has been not at Silverstone.


Title: Re: UKGPL Season 22 - Monaco 65 and Silverstone 67 - Ferrari Challenge - Jan 03
Post by: fpolicardi on January 05, 2012, 10:37:06 AM +0000
Both frequent ratio (3,4 or 5) and number of cars visible(132 for 8, 384 for all) have big impact on Upload bandwith of the server, while they have less impact on Download bandwith and more impact on CPU/GFX performance of clients.

I'll install 60fps patch on T7 server so we could test next race on T7 server that has a commercial 10/10 Mbs connection and see how things go with 3/XXX or 4/XXX settings. As we saw last race connection problems arised soon on the server in practice as clients went over 12/13 so we can easy adjust the settings in a little time.

Ciao


Title: Re: UKGPL Season 22 - Monaco 65 and Silverstone 67 - Ferrari Challenge - Jan 03
Post by: Cookie on January 05, 2012, 11:58:21 AM +0000
Thanks Fulvio for this offer!

I am not happy with the Monaco race inconvenience we all had,
but I am happy to have made this experience, because we learned a lot about this connection related stuff.

To me it seems that there are 2 different things intermingeled:

1. The 60 times per second updated collisionbox of the cars  <-> 2. the X times per second client - server updates

These 2 factors are independent and do not interfere!

@1 the 60fps collisionbox with its smaller peaks is less than the 36fps collisionbox, so you will have less warp and you can have closer fights!  


@2 The client-server update rate has an effect only to the server!
      In this "Monaco" case the traffic just was too high for my servers connection as it was nearly double upload Kb/s and download Kb/s!
      


Title: Re: UKGPL Season 22 - Monaco 65 and Silverstone 67 - Ferrari Challenge - Jan 03
Post by: Cookie on January 05, 2012, 01:52:07 PM +0000
Now I need your help to get the right Monaco results!

The problem is caused by a bug in GPL or the Monaco track!
Quote


RACE FASTEST LAPS

Pos Driver                                 Time Lap
 1  Alex Barresi                        12.606s   1
 2  Albrecht Kleinf65                   13.048s   1
 3   Pierre D                           17.211s   1
 4  Bernie65 Darwin                     20.833s   1
 5  Nigel Smith65                       20.906s   1
 6  Hristo Itchov65                   1m27.809s  16
 7  Bob Whitwell                      1m30.140s  14
 8  Mark75 Barresi                    1m30.918s  15
 9  Dave Rainier65                    1m31.451s  15
10  Sergio Lonzar 65                  1m31.696s  16
11  Skymole 2173 -m65                 1m31.753s  17
12  65 evilclive                      1m31.765s   3
13  Axel Cookie                       1m32.132s   2
14  Nicky Ickx65                      1m33.169s   6
15  Jason Blito                       1m33.222s  10
16  Phil Thornton65                   1m33.384s  14
17  Axel Cordt                        1m41.660s   4

RACE RESULTS (After 18 laps)

Pos No Driver                          Team     Nat Laps   Race Time       Diff
 1   6 Hristo Itchov65                 Ferrari  JPN   18  26m55.339s           
 2  10 Albrecht Kleinf65               Ferrari  GER   18  27m26.296s    30.957s
 3  14 Mark75 Barresi                  Ferrari  ITA   18  27m39.980s    44.641s
 4   9 Sergio Lonzar 65                Ferrari  ITA   18  28m22.605s  1m27.266s
 5   1 Skymole 2173 -m65               Ferrari  JPN   18  28m25.549s  1m30.210s
 6  16 Bernie65 Darwin                 Ferrari  GBR   18  28m33.436s  1m38.097s
 7  12 Dave Rainier65                  Ferrari  MON   17  27m06.571s   1 lap(s)
 8   8 Jason Blito                     Ferrari  GBR   17  27m43.281s   1 lap(s)
 9  17 Phil Thornton65                 Ferrari  GBR   17  28m02.005s   1 lap(s)
10  22  Pierre D                       Ferrari  CAN   17  28m10.252s   1 lap(s)
11   2 Bob Whitwell                    Ferrari  GBR   16  26m59.436s   2 lap(s)
12  11 Nigel Smith65                   Ferrari  GBR    9  13m44.613s   9 lap(s)
13   3 Axel Cookie                     Ferrari  GER    6   9m52.814s  12 lap(s)
14  21 Nicky Ickx65                    Ferrari  RSA    6   9m55.463s  12 lap(s)
15   4 Axel Cordt                      Ferrari  GER    4   7m59.003s  14 lap(s)
16   5 65 evilclive                    Ferrari  GBR    3   4m52.254s  15 lap(s)
17   7 Alex Barresi                    Ferrari  ITA    1     13.621s  17 lap(s)


- Hristo won it! no doubt :P
- Albrecht claims to have been only overtaken once, by Hristo!?
- Mark is your 3rd position correct?
- Sergio is your 4th position correct?
- Sky is your 5th position correct?
- Bernie is your 6th position correct?




Title: Re: UKGPL Season 22 - Monaco 65 and Silverstone 67 - Ferrari Challenge - Jan 03
Post by: s2173 on January 05, 2012, 02:53:24 PM +0000
Well, im not sure, but I believe so. I started slow, so several cars overtook me, but then at lap 1 carnage I believe I passed atleast 5 cars. After that I was still  10th, but in following laps I overtook the retiring (if im not mistaken) Nicky, Evil, Cookie, Alex Barresi. At lap two or three I noticed that Hristo is down to 6'st, but he was still 20 secs ahead of me, and after that he kept gaining positions. During almost the whole race I was following Bernie and Clouds,  eventually passing them when they made some mistakes, and getting to fourth possition. After that, with 4 laps to go, I clipped the wall at chicane and span, letting then back through. With 1 lap to go, clouds rearended bernie at the casino hairpin, and I passed bernie, finishing fifth after one lap.

Only time I was passed was when I span at the chicane, and I was never lapped, im sure of that. I did lap someone once, I think it was Blito....

My memory isnt too good, so I cant say things went exacly like that or that im sure about my possition... hovewer, if clouds and bernie's positions are corect, mine is too. We were allways close.

Tho, now when i think of it, it seems I should have lapped also Phil, Pierre, Bob and Rainer... And I dont remeber doing that. Maybe they were at pits at that time...  I, hovewer, was not lapped. These things cant go unnoticed on so tight track...


Title: Re: UKGPL Season 22 - Monaco 65 and Silverstone 67 - Ferrari Challenge - Jan 03
Post by: clouds on January 05, 2012, 04:00:55 PM +0000
Apart I didn't make the S&G after the reset for the heap at the very beginning of the race, I think my finish position should be correct but I didn't see the replay yet!


Title: Re: UKGPL Season 22 - Monaco 65 and Silverstone 67 - Ferrari Challenge - Jan 03
Post by: Hristo Itchov on January 05, 2012, 04:42:09 PM +0000
The fact that I was 6th on lap 2 or 3, with other cars still in my mirrors, means that at least the first 4-5 cars on the grid were dropped time-wise and were positioned wrongly. When we went on to overtake cars, we were in fact lapping them, not overtaking for position, even if GPL thought otherwise.


Title: Re: UKGPL Season 22 - Monaco 65 and Silverstone 67 - Ferrari Challenge - Jan 03
Post by: Cookie on January 05, 2012, 07:33:31 PM +0000
Yes you are right Hristo!

I see in the replay:

The 5 drivers

Alex
Albrecht
Pierre
Bernie
Nigel

were  set to lap 2 just after their crash after the finish line!
So I have to subtract one lap of them.


Title: Re: UKGPL Season 22 - Monaco 65 and Silverstone 67 - Ferrari Challenge - Jan 03
Post by: blito on January 05, 2012, 07:42:28 PM +0000
Sadly I had to miss the silverstone race - we had a powercut!


Title: Re: UKGPL Season 22 - Monaco 65 and Silverstone 67 - Ferrari Challenge - Jan 03
Post by: Cookie on January 05, 2012, 07:48:59 PM +0000
So this is what I get:

RACE RESULTS (After 18 laps)

Pos No Driver                          Team     Nat Laps   Race Time       Diff
 1   6 Hristo Itchov65           30      Ferrari  JPN   18  26m55.339s            
 2  14 Mark75 Barresi            25      Ferrari  ITA   18  27m39.980s    44.641s
 3   9 Sergio Lonzar 65          21      Ferrari  ITA   18  28m22.605s  1m27.266s
 4   1 Skymole 2173 -m65         18      Ferrari  JPN   18  28m25.549s  1m30.210s
 5  10 Albrecht Kleinf65         16      Ferrari  GER   17  
 6  12 Dave Rainier65            14      Ferrari  MON   17  27m06.571s   1 lap(s)
 7   8 Jason Blito               13      Ferrari  GBR   17  27m43.281s   1 lap(s)
 8  17 Phil Thornton65           12      Ferrari  GBR   17  28m02.005s   1 lap(s)
 9  16 Bernie65 Darwin           11      Ferrari  GBR   17  
10  22  Pierre D                 10      Ferrari  CAN   16  
11   2 Bob Whitwell               9      Ferrari  GBR   16  26m59.436s   2 lap(s)
12  11 Nigel Smith65              8      Ferrari  GBR    8  
13   3 Axel Cookie                7     Ferrari  GER    6   9m52.814s  12 lap(s)
14  21 Nicky Ickx65               6     Ferrari  RSA    6   9m55.463s  12 lap(s)
15   4 Axel Cordt                 5     Ferrari  GER    4   7m59.003s  14 lap(s)
16   5 65 evilclive               4     Ferrari  GBR    3   4m52.254s  15 lap(s)
17   7 Alex Barresi               3     Ferrari  ITA    1     13.621s  17 lap(s)


any comments?


Title: Re: UKGPL Season 22 - Monaco 65 and Silverstone 67 - Ferrari Challenge - Jan 03
Post by: BadBlood on January 06, 2012, 01:06:31 AM +0000
This is fairly easy to correct in LM2 Cookie - just go into Reference Data > Entries and you can make adjustments there. The difficult bit is ascertaining what the data should be!