SimRacing.org.uk

WELCOME to the UKGPL Season 23 - Porsche Super Cup - Race 4 

We celebrate our 3rd season with the attractive PSC Team Championship and I hope we will have fair, clean and close racing.
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The 4th race of this season will be at one of the most challenging tracks of GPL, Clermont Ferrand 65.


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We have the Rolling ZONE for the start where a moderate speed of maximum ~ 75 mph (125 kmh) is required and no overtaking is allowed. (Read the registration thread!)

Guidelines for rolling starts...

The car on pole will lead off the grid and maintain a steady pace for the "rolling zone" around 75 mph (125 kmh)
All drivers should form up in single file behind him leaving 3-4 car lengths between each car.
There is NO OVERTAKING on the "rolling zone".
It is the reponsibility of the lead car to ensure that all drivers are with him as he approaches the final "rolling zone" corner.
Racing and overtaking begin AFTER the exit of the last "rolling zone" corner.

(http://img641.imageshack.us/img641/8195/clermont.th.jpg) (http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/641/clermont.jpg/)

Any driver who loses his position in the "rolling zone", by going off or through contact with another car ( regardless of fault) must rejoin at the back of the field.
Incidents on the "rolling zone" will be fully modded and anyone found to have caused another competitor to lose position through bad driving will be penalised appropriately.
Also, please make sure that you know which car you should be following on the "rolling zone", so that you do NOT get out of position.
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There will be full moderation of lap one Red Zone and reported incidents for the rest of the race.

Please submit incident reports within a week after the race so that the moderators report may be out before the next race.
Full time team drivers have priority access to the server.
Driver lists can be found on the Porsche Super Cup (https://www.simracing.org.uk/smf/index.php?action=LM2R&group=369&theme=6) championship standings page.
Please restrict your chat to a minimum!

Race List	=	IGOR
Chat room	=	#UKGPL
Server	=	UKGPL_8
IP Address	=	TBA
Race date	=	14-09-2012
Qualification Time	=	30-45 mins ~20:45  UK time
Race Time	=	race starts at 21:30 UK time
Track	=	Clermont Ferrand 65  clermont (http://srmz.net/index.php?showtopic=921&st=0&p=6104&#entry6104)
Variant	=	GT -> Porsche 910
Damage Model	=	PRO
Race length	=	~50 min -> 16 laps
RED ZONE	=	full first lap->finish line
Rolling ZONE	=	from the start to the end of Le Belvedere hairpin
Password	=	see above (#post_event_password)
Replay	=	you will get here (ftp://ukgpl3.dyndns.org/replays/Archive/Season23/PorscheSuperCup/)

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There are more than 19 drivers registered, so the full time team drivers have the priority!
The R1 drivers have to leave the track for ~5 min with 30 min practice left to let waiting FT team drivers join!
Drivers with no team may join if there are spaces left after 21:05 UK time
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It was impossible to form complete teams for all the registered drivers, due to the missing novices, so I let all teams race as they are:

Porsche Cup teams as they stand at 26/06/2012

  Team Squadra Padova Corse
  1. Piero Mercaldo (FT)
  2. Marco Mercaldo (FT)
  3. Smudge (FT)

  Team Shadows
  1. Sergio Lonzar (FT)
  2. Axel Cookie (FT)
  3. G.Giovani (FT)

  Team 7Porsche7
  1. Alex Barresi (FT)
  2. Pedro van den Berg (FT)
  3. Francesco Molteni (FT)

  Team Makikas
  1. Mark Barresi (FT)
  2. Ronnie Petterson (FT)
  3. Stefano62 (FT)

  Team Pulse Racing
  1. Ron Clegg (FT)
  2. Nicky Ickx (FT)
  3. XXX

  Team Hiki Waza
  1. Hristo Itchov (R1)
  2. Paul Bird (R1)
  3. Paul Badblood (R1)

 Team LOL Racing
  1. Tristan Bot (FT)
  2. Max Lenclen (R1)
  3. XXX

  Team 7 Racing
  1. Fulvio Policardi (FT)
  2. Skymole (R1)
  3. XXX

  no team yet

   natan5 (FT) Pro
   EvilClive (FT) Pro
   Jason Blito (R1) Nov

hi :)
 after 1 dns and 2 disco , Iwill try it again :)

for those who like "andurance" ,the HSO ( Historic Simracing Organisation  ) make the 3 hours of Kyalami sunday 16 september ...... join us !

Afraid I wont be at this race...............I'll be at Goodwood Revival  ;D

Me too  ;D

Oh no.......................................... And I tink I wont be home intime :( :( :(

Hi all,
I have to announce that wrinkleydms retired, I waited hoping he say here but since he didn't, I do.
Please, let me know if I need to change its status from LM2 or is it enough to make known to race direction from here.

Thanks

Its sad, but I've got it.

Our Novice driver seems to have retired too...

I know it is too much difficult manage a 3 drivers team when sometimes is difficult to have only 2 out of 3 present at the same event.
2 with a reserve driver should be easier keeping the rule 3 <= X <= 5 with 3 Pro, 2 Ama, 1 Nov.

I would not like see the server only half filled like often happens in mod65 or 67 or GT. PSC still remains the easier challenge based on drivers abilities and not on car performance.

The real enemy here for me, is the lack of time spent in practice that discourages the novices and...not only those.  :P.

Hmmmm. Got back from Goodwood just in time.

Thin grid... :( Everyone fell off, I got third. Not sure what happened when Hristo went past as I virtually parked up and he and Piero went past and H seemed to spin. Piero than span in front of me about a quarter of a km away and then he disappeared.

Then Axel disappeared and Nicky went so I just had to do 8 laps or so for third. Gave up then. My fastest lap of 3:50 plus wasn't exactly competitive either!

I've got a huge freeze and engine sound got high and high and high...!!! I was in 5th place...at least I think !

 :(  I got a screen freeze , without warning ,anything was fine fps , no warping , no nothing . pitty  was P4 that time .

windows 7 told me Ati display driver stopped working thatwhy gplcgt.exe couldnt cummunicated anymore with windows .
hell , I am clueless what the prob is and how it could be fixed , any help highly apriciated .

And the result is: 1 out of 7 remained and...with damaged engine ! What a result !
I think that with fewer than 50% of participants, the race could be postponed at the end of championship :P

Congrats to the podium !

Never seen a race lost cause of engine failure at few meters from the finish line !!!  For lack of gasoline yes but for engine failure never :P

Maybe also Tristan got another DISCO or FREEZE !  :P

Maybe this server should be tested better before than other guys may loose patience.

During the previous race Axel and Hristo had a disco almost at the same time, and this time me and Tristan we have had the same problem almost at the same time. It seems strange that this server has a couple of problems that strike almost at the same time.

I have had to reset my PC because of freeze, and after that, I have seen myself still connected to the iGOR list of drivers still racing  :o ??? :P
Could it be that my connection fell down but the server was not involved in this action ?

Take a check please.

Thanks

To make it clear, my "discos" at Zolder67 and Clermont were an engine failure and I think Hristo had the same.
Maybe the pro mode makes these reliable cars more vulnerable.

The server is my own UKGPL_8 and it also runs the 65s Pro series.
It hosted the fun races in the last breaks with 69X and F2.
It has lots of reserve power and RAM, so no problem on this side.
My connection is stable DSL and should have no problem hosting a race.
In the last seasons we used the T7_2 server, I changed it after some complaints... 

Freezes are AFAIK problems with the clients PC!

As for a re-run, my podium finishes are too rare for me to willingly give one up!

What I've said is just meant to have an idea on how to behave in the forthcoming events LOL but actually is only an opinion.

So Axel do you think a freeze or a ctd pertains only the client side ? Probably you're right but...who will say this to Tristan ?  :P

Yes, you and Hristo have had two engine failure at Zolder but what is strange is...they were syncronized the same as me and Tristan on Friday !?!?!

There are two main causes of disconnects - client/server mismatch and this is almost always the client as the client reacts badly to not getting an update. If it is server side then the server can lose track of the driver but usually there is not a disconnect. The other main reason for a disco is that the track has a problem.

Either way, discos caused by the server are rare.

Talking about the track that in particular I like (even if I have not mastered it adequately) this is the same way of saltzburgring where I had strange behaviours with my Porsche, the worst of all was the brake bug and honestly I actually still don't know why some drivers have had this problem and others had not. It is frustrating to see that the brake bug begins with the 1st sector of the airpin (and it have to be banked) and it ends when wheels returns to the flat straight.
Definately the brake bug consist of an unwanted brake that blocks the front train leading you outside a hander along the tangent line and no matter if you brake for slowing down the car. It is like to have the hand brake pulled but functioning only on the front wheels.

 :( only thing I can say ; I havnt had freezes till I upgraded my PC .
unluckily I did hardware&software wise , so hard to extract whats the prob could be .

Win7 64bit failure report says : ati fuel.services.exe caused the freeze .
But google search for that let ya get lost in universe of `could be , but who knows exactly `  ;D

well I will check if changing back to older 12.1 driver ( 12.6. atm , which is the newest out for outdated 4870 ATI videocard ) , will have any positive effect .


... but could be an windows or hardware issue instead ... so guees I am at the very beginning of an never ending journey  :(

 >:(....Hi folks....
....hum ! I'm affraid it was my last Porsche race .....one more disco after 2 laps ....it's too mutch for me !!( it's make 3/3 ! ) ....it's realy sad but I can't loose any more time  for that champ....Idon't know from where come the problèm, but one thing I know ,it's append only here !!....Imake yet this saison 20 races in the french ligue and only one disco....10 races in Belgium ligue = 0 disco....last sunday I make the 3 h of kyalami on HSO, and I brock the engine after 2h30 racing whith the Porsche ....in the UK F2 Champ s23, I make 2 races = 2 disco ......Porsche cup , 3 starts = 3 disco !!......at the moment , the 65 mods  work very good , I got 4 starts ....and 4 finishs  :o .....I hope this good serie will continu .......
...I will try ( last time ) again the F2 at Silver tomorrow ......

....see you guys  :P

Strange. The server you run the 65's on is the same as the Porsche. I wonder if there is a problem to do with Friday evenings (scheduled maintenance or something) as both the F2 and Porsche are Fridays.

Shame though.

If I can give my humble suggestion, it is not said that a server that work well with F2 or 67 or 69 have to be the same for GT or, in near future, for Can-Am.
The latter two mod are very demanding in terms of frame rate due to high polygons number and geometric complexity of cars models.
The way GPL use to exchange net info in its client-server model, it is quite credible that decreasing fps could cause degeneration of the connection process.
In past time similar problems had arisen even for a too large timing differences between clients, in that case the too large difference between delays results on large fps drop and/or discos.
I know that this could seem strange but one of the best tech in GPL was it's net-code and the way it was tied to the client-server process, same time this is a real bottleneck in many cases.

Understood but the server doesn't have to render all the graphics. It simply keeps track of the relative positions and returns those to the client. My UKGPL3 server is extremely poor in terms of its graphic capabilities but has run many GT races flawlessly. The most critical factor in all of this is the quality of the connection between client and server and as more and more of the internet gets bogged down with YouTube that connection is vulnerable. If a server is in London and the clients are in Italy, France and the UK it is entirely possible for the UK clients to be rock solid and have the French/Italian clients diconnect. The quality of connection between computers remains the biggest impediment

Pardon me BadBlood, but there's no connection between a pc graphics capabilities and fps in GPL, poligons in GPL depends only on CPU and the relation between this and net code is due to the 1 / (fps) comunication rate hardcoded into GPL, so, not only car models are related to but even on track polygons and net efficiency.

Roberto this PC I use as an exclusive server is an Athlon ll X2 250 @ 3000 MHz and 4GB RAM.
It has no problems with GT mod serving even in 60fps -> Dec 27th 2011 it ran the Ferrari Challenge with 16x 330/P4 without problem!

IMO its more related to track and connection issues

Of course the graphics card makes a difference! Try it with a slower card without changing the cpu and you'll see. Even though CPU matters more in GPL than other games, it doesn't mean it's all that matters. GPL still uses hardware video acceleration via its D3D/OpenGL rasterizer, at DX6-DX7 level.

Is there any low res Clermont Ferrand track to try ? I'm starting to think there are some tracks that are dangerous for some of us.

Have you tried Ginettos fix? ->http://srmz.net/index.php?showtopic=2734

I don't say that GPL don't use graphics card, I've said that polygons are calculated from CPU, I know well that polys are filled by graphics card and this could arise other kind of problems.

What I want to focus is that in GPL:

1. Polys calc is tied to CPU.
2. Polys fill are tied to GPU.
3. Frame rate are tied to polys draw.
4. Net code are tied to frame rate.

So all are tied one to the others and when one hold back all the other suffer and is well known that GT and now Can-Am is very polys intensive.

Other trouble could happen using some modern, related to the age of GPL, graphics driver, DX7 (the latest DX usable by GPL with D3D patch) is emulated or wrapped by graph drivers, and this could be an hard wall hit.
It's well know that ATI had (and have) some problem to build a good OpenGL driver, same way Nvidia have similar issue in develop D3D driver.

I guess you understand it much better than me then.  :D

It really depends on the PC configuration. I haven't had screen freeze problems with this machine since I bought it, and it's not that powerful of a PC, I still have to reduce some details for the heavier mods like GT or 69x. Apart from tracks that are well know to cause screen freeze, it's been OK for more than a year that I've been using it.

Do you know for a fact that Net code is tied to frame rate? I have not disconnected when I have had frame rates of 6! The server will send out the updates at 36/sec regardless of the client frame rate. The conversation with the server is based on the Client net-send. If this is tied to frame rate (which I am unsure of - bad decision if so) then the server may well disconnect the client because of a lack of timely response but I am fairly sure that the biggest component in this is the pipe between client and server (e.g. Internet) and this pipe can and does fail.

This confirm my words in the best way

I believe that is the intention Roberto but the net-send is, I believe, defined in theoretical maximum fps. I am happy for somebody to correct me.

In GPL engine there's an internal clock tied to fps so others parameter that influence the capabilities to mantain a steady fps influence the others as said.

I never sustained that the problem is the server, I try to explain that if a gpl server do a good job with a mod that don't give warrant to other mods.

Try to follow me, if you are running at a full 36 fps and have a send_every = 3 you archieve a net_send every 83 ms, going at 6 fps you got a net_send every 500 ms or half a second, so, theoretically or pratically nothing change, you archieve a bad result anyway.

And to examine network related troubles it's a lot simplier than CPU/GPU, what ruine GPL performance are latency, so don't use wireless, kill others program or hardware that use same network line used to race, optimize GPL details to reduce weight on CPU, GPU and network.

Facing to address a problem I don't care to discuss other's belives and have less than zero desire to correct anyone but only try to contribuite in find solutions.

Ah OK. So it is actually tied to it. Thanks.

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