SimRacing.org.uk

UKGPL Season 24 Graduates Trophy for Privateers
Race 4 Albi

The fourth round of the season finds us in France and the short but tricky airfield track at Albi. Circuit d’Albi is 2.2 miles long and is one of the oldest permanent race venues in the world, having been in operation for more than 70 years.

We will run Intermediate Damage with the allowance of ONE shift-R reset. No Shift-Rs are allowed in practice unless authorized by the moderator. A Shift-R (fault or not) MUST be followed by a Stop & Go. A Shift-R for tyres/fuel is not allowed. Any driver taking more then ONE Shift-R OR failing to take a Stop & Go will be disqualified from the race result.

Race List = IGOR
Server = UKGPL_T7_2
IP address = 62.149.202.168
Race date = 24-02-2013
Race Time = race starts at 21:30 UK time
Qualifying Time = Between 30 and 60 minutes, starting no later than 21:00 UK time
Track = Albi (http://a.bosco.free.fr/gpl/gpl.htm)
Variant = 67F1
Damage Model = INT
Race length = 50 minutes (laps 42)
Password: see above (#post_event_password)

Replays Available here (http://ukgpl3.dyndns.org/inc_replaysS24_js.aspx)

Driver lists and token rules can be found on the championship standings page (https://www.simracing.org.uk/smf/index.php?action=LM2R&group=388&theme=6)

The track can be downloaded from the link in the race list above.


The full time drivers can start to practice as soon as the server is available.  Reserve drivers can also join as soon as the server becomes available but must leave the server with 35 minutes of qualifying left, for a total of 5 minutes; this will allow any remaining full timers to join.  If there is enough space on the grid, the reserve drivers will be able to rejoin when there are 30 mins of qualifying left.  

Moderating The red zone will be fully moderated for lap 1 only. For this event the red zone will be the full lap. Other moderation will be on reported incidents only.  However any incidents that occur in the red zone that are not reported by the drivers will be reported by the moderator.  This will allow all affected drivers the opportunity to present their case before the incident is moderated.  This should ensure there are no surprises when the moderator's report is published and hence appeals will be less likely.  If you haven't received a PM about an incident before the link below the results table is removed, you can be sure that you will not appear in the moderator's report.

The chassis token system is explained on the Privateers (https://www.simracing.org.uk/smf/index.php?action=LM2R&group=388&theme=6) standings page. Please ensure you choose a chassis that is within your budget, which can be seen by hovering the mouse over your points total in the standings.

Please restrict chat to pit messages including at the end of the race until ALL drivers still racing have crossed the line.

Finding it pretty hard to get a Honda setup that suits me. I can do a high 1:13 which is marginally un-embarrassing but I can't manage it two laps in a row... Mind you, better than before I practised when I couldn't go as fast as in the 65's... I like Albi but it is going to be murder in the 67's...

T7 server is set for 42 laps Long race and listening on Igor in  consolle session.
Ciao

Great. Didn't do any practice on what is possibly my favourite little track and managed to not only be slow but then blow my engine on about lap 3. Bugger.

I really must get out of the habit of pressing ESC instead of S+R :-[

Ran out of fuel again. Set it to +5 laps, but ran out with 1 lap still. It must be something with this GPL installation, never happens on my other machine. Also, when I copy over the setup files they sometimes won't work on this installation.

Grats podium, sorry Billy :)

What a sickener , had a bout of that myself at one time  ::)

Cant help with the fuel except tell you to buy more .

Try re naming the set up files GEM is a bit fussy in that area

<hazy memory>
I've had something similar in the past, where I had to add probably an additional 15%+ of fuel.  I think I ended up re-installing (related to a whole bunch of issues) & the issue went away. 

I have a feeling the fuel issue may have cropped up after installing 1.3 patch,  but of course that may not have been relevant at all...
As for the setups,   is that incompatabilities between offline/online?    Again, I've had issues in the past where I've modified a setup (someone else's obviously!)  & tested with it ok,  then unable to use when either on/offline - I forget which way round it was.   May have been due to differences between versions of gpl.exe & gplc.exe (is that the one?) & the swapping that takes place.  Again, I think that was post-v1.3,  but GPL was generally getting more & more shot at the time.
</hazy memory>

Wondered what had happened to you Michael.

Bad luck James.

I too ran out of fuel. I had set to 42 laps and felt that with being lapped two or three times it would be enough. I was pretty sure I would have to reset. For once I didn't and only lasted 35 laps!

Up until then I had some nice dices with Nigel, Billy, Dave, Fabio and Tintin. All of them were very fair - hope I was.

Great fun and the first time I had matched Dave C on the road. Super disappointed to run out of fuel.

Start was terrible though boys. SLOW DOWN! Part of me breathed a sigh of relief as I got away with being rear ended twice and then flipped into the air and I hit somebody who span in front of me. Part of me thought - "Oh dear. Big Red Zone mod..."

I'm looking now, and I am pretty sure I wasn't naughty for once!

I enter the race with quite bad feelings about it and get ferrari just in spite of all - I have never finished a race with ferrari... the setup feels good, certainly, and I do a fastest lap and a pb. I try out some laps with full fuel load...all seems ok.

Then the starting grid. Florian, also with ferrari, has better start than me, passes me, than promptly spins infront of my nose on turn one - I have no way to avoid him. For a change my ferrari doesnt do an acrobatic showcase and doesn't explode like a unguided missile, so i continue on in still rather cheery mood, my seventh spot soon becomes third, as other cars fly off the track, poor victims of the cruel Inertia. Dean Logan is on first place, as after his rather unimpressive qualifying time he is suddenly doing pb after pb, and the distance to him is getting larger and larger, while I'm involved in rather fun battle with Bernie, who is also suprisingly fast. I guess I was the only one who didn't put turbocharger on the car before the race...

After that Bernie crashes at the dreaded aerodrome corner, the fun part ends and the nighmare begins... as several laps later, the backmarkers appear. Some clear the way (and crash in the bushes) but Geoff does a rather wierd stunt and manages to lose control while going perfectly straight, which to the untrained eye (mine) looks like he is giving me way. Then he spins completely and we end up behind the aerodrome corner fence with entangled limbs. Fortunately our clothes are on, so it doesnt look completely inappropriate, just abit.

None passes me, so i crawl out of the fence and continue on. The ferrari is battered, unhappy and sour. Im not too happy neither, but trying to keep the capricious car in check makes me focus better and even post the best lap of my race. The lap is not a good one tho, and the fact that the steering isnt working completely right might explain it.

I keep going like that suprisingly long time. In the meantime I have a bit of quarrel with Tintin, who is a backmarker, but decides to not let me through at the straght, but to race me into the Parc turn. His intentions are good, unfortunately his connection decides to have an epileptic seazure exactly in the same moment. I grind to a halt truyng to avoid his car, which manages to be at two places at once.

After some more laps I finally give up to the unbeareable temptation and crash out in the same damn aerodrome corner.  Then I am forced to do shift'r, which is extremely humiliating to my pride, and on top of that stop and go, which is against all my moral principles. After all that I come out extremely frustrated, and my idiotic driving turns into the driving of a raving drunk drugged madman. Despite that, after some more spins and lost spots I manage to finish.

My personal opinion tho is that I still havent been able to finish a race with ferrari - that race shouldnt count because of the shift'r, because of the deep dissatisfaction i ended the race with, because of my own stupdity and the stupidity of others, and because I dont like airfield tracks. :P

As good as can be expected. Managed to crack the 1.12's in quallifying with a PB(OK, it's the only lap I have ever done below 1.13).
Having raced here a few times before I know that it is a track prone to spins. Even though I can't compete on speed with the front runners a mid-table finish is possible by staying on track. After the fast guys had caught up from the T1 incident I spent most of the race sandwiched between Fran & Hendy. Paul joined in for a few laps - showing good pace in a Honda. Fran was consistent & built up a minor lead, Hendy was much quicker but had a few spins in the BRM. He finally reeled me in about 38 & made a good pass, unfortunately we clipped wheels in the penultimate corner. Hendy had almost full overlap so I can't complain & I was gifted 8th place when he ran out of fuel on the laps lap (very bad luck).
Awared for best race report goes to Sky.
Next stop Imola - excellent track. I don't think I have driven there in a '67 car , so Tamborella should be fun!

Lucky 4th place mostly due to others misfortunes , was hoping for a top 6 finish but didnt have to work to hard for it , I was gifted a flooky 2nd place soon after the dust had settled at landing strip corner but it didnt take long for the jet pilots to catch up with my old fokker  ;)  Then I got  into a steady race rythm with a speed that I could maintain with ease but then Sky came on strong from behind , not wanting to seem anti social but I thought it might be a good idea to keep him at arms length , he already outbraked me once earlier in the race so the only way for me to go faster and keep him where he belonged was for me to brake later into the braking zone , I was just starting to think how good I was doing when I overcooked it into the infamous bend , once he was through thought that was it but kept pressing as much as I could , on the penultimate lap I passed his recovering fezzer , felt really sorry escpecially after learning he had a faulty car , but what can you do in the circumstance , have to admit i did allow a little smiley  :)

Grats to rocket powered Dean , Florian & Axel commiserations to soggy team mate Micheal ( ya dozy git  ;D ) well done all survivers , hard luck those who went home early  :)

First off: sorry to Axel for T1. I knew you were there, and tried to leave room, but it's hard with these beasts on cold tires. :(

Managed to thread the needle between spinning Ferraris ahead, built a gap as others recovered, and was a fairly uneventful race from there on in.

As for the lapped traffic: watching the replay, most of the time I just managed to approach people at really inconvenient times. There was only once that someone really shouldn't have done what they did (and an incident report has been filed). Otherwise, pretty good job all around (the swearing coming from my cockpit? just heat of the moment, nvm, nothing to see here, move along).

Now do I spend the tokens for a Ferrari at Imola? Oh, heck, yeah! V12 baby! POWAAAHH!! ;D

Sorry mate just looked at the replay and dont see anything wrong with my driving , suggest you look again , Its plain to see  I "gave " you the corner , unless you really think its neccesary for me to pull into the lay by to let you through I really dont see what your gripe is .

not as if you were racing anyone but yourself and you had all the time in the world plus the speed to pass me down the straight .

jeez some folk are never happy , what do you want blood  ::)

Seriously? Outbraking me into Double Droit (after I'd pulled up alongside) and then cutting across my nose is your definition of "giving" me the corner?

(http://i1025.photobucket.com/albums/y314/Didymus_Much/bernielap37_zpsfa75dfae.jpg)

How am I supposed to have "the speed down the straight" when we're in the same car?

Sorry s2173 for the feared situation and lost seconds. At the beginning, I thought you 'll pass during the straight line. Sorry for my poor connection.

The race was very hard.
I was too slow with MY Honda (what idea keeping this car here !? )
Good start but great confusion after N. Smith pushed H.Nico, i had just passed before that ; The "catapulted H.Nico." was impressive; In the meantime , D. Curtis must avoid the ahead drivers, which became very slow due  to another confusion ahead, i guess. I used a similar line as Dave C. in order to avoid these drivers, but Dave decreased abruptly his speed and i pushed him; so, new spin, and new multiple contacts...

If not,  good fun to try to follow Paul W. during numerous laps. a pity : a hot crash with Paul in front of the pitlane when he crossed the road after a "Z" like Zorro !!!  :D . Lucky: no dammage for us !!
A big fear :o with Nigel which overtook me at the end of a braking zone, while Dave C. was already engaged to pass me. I left a great opened door to avoid any problem with Dave and this infiltration between us seems me very unexpected, dangerous, foolish and unnecessary : Nigel went out of the corner due to this obvious overspeed.

Sad to see Geoff had a very good qualification time but can't have a good race here :'(. Hope for you the blue sky will arrive soon  :scooter:
 

 

    

Not from where i was sat in the car please have a look at my view , a totally different view . You would have had the speed because of the tow , you pass me and then choose to back off into the corner , I cant see you there I was doing normal braking , there was room inside the corner , there are other people are racing here , we had just passed Florian ? he had made a mistake and recovered , I saw  a brabham in my mirror But whose ? , you or flo's who I am racing ? take a look at a few laps before this when you pass Andreas ? the same corner the same circumstance , suppose he was at fault for failing to yield as well  , but no worries , maybe we should all take a tea break while you have the track to yourself .
Sorry if this sounds off hand but i do not see your gripe when you have the race in your pocket , no competition , 2 secs a lap faster than the ones you are lapping and "you " have the choice of where to pass , even if you stayed behind for another lap or more you would still have won  by a country mile . Sorry if you think I tried to outbrake you , but that is not the case but admit I didnt want to slow because strange as it may seem I was racing too , it was your choice to pass in the worst corner possible the next straight would have been fine
Again I just dont see why you make an issue of this and I cant see what i did wrong .

I can see what you did wrong... you're quoting the wrong comment.


No problem, Tintin... Its good to remember that if youre not in direct combat for positions yourself, its often better to slow down a bit so lappers can pass safely, much less drama that way... Youre doing rather well othervise and you seem to finish most of your races, which cant be said about me.

Of course I've "backed off", I have this lapper who should have been braking early to let me through (as he was pretty much by himself on the track, not in any kind of fight for position), but instead is challenging me into Double Droit.


But you know it's safe to turn in, HOW?


So was I (watch my other laps, I braked at the same point every time) UNTIL I saw you challenging me.


Yes, I know there was room. It's called "grass". I'd rather not be forced to use it.


It was Fabio, who was going two laps down at that point. Not racing either of us for position, so he didn't race us.


Maybe it's the same one that's been in your mirrors for the last four corners?


Not at all. I was nowhere near him at the entry, but he still slowed and pulled over.


If I wanted that, I'd just go hotlapping.


And any minor contact (added to GPL's fantastic collision physics), followed by a shift-r once the car stops flying around, and the stop-and-go (even if I don't get discoed which is much more likely if I've got damage), suddenly it's not so "in my pocket" anymore.


You DON'T have the choice, is my point. If you're holding up someone who's trying to lap you, however minimally, you are in the wrong.


Irrelevant. See above.


Who were you "racing"? Sky, who was two corners ahead of you, or Andreas, who was even further behind you?


Now I'm controlling where I come up to you, which means that I'm controlling not only my car, but yours as well. Yeah, that makes perfect sense.


IT'S NOT UP TO YOU.


Well, maybe the moderator can help with that.

molehills and mountains ?

Well, that was not as enjoyable as I hoped.

Not been here before in the 67's (first time was for the '65 race fairly recently) but luckily the few corners still go the same way.  Still, it's not like there is any setup work to be done.  For me, in the Kyalami vs. Mosport stakes - Mosport won again.

Unfortunately, in the closing moments of qually I ventured out again to try a feel of approaching T1/2 with stiff tyres & full tanks.   Where the sound suddenly was very choppy/extreme echo.  Tried a reset by no difference.  No time to leave/rejoin & unfortunately that is how the race was run too - with useless sound,  which is probably a first with this aging machine.

It also seemed that Prib was having difficulties telling the truth.  Seemed to be changing it's mind at times as to who/where the cars around me were.   Cars were flicking behind/ahead/behind & there just seemed to be some uncertaintly/downright lies at times.

Had a few fun/close runnings around the place.   I must admit,  the non-tangle round at the double-droit area is a moment of not exactly comedy gold,  but just a little surprising that there was no resulting pile-up!

Pushing at the end to try to catch Tintin with the slim hope of sneaking that 10th place,  but too far up the road in the end.

From looking at the GPLRA data,  maybe I should have just reset after the 1st couple of turns.  I thought I had bent a couple of the car's corners, but was not aware of the really early engine problem  (I was when it finally let go near the end though!).  Wondered why top speed was down,   but just assumed it was due to all that fuel.


Still, I was otherwise looking forward to the Sunday drive - so that mission at least accomplished.

Cheers lads.
Dave.

Dean, this is Privateers for a reason...the drivers in this class are not all expert and make mistakes in the heat of battle. Your total race time would have seen you a clear second and the only driver NOT to be lapped in Works by John Bradbury....Perhaps works may be a better option for you? Just a suggestion.
Geoff.


Edit: And at least top 4 in Qually..... ;D

To add a bit of perspective to Geoff's words

I encountered Logan on the server couple hours before the race and he was massively faster in the same car, no way i could race him. And i had a decent pace in works, would've finished 4th without disco.

I bet it would be much more fun for Logan in Works and to Bernie here if he switched  ;)

Didn't see the replay, am not suggesting that situation was anyone's fault.

We do tend to be more a bunch of friendly gentlemen racers in Privateers.  It's supposed to be a learning ground for future champions.  you've a champions attitude, and the speed to go with it Dean. :o

Enough debate I think.

We pride ourselves on being competitive but friendly. Let's make sure we keep it that way. OK?

Works is definitely an option (for NEXT season). I joined Privateers because I've never raced the 67F1s in a league, and looking at the Watkins Glen qualifying times, I figured I'd have a chance of winning the occasional race (in Privateers) if I could get my consistency up to a good level. Anyone who thinks I don't make mistakes hasn't watched my replays (and missed the Zeltweg race completely).

If outright pace is the criterion, then there is one here who should be making the transfer well ahead of me, and at least two others who should be "bumped" at the same time, if not before. If it's results we're looking at, same situation.

"A learning ground for future champions" should include how to safely deal with traffic lapping you, IMO. Watching how more advanced drivers do it is the best way to learn how to do it yourself when the time comes.

Yes Dean, I am in nearly the same situation.
I sneaked into 67s the last season, as I never before had raced them seriously.
I have learned to make setups that suit my driving and so I can do some pretty fast laps, but I am far away from being consistent.
Just take the GPLRA and look into Race History Graph  ::)

BTW Dean, our T1 was a 50:50 RI IMO  ;)
Seems we have to practice more some side by side corners, like we did in Monza with the GT's ;D

 
[/quote]

...take a look at a few laps before this when you pass Andreas ? the same corner the same circumstance , suppose he was at fault for failing to yield as well  , ...

[/quote]

Ja, I saw the leader coming. Pull to the outside, slowed down. Let the leader pass and step on the gas again. That´s it.

Grats to the podium and all finishers.

So long
Andreas

Maybe it's cultural differences, my IQ, EQ or assQ but i really honestly do not understand why do you say enough debate at this point?


I remember in my first stint here other admins being debate unfriendly. I find that very unhealthy.

Open and civilized debate is good for healthy relationships. Keeping mouth shut and behind closed doors decisions are not.


For evidence, see Logan's last post in A Debate. His post sensibly explains it all and it's a natural end of the debate.

The problem with looking at the Works laptimes is the quick guys are really quick so you can get a rather warped view of things just looking at those headline times. Aside from those aliens, the vast majority of Works runners are not insanely fast & do make plenty of mistakes. If joining a division in order to win was the goal, most of us would be very frustrated... I've been in Works since season 19 & managed 2 wins (that's 1 win every 2.5 seasons :-\ ) but there are plenty of guys better than me who haven't won any races during that same period. Battles further down the field against someone equally-matched can be every bit as exciting though.         

I specifically meant the debate regarding Dean and Bernie's movement on Lap 37. Dean's later post is, as you say, sensible but it isn't part of the debate about that particular part of the race.

When people are just re-stating their positions as was starting to happen it can quickly descend into a less than friendly argument. The forums aren't for arguments or point scoring. Just want to concentrate minds. If I was really censorious I'd just delete all your posts. I have had to do that once only and I don't want to go there again.

This was generally fine but things posted in haste can come across as uncivil.

Absolutly agree with your post. Thx for patience and clarification.
 :)

Racing in the midfield you always get involved in close battles. Frontrunners and backmarkers have much more lonely existence on average.

Stats below from Albi qualy should not be taken literally. For example, with all due respect i know that Fulvio is significantly above Fabio as a complete racer. Also there are different cars to account for. But still absolute top 6 is interesting  ::)

Letter on the left means p(rivateer) or w(orks).

Just dont get all worked up, i'm just trying to be creative  ;)

1   1  11  J_Bradbury                      Brabham  GBR 1m09.391s             20   w 2    2  17 Ronnie Peterson                  Eagle    ITA 1m10.606s   01.215s   27   w 3    1  14 Skymole 2173-j                   Ferrari  JPN 1m10.787s             21   p 4    2  17 Florian Gebhardt                 Ferrari  GER 1m10.912s   00.125s   23   p 5    3  16 Dean Logan                       Brabham  CAN 1m11.020s   00.233s   22   p 6    4   9 Axel Cookie                      Brabham  GER 1m11.054s   00.267s   25   p 7    3  15 Arf Arf-Arf                      Brabham  GBR 1m11.312s   01.921s   20   w 8    4   3 Bartosz Antoszczyszy             Brabham  MON 1m11.327s   01.936s   18   w 9    5   6 Andrew Livingston                Ferrari  GBR 1m11.733s   02.342s   17   w 10    6  16 Attilio Artiglietti              BRM      ITA 1m11.876s   02.485s   19   w 11    7  10 65 evilclive                     Cooper   GBR 1m11.939s   02.548s   16   w 12    8  14  Doni67                          BRM      CAN 1m12.029s   02.638s   16   w 13    9   2 Jethro Walters                   Honda    GBR 1m12.218s   02.827s   15   w 14   10   8 Al Heller67                      BRM      GBR 1m12.227s   02.836s   27   w 15   14  19 Ivan Djjodjjo                    Brabham  URU 1m21.808s   12.417s    1   w 16    5  19 Fabio Locarno                    Brabham  ITA 1m12.319s   01.532s   31   p 17    6  13 Geoff Heard67                    BRM      AUS 1m12.519s   01.732s   17   p 18   11  12 Fulvio Policardi                 Cooper   ITA 1m12.620s   03.229s    8   w 19    7  18 Bernie Darwin                    Brabham  GBR 1m12.637s   01.850s   31   p 20    8   8 Andreas Gebhardt                 Brabham  GER 1m12.674s   01.887s   19   p 21    9   1 Billy Nobrakes67                 Brabham  GBR 1m12.833s   02.046s   10   p 22   10  12 Dave Curtis                      Brabham  GBR 1m13.035s   02.248s   16   p 23   11   6 Hendy Nichols                    BRM      USA 1m13.389s   02.602s   16   p 24   12  11 Nigel Smith                      Brabham  GBR 1m13.460s   02.673s   21   p 25   12   7 Dave Rainier67                   Ferrari  FRA 1m13.700s   04.309s    4   w 26   13  18 Phil Thornton                    BRM      GBR 1m13.733s   04.342s   16   w 27   13  20 fran7 Molteni                    Brabham  ITA 1m14.195s   03.408s   29   p 28   14  10 t tintin                         Honda    FRA 1m14.433s   03.646s   17   p 29   15   3 Paul Whitfield                   Honda    GBR 1m14.544s   03.757s   11   p 30   16  15 M Turner                         Brabham  GBR 1m14.723s   03.936s   17   p 31   17   5 James Andrew                     Brabham  GBR 1m16.524s   05.737s   12   p

I was pretty pleased with 29th!

Shows what a handicap the Bourne Beast is for certain works drivers  ;)

Oh how embarrassing for my lack of preparation to be included in such a list for all to point and laugh at for evermore...