SimRacing.org.uk

UKGPL Season 24 Extra Trophy (69X)
Race 4 Monza

Welcome to the fourth round of the Extra Trophy for 69 Extra chassis. Monza. Enough said.

The first lap will be fully moderated within the red zone. The red zone will extend to the whole of the first lap.

Please check the Season 24 pages for details (https://www.simracing.org.uk/smf/index.php?action=LM2R&group=386&theme=6) regarding rules and the Extra Trophy (https://www.simracing.org.uk/smf/index.php?action=LM2R&group=395&theme=6) pages in particular.

It is very important that drivers are FULLY familiar with the rules relating to Shift-R. ONLY ONE IS ALLOWED and a Shift-R MUST be followed by a Stop-and-Go or the driver will be excluded.

If two servers are required they will be as below but if only one grid is required, we will race on T7.

Race list	iGOR
LIGHT Server	UKGPL_T7_2
IP address	62.149.202.168
HEAVY Server	UKGPL3
IP address	ping ukgpl3.dyndns.org
Date	08-03-2013
Race time	Race starts at 21:30 UK time
Qualifying time	Between 30 and 60 minutes, starting no later than 21:00 UK time
Track	Monza (Papy)
Mod	69X
Damage model	INT
Race length	34 laps
Replay	Available here (ftp://ukgpl3.dyndns.org/replays/Archive/Season24/Extra/)

Reserve drivers please note; you must leave the server with 35 minutes of qualifying left, for a total of 10 minutes, to allow full timers to join. FULL TIME DRIVERS GET PRIORITY.

Heavy and Light drivers will drive on separate servers. Please ensure that you know which class you are and that you join the right server

LIGHTS on UKGPL_T7_2; HEAVY on UKGPL3

The Light and Heavy Driver lists can be found on the championship standings page (https://www.simracing.org.uk/smf/index.php?action=LM2R;group=395&theme=6)

Password: see above (#post_event_password)

T7 server is set for 34 laps Long race and listening on Igor in console session with OpenGL.
Ciao

I am getting quite used to being disco'd in races recently. But this seemed a little harsh!!

About 12 minutes of qually still to go and I get a sudden black screen and GPL completely crashes back to Igor, not like my usual gremlin activity. Immediately I try and rejoin server but join button is greyed out.

Igor will not let me join the race because IT IS FULL??
 It almost seemed like I was replaced??? Probably just coincidence that whoever joined last saw the vacancy just as I was ejected....rats!!

UPDATE
Well it appears that the server was shut down lol...so not a disco. I guess I was just the first to go lol.

Not that it mattered much, lesmo 2 became a scrap metal dealers heaven on lap 1 and my race was over. :o/

when you get disco / crash like that you will still be listed by igor as still being on the server . however when you get a disco from a sever you sometimes have to wait a couple of minutes till the server works out you have discoed and you can join again , you could re join straight away with another name , but you will lose any time you set .

john

Very sorry about the confusion guys. There were only 13 drivers at 9pm. Went and made a cup of tea and suddenly 28 drivers d'oh.

Had to crash T7 so sorry about that. I will do the import tomorrow.

As for my race had fun catching Bernie after I blew my engine off the line (again) and then... blew my engine...

Not sure what Johnny P had done but I think he left the handbrake on ;)

One last thing... had so little time to join that I am not sure what I drove... I'll find out tomorrow!

Errr - you do have one Shift/R

I think your right Paul. I did no practice just grabbed a car at 9 .00pm and just sorted the tyres and gears out but could not believe I was 10 seconds a lap down. It was handling ok but had no speed- maybe I'll give the 69's a miss.  :(

NOOOO... get back in boy...

Your wings must have been set fat - makes a HUGE difference. I actually thought you were in a 65... ;)

Just checked the replay to see whether I needed to apologise to Bernie for our coming together on Lap 13.... I don't!  :D

Guilty I'm afraid.  I tried a move down the inside of Attilio and was alongside, but he mustn't have seen me and when he turned in I braked and span...I knew it wasn't going to be pretty.  Sorry everyone.

Bob.

P.S re the conversation about joining last min and being miles off the pace, I didn't have a setup and didn't really know which car to take, but after a visit to the alternative db I d/l'd a steve cloyd setup for the brab and it worked a treat, pity my driving didn't live up to it.

YES EVERYONE, ONE SHIFT-R FOLLOWED BY A STOP AND GO!!!!!!!

But i might have to , another late joiner here , grabbed the lotus which I found was handling like a shopping trolley , tried to sort it in qually but made things worse , kept going into snap oversteer in curva grand , darting all over the track and dead slow out of every corner escp. parabolica where you really need the speed for the straight . tow was no good either just got left for dead by those who lapped me , getting lapped at Monza isnt my idea of fun , think ill kick the 69X  in touch , cant get to grips with them , never have done , and seems I never will   :-\

Sorry for the contact Paul not seen the replay so not sure yet what happend (thought maybe you were trying to lap me  ;D) , hope you enjoyed the piggy back ride even if a little brief  ::)

Grats to the podium boys

  :jumpjoy: BRAVO PHILL !!!!!!!!!  :jumpjoy:

Yeah, guilty of this one I guess, as I completely missed Bob sneaking by at the first of Lesmo, and just went for the apex at the second. I was following Paolo (?) and playing a bit with the gas to make sure I wouldnt rearend him at Lesmo2, so, I guess that helped Bob to gain almost complete overlap by the second bend. I suppose that one is on me, apologies to all involved guys, still why people go for a move like that, in the tighest corner and at L1 of a drafting race is beyond me, especially with these wide cars..I know thats not everybody's mentality, but with a bit of patience it would have been a really fun race with many cars fighting for a podium finish. I was actually by myself for 2 thirds of the time, at Monza.. ::)

I had taken out some wing for the race, knowing it was going to hit my laptimes, but thinking in a drafting race that wouldnt really be noticable and it would  give me some margin if it went  to the wire, not a good idea, it made me so tentative in the bends I couldnt even keep up with H's tow! In the end I was serenely taken out by a semi-out of control Paolo, had to S&R and S&G, still made it third across the line but I suppose it wont hold..Grats H, and finishers.

I'm very frustrated with both Mercaldos. After one of them turned into me without reason on the s/f straight before the server restart and ruined my lap, I then had to completely slow down to evade a 90 degree bad rejoin by Marco at Parabolica and then he did exactly the same thing as what I mentioned happened in the first qualifying session, squeezing me to the left as I was lapping him and causing an accident, which dropped me from a 10 seconds lead down to 3rd place behind Art. And then there's Piero, who is driving like a maniac, attacking at every possible place regardless whether there's enough room or not, as well as squeezing on corner exits and not only putting us both under risk, but losing us a lot of time and allowing Art to close in. I had to do some extreme evasion action and take ridiculous lines to give him room and save myself from being rearended. Fortunately I had my car setup for straight line speed and with some on-the-edge driving through the slower corners, I managed to escape in front again near the end.

It was a very very intense race, but not really enjoyable. It's not fun racing with people who are barely in control and don't know how to race.

Shame Hristo - the Heavies was quite good fun.

@Bernie - stick with it mate and I'll give you some wheel to wheel. You slid into me but that is racing. I am not going to report it and you could save the mod some work by not reporting it either... who is the series Mod?  ;)

While I am on, sorry that the Race 3 hasn't been finished I have a bad chest infection and I haven't been around too much... I'll try and get it done tomorrow.

Hi

I'm very happy, this is my first win on GPL !

Thx for your congrats, ...and "rendez-vous" to Kyalami !

Phil

Ok guys, I had a look at the replay yesterday night and I think something needs to be said. My final crash with Piero Mercaldo was a carbon copy of similar moves he put on Hristo in the previous laps, sliding out of control on the outside when going two abreast into a corner. I almost never report incidents occurring during a race, as I know how easy it is to make a mistake in racing situations. But here theres a clear pattern and I really think it should be looked into by the Mods if we want to be (relatively) serious about this. I hope Hristo reports his incidents as well, if he doesnt I will, as I kind of had enough.

The Marco Mercaldo/Hristo incident (lap 19) is a stunt which is beyond belief and would deserve exclusion from the race. Didnt we have in-series penalties, where have they gone?!?

As for the L1 incident, as stated above, it is true I should have seen Bob disappearing in my mirrors, and I didnt, but it is also true he is braking so late and hard at Lesmo 2, in order to somehow make the corner, that he spins by himself...

I do accept mistakes and misjudgments are part of the game, I make many myself for a start. But it is really starting to piss me off that each time i decide to allocate a couple of hrs of my time to have a race, I have to do it in the hope that that evening I will be fortunate enough to actually have a race at all, by escaping the regular display of stupidity given by people who casually pick a car and go for a spin and a dive, just because they really couldnt think at anything better to do with their evening. I know this is harsh, but guys it is really just about every single race. This is simply unrespectful of other people's time.

I sent 3 reports for Marco, but I didn't report Piero's driving because I avoided being hit by him, so feel free to report your situation, Art.

As for driving standards, sure, mistakes happen, but when someone drives aggressively all the time and takes unnecessary risks, putting 2 or more cars under risk of contact, it's unacceptable. When a driver is forced to keep his eyes on his mirrors to make sure he opens the door to avoid being rearended, it becomes ugly and unpleasant. The problem is, how am I supposed to report a situation where no contact was made because I was aware of it to the extent where I moved away and avoided getting hit? Can we report such situations at all, how are they going to be judged? It turns out that unless you let yourself be hit, you can't really demand a punishment for the one who's driving without respect or awareness. I'm not saying such people drive like that with bad intentions in mind, but even if it happens for lack of spatial awareness, it should be punished somehow so they can see their mistakes and try to improve.

And another thing is, people really need to learn when it's OK to attack and when not, because attacking in absolutely every corner, disregarding optimal lines and speed, disregarding competitors nearby, is very inefficient and even if you gain a position, it's pointless if you don't keep it afterwards. With tracks like Monza, that's what happens because of slipstream, very similar to an oval race, so what is really the point of driving like a maniac, weave, block and attack everywhere, instead of tactically bidding your time for an attack at the right moment? I seriously doubt those who we're blaming would take the time to read, understand and think on this topic, but it has to be said openly because it's just frustrating.

I think the rules imply the 'avoiding action' element. I watched the replay of those final laps between you and Piero after the race, and theres at least two occasions (I think both at Lesmo), where you are actually forced to lift and go wide to avoid his car. That can be reported and sanctioned I think. In the other occasions, when you were going wide at Lesmo1 or Curva Grande, to make room for a possible attack, it is more difficult, but if someone looks at the entire replay of those laps, they are part of a general attitude that is easy to recognise.

People will not read these posts if nothing draws their attention to them, but if they have to miss qually next race, or do a S&G, they will end up taking notice...where are those in-series penalties? Also, these behaviours might not imply bad intentions, but certainly they do expose a very superficial attitude; as I said before, we all allocate time for this, and that should be respected.

As for the lack of racing strategy, fully agree, but thats another topic I suppose. Actually it came handy to me in this case, as I could easily keep in touch while you two were busy squabbling ahead...

Yes, it was mostly in the Lesmos where I could see he was braking too late and I just felt there was going to be contact if I choose to take a normal line, even though I was actually in front of him and he just braked too late, but also in the situations where he was on the inside and I felt he won't be able to keep the inside line very well (and I suppose it becomes clear on the replay). In the other situations you mentioned, it's because he went into my blind spot or I did not have the opportunity to clearly follow his position in my mirrors while trying to drive on the limit, so it was more a case of being safe than sorry. What I know though, is drivers like Evil or myself would never risk it like that and rely on the driver in front to make way, it's not sportive in my opinion, and neither it is efficient.

As for keeping up with us, of course, after losing my 10 seconds lead and with Piero's over-aggressive driving, I just had to play along with his approach, especially since he was too slow when in front and I couldn't just follow behind, it would have cost me even more time. I was a bit surprised you were lacking so much speed overall though, otherwise it would have been even more intense, if that's possible lol.

IMO we should do the LIGHT's races in PRO mode...

When I saw the cars flying high in Lesmo2 I tried to be carefull and to avoid the carnage, but the cars behind seemed not as defensive.
Blocked by a wrecked car I had to wait very long until I could move on with a slightly damaged car.

Had the low BW settings made them not see what happened?
(On UKGPL_8 I consequently use 84/384, what should be the standard)

No chance to get in contact with the front I had a race that was not very enjoyable and when my engine blew in lap 27 I had lost my concentration ::)

It's a shame to have such a race on a track with lots of potential for maximum fun!

This Lights race was a joke.

From the idiots up front wanting to win the race on the first lap to the idiots at the back rejoining during the race with no thought for those following behind it demonstrated everything which has been bad this season across a few of the championships. Even I cannot say I was blameless.

It was also bizarre; Hendy how on earth did you transform your car from a flaming fireball minus at least one wheel to a perfectly functioning car the next second without a shift-r?

Had a great car setup, bar the gearbox which was just one click too long in top. Apart from that, I could put it anywhere on the track that I wanted...any time, and at any speed. Pity the driving left a bit to be desired... :-\
Sorry Dave for clipping you in that clumsy spin out of Lesmo 2. I thought it best to wait til you got going then follow off. Caught up the pack again, then a few laps later had a brain fade and put it in the beach at Para then firmly wedged in the fence. Reset, s 'n g yada yada yada and a lonely race til the last couple when I caught Bernie and Francesco. Thanks Bernie for doing the gentlemanly thing. And Fran, into Curva Grande on the last lap...you had to know I was right beside you, surely? Turning into me was not a good deal. Lucky for me warp kicked you into the fence
as my car wasn't upset in any way...I didn't even know you weren't there til I saw the replay. Congrats Phil on your maiden UKGPL victory..and well done Dave for bringing home P2.
Geoff.

Edit: Johnny P....why did you select the slowest bucket in the mod to drive?....Honestly, a unicyle with one wheel missing would be just slightly slower!!... ;D

I guess I am just so used to PRO races that I never think about a Shift-R and hit the ESc button to clear the track quickly as a matter of habit. I take the view that if I am out of the race, then I am out of the race whether it is my fault or not just as in real life racing.

TBH in races with fast drivers, such as we had here, one is unlikely to recover from a reset and SnG  to get back into the serious action.
 I do not mean that I am giving up just because I cannot win, but driving 30 odd laps around Monza on your own without any close combat is kinda boring?

Hindsight is a wonderful thing- it was my first time out in the 69's and none too pleasant at that. I did a few laps but headed for the pits so not to ruin anyone's race. It is still surprising that there is such a chasm in performance between some of the cars.

Even that won´t stop people doing such things...

My shift-R brings me nothing, because GPL thought it is a good idea to put Tristan´s Matra directly in front of my own car. So I had no choice but to hit him with about 25km/h. That was then good enough to brake my motor and set my car in flames. Frustrating.
So I think I am with Axel in doing the LIGHTS in PRO mode.

Lol, I see everyone seems to be pissed off at someone, maybe PRO rules are a good idea after all? I would also rehiterate that we seemed to have introduced in-series penalties after long discussions, and I think they are a very good idea, as penalty points dont do the trick. But for some reason they never seem to have kicked in..


I was slowly reeling in Piero's Matra, once he finally lost your tow some 10 laps into the race. When I came across (almost literally.. ;)) your car, I was actually happy to let you past, tuck in behind and take the fast train to a second chance at the front ;D. Not sure why I was so slow during the race though, as I had tested the different wings in practice and the difference wasnt more than a couple of tenths really. I suppose the low wings/extended 5th gear combo killed my exit of Curva Grande, and I was certainly not very confident going into Parabolica for a good part of the race. Still surprising though, as I was really pushing to catch Piero, and I couldnt even break into the 26s with half the fuel gone...I probably didnt know the car enough with this different setup, which made it more tricky to drive, all those wings can spoil you for grip  ;D.

The problem is that I work one hour a week and when I come to run in the league happens that I often find myself in front in qualifying, but I do not have to setup adequate competition.
Yesterday I just wanted to get to the end but the crowds in the grandstands of Monza I lit the passion ..

If disturbance tell that I have no problem to stop.

Hello

hi :)
...well unlucky in lap one.....I nearly avoid the car who spinn in front of me .....and just a little contact send me on the roof !...then I can't do anything but do S&R till GPL axepted me on track , till this time , hav'been hurt 4 or 5 times !.....then after a long time I restart and do my S&G in the next lap ....but all chances to see the lead are gones .....
 ....next time maybe !....

....BRAVO PHILIPPE ....FIRST VICTORY IN 69X  :-*

Strange idea to choose the Eagle in mod69X. This is from far the slowest car in this mod !
Remember it was a private car which has nothing to do with the brillant Gurney's Eagle from 67.
All the 69X cars with no wings are completely out raced.
Except maybe the Cooper which is not so bad in Monza.

It did not and does not seem strange to me. I know very little of the history of F1 from 1969 and did not consider my lack of historical knowledge would be such a hindrance. If the eagle is so bad then it seems a waste of effort on the team who created it for gpl as no one but the stupid will use it- except maybe if it was crap in 1969.

 ;) ;)
First of all I want to express I am sorry for Göran been sent into armco of Curva Grande first lap ! I watched servers replay several times on this , but cant see any reason why that happened then server mismatched right position of the cars. There was plenty of room between us both.
Second thing:  I am surprised discussion on this race heated up that badly and I would appreciate if it will be possible for some to envelope an more relaxed view on this race .

Well , watching replay I think Lesmo2 disaster starts with slightly spinning car of Bob Withwell , which to me looks pretty much more server related then effect of careless or over aggressive action btw. However, in following multiple crash happened. Must acknowledge my  reaction in slowing down rapidly by seeing the crash in front , wasn’t good, but doubt it would have had changed anything .
I am sure the dimension of these crash is very much based on the fact that Lesmo2 is a turn, which allows no duck or hard braking.
In reality after that kind of mass crash, the race would have been restarted.
As well in reality that kinda things do happened, so no question of pro rules or whatever.

Another point I am really unhappy with, are the complains on Piero`s driving style.
Watching servers replay on this, I absolutely cant see he does any wrong.
I got the impression by more wing setup he was able to enter turns like Lesmos  and Para with more speed and definitely with shorter braking move. That enables to force faster less wing cars to not catch up the ideal line in time. Different setups - different strategies and to me no question: trying to checkmate is a suitable thing to utilize.
To me he did an brilliant job , no way unfair.
That crash with Artiglietti at Curva Grande ( L33 ), to me , was an ordinary race incident,
Artiglietti took his chance and he did real good , could control the extra speed outa tow. Run a bit wide ok , but still under control. Unfortunately GPL seems to count slipstream effect a bit nervous . Watching replay really step by step , it shows how Piero`s car speeds up by 2-3kmh just by the slipstream-effect given by overtaking Artiglietti , and that makes his car spin slightly to the left. As Artiglietti was moving very slightly to the right by trying to avoid Armco , or just to stabilize the car, contact happened.


Ah well , I know I am not an admin and I don’t want to be.
But cause I am sad about the way after-race-discussion partly went, I am saying all this….
Of course I wished this race would have been less crashy and more filled with thrilling sporty action. BUT hey that’s racing ……………

Rules note : only 1 shift-R is allowed right ? guess not everyone does know…


Technical note:
I wonder how bad 69x collision box works compared to Gts mod for example.
Wasn’t there an update for 69x ?  Or do I simply confused it with the message that 69x comes with worked over collision box over older 69mod ?

I'm going to let Hristo, Arturo, and the mods deal with the racing action (as my race was spectacularly uneventful), but there needs to be something said about some of the behaviour I saw in qualifying:

1) When you hit the green button, DO NOT immediately peel out of your pitbox in a straight line! There is a "traffic lane" in the pits, use it. Driving straight up the line of pitstalls invites contact with the other driver who hits their green button only to appear directly (and now unavoidably) in your path. I've lost good qually laps due to cars coming out the pits airborne, sideways, and on fire because of crap like this.

2) If you're on an outlap (or if you've muffed up your present lap) MAKE WAY for others coming up from behind, they may be on a timed lap. It doesn't matter to you whether you make it
to that corner in 2 seconds or 5 (having let that other car through), but that may be the other driver's only chance for a clean qualifying lap.

Different subject: Johnny.P, the Eagle AAR001 is there for historical accuracy, and yes, compared to the rest of the field, it was crap. Check GPLRank to find out which cars others have got good times in. Having slower cars available is a good thing IMO, as you can use them for handicapping purposes (tho I wouldn't wish the 69 Eagle on anyone  :P ).

Thanks Dlogan, I'll do that.  ;)

BIG CONGRATS TO MY MATE PHIL... FIRST WIN - YAHEY.

You beat me to that Gold - BOO!  ;D

Very well done. Genuinely pleased for you.

Haven't seen the replay so I'm not sure which wreck you're referring to. I think I had contact about 3 times. The first two 'bad' wrecks i was involved in I rolled and landed on my wheels with no obvious problems to the car. The last wreck I lost a wheel and had to reset and was moving slowly on the outside of T4 when I think you came around and got me. It was good as always racing with you at the beginning, you're a more reliable driver than me I think and you deserved to have finished the race.

Sometimes when there is a large wreck with so many cars on the Pribluda monitor it's hard to tell when I can safely shift-R. In the future I'll try and be more careful.

Congrats Hristo, Piero, and Attilio

I was last to arrive on the scene at Lesmo2 and there was no warning. By the time you realized what was up it was too late. Apologies to those I ran in to and Marco for touching wheels when we were all trying to get sorted.    
I clearly benefitted from this accident as far as track position. Hooked up with Hendy and Ronnie for several laps, and yes, Hendy was driving a flame thrower for a few corners.     :blink:      I pipped by these two when they came to grief but soon had Tristan going very fast behind. When He went past I grabbed the draft for a couple of laps and stabilized the gap to Cookie. I don't remember seeing Florian in the sand @Parabolica but my pitboard soon warned me of a new threat and the last ten laps were all out trying to stay ahead. A photo finish with Florian but he was clearly better and but for a touch of the grass at Ascari things would have been different.  Great finish Florian.       :thumbup1:  

Fun race for me.  Too bad so many got involved on lap 1.  

Peace

RJ

Grats to Philippe for his first win   :clap:

No problem Hendy, it was just a bad night at the office for everyone. I was looking at the server replay and spotted a car on fire minus a front right wheel (I think) and realised it was you only to see you moments later fully intact and flames extinguished, it was just weird?

This happens sometimes due to warp/lag, it just delays the update for a car after a shift-r, so you see it still destroyed even if it was reset lol. Quite funny actually!


Piero, nobody is asking you to stop, but you have to realize there is a time to attack and there is a time to stay behind and just follow the car in front. You gain nothing by attacking everywhere and by risking everywhere, especially on a track like Monza. The only thing that happens is both cars are put under risk of contact, both drivers lose time and nobody really gains anything. I hope you will think about it and we can have cleaner races in the future, because you are very quick and capable.


Well, sorry that I have to say this, Nicky, but if you really see it that way, then you're not seeing the full picture. You don't realize the risk involved when someone keeps attacking everywhere by putting both himself and the car in front at risk, to the extent where the driver in front has to react in the last moment to open the door in order to avoid getting hit, even though he's not obliged to do so. Likewise on corner exits where the two cars are side by side and one of the drivers is being squeezed out. I can absolutely guarantee you that had I not taken some evasive action by giving room or lifting up, there would have been contact between myself and Piero in at least 2-3 situations, even though I had full rights to keep my line and speed. To put it in a short sentence, when in a battle between 2 drivers, only 1 of them takes the necessary measures to avoid contact. This is not the right way to race, compromising your own driving while the other driver doesn't do that. You don't see me attacking like that because it's just not right and it would be out of my control how the situation unfolds. There is no enjoyment in such kind of racing, I can't trust racing against such a driver who doesn't care if there is contact or not, or whether both drivers lose up to 1-2 seconds as a result. It's not a matter of whether it's intentional or not, I'm not saying it was intentional, but it is simply over the top.

 Dear Hristo ,
 I know you're faster than me In fact I had no intention to attack, my goal was to get to the end.
Covering the reply it is clear that I try to put pressure to make a mistake, it was the only way to win but I never have been wrong with you.
You are the strongest of all there is no doubt but mistakes under pressure too, 2 times 2 times lesmo dish and if you make mistakes.

As for the incident with Attilio, if you look carefully it is he who goes out to the Curva Grande trajectory and goes off, I try to take advantage of it and he rather to maintain its track narrows and created the incident.
I do not seem to have been particularly unfair!
I believe that the races are also made of these episodes.

I promise that my next training will make them with a full tank.

Sorry for the English but use the translator.

PS. Attilio sei Italiano? Mi dispiace soprattutto per Montjuic..

E che é successo a Montjuic, Piero  ???, mica mi ricordo? Comunque su questa mi spiace ma sei in torto marcio, c'é poco da dire  ;)

Sorry for the Italian guys, promise theres nothing untoward in there  ;D. I think differently about that accident, as, in my view, you shouldnt have been there in the first place, there simply wasnt enough space for your car, which was also always going to be tail happy at that speed, and clearly wiped me off. Anyway, it's sent to the mods, so we will see what a third party thinks. However I have to say I am rather baffled by the contrasting opinions, I mean, not even when you actually crash with someone you consider you might have done something wrong..?  I think that keeping your side of the road is one of the basics of online racing, it was hammered into my head in the first races of my Novice season, but maybe things have now changed, and I should just throw that out of the window and start racing a bit more freely, really.

I don't think it's a matter of speed, Piero. Those 2 times at Lesmo you're speaking of, those were not mistakes on my part, I intentionally went wide to give you room because I was quite sure you were going to hit me otherwise. Anyway, see you at the next race!


Well I don't know for you really, but I'm not going to change my approach, otherwise anything I say here would come out as hypocrisy. I'd keep insisting people have to adhere to certain driving ethics, especially online where you simply cannot race wheel to wheel in the presence of lag and not so good collision detection as we have in GPL.

Attention to Mods please.
I had to reset in the first lap mess at Lesmo2 followed by a S&G. Later in the race I was catching Hendy while he spun at Lesmo 2 and I hit him. No need of reset for both , but trying to put my car in the right direction and out of way of coming cars I went in front of inside fence. As reverse doesn't work on my G27 shifter, after several attempts and seconds to move my car away from the fence I reset for the second time and did a S&G soon after finishing the race dead last. I wasn't sure about S&R rule, but now I know I am DQ. Please correct my standing.
Ciao

Sorry Geof but I was a little bit disappointed from your action.A copy of this incident happened in the 67 with Fabio awith the same result,my car destroied.When a car disappear from the mirror coul be on the side or coul be in the rear side,and in this curve and at that point and speed ,i must do the curve or i must meeting the wall.Normally I release the gas and i go in oversteer,so i "close" the curve.
Wat disappoint me is the fact that you was faster than me and after the 2 Lesmo you had all the space for an overtake.Anyway the final result don't change but is better,in my opinion,to avoid overtakes in place that can assure an incident. :)

Well, not quite correct. I was faster through the corners only, my overly tall top gear only allowed me to hold station rather than cruise past outside of the draft. I had no option but to use the cars best attribute, it's cornering performance. When I have someone draft me into CG, I always back off and give them the corner....it's not the place to be defending. Driving the rest of the lap in a tidy manner then allows you to draft from Ascari to Parabolica and attack them there. At the 200 marker into CG, a quick right glance shows me to be right beside you. Racecraft also includes knowing when to shut the throttle and give best to an opponent that has track position. Remember, you're running at the front now, not dicing for 10th....the games a little different at the pointy end. How about joining me for some practice before the next event, and we can try to get your car a little more user friendly....mine doesn't snap oversteer when I close the throttle. PM me if you're interested Fran.
Geoff.

Thank you Geoff but frankly speaking is my choice to have overtseer when i release the gas.
I have found this an help in some curve like curva grande or Lesmo 2.
As explained if i don't see the wheels of the other car, I can imagine that the car is on the rear flank and ,since the kind of curve in full speed,i imagine again that the other pilot desist from the attempt.
The same happen in the 67 with fabio but always this the same result:my car destroied. :)

Not really a good assumption, Francesco. It's quite possible to do CG side by side and I've done it many times, including in this race with Piero. It's actually much easier in 69s (and 65s) compared to 67s (or 3L 66s) because of the better grip of the cars in relation to the speed they're going at. Lesmo 2 I agree it's more tricky, but the point is you can't really assume someone is behind you just because they're in your blind spot. I would never close a door relying on such an assumption, I'd rather let a person by than make contact and risk retirement. Of course that doesn't mean I won't blame them for taking such a risk at a bad spot, but while Lesmo 2 may be a bad spot indeed, CG isn't really such, it's wide enough.

To start the comparison between me and you in GPL is like to compare one terrestrial with an alien ;D
One day you must explain me in wich way you are so fast.
Like Geof said ,also for me was a surprise to find his car perfectly on the side.
Anyway because i live in Como 40km from Monza or because is the easier ,I know very well the track and i know,with any mod,that when i release the gas i must go closer as possible to the lower wall otherwise i go into the highest wall.Obviously when i am on maximum speed like in a race.
I drive with a Logitec Momo plus a metallic pedal and Act lab H(shape)gear and i use the clutch,and you?

What happens when you lift up the throttle depends on the setup really, mostly the differential settings.

I use Logitech Driving Force Pro, no Clutch pedal, left-foot braking. I'd be spinning every corner if I had to RFB.

I drive exactly the same as Hristo , same wheel , same pedals , no clutch , LFB and same diff settings , only difference I do it in slow motion  ::)

I've turned my FF off recently and it's been better like that, it just gives you more freedom with the car. As for wheel settings, I set it at 460 degrees and 8:1 steering ratio in the setup.

If you use the clutch,that is correct for the era,probably you are less fast depending on the track.
When i have used the clutch for the first time i lost from 1 to 2second at Monza.Like in the real F1 if you use the clutch and the H gear you must forgot the fast change of gear expecially entering the curve during breaking ;D.Also on the straght,maily for the H gear, you are not so fast like a sequential gear.
Anyway I use a steering ratio 10:1,500 400 anti roll bar(in F1 F2) and 2 block with a ratio 60/30 that give the oversteer when you release the gas.
PS for Hristo:I done an overtaking side by side in Imola 67 with Gerard but was the first slow(very slow) curve after the start line.

I would use a clutch pedal if I had one and yeah, I know of the advantages of using a shifter, but it doesn't really bother me. Some people call it an unfair advantage, but not me.