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Welcome to the S27 F2 Championship - Round 5 - Dundrod 1965

Round 6 of the Formula 2 Trophy will be hosted in Dundrod 1965 Ulster Tourist Trophy, one of the beautifull long Jim Pearson  tracks.  
"It's a definite must have for all! One of the top tracks for any simulation." I confirm!


There will be no handicaps this season but, much like the 67-based series, tokens will be used!

Matra MS7 FVA :       16 tokens
Matra MS5 FVA :       14 tokens
Brabham BT23 FVA : 14 tokens
Lola T100 FVA :        14 tokens
Lotus 48 FVA :         14 tokens
Lotus 41B FVA:        12 tokens
McLaren M4A FVA :   12 tokens
Protos 16 FVA :        10 tokens
Lola T100 BMW :      10 tokens
Cooper T84 FVA :      6 tokens
Ferrari 166 :              3 tokens
Brabham BT14 LF :    0 tokens

Please check the Season 27 pages for details (https://www.simracing.org.uk/smf/index.php?action=LM2R&group=448&theme=6) regarding rules and the Formula 2 Trophy (https://www.simracing.org.uk/smf/index.php?action=LM2R&group=455&theme=6) pages in particular.

There will be two championships - Lights and Heavies (for slower drivers) who will contest separate championships but on the same grid.

You have ONE SHIFT-R with a Stop n Go of 0 seconds!
Only Reported incidents moderated outside the Red Zone
Full moderation of lap one Red Zone

Race List = IGOR
Server = UKGPL_8
Variant = 1967 Formula 2
Damage Model = Intermediate
Track = Dundrod  1965   Ulster Tourist Trophy (ftp://ukgpl3.dyndns.org/tracks/Dundrod)
Race length = ~40min -> 11 laps
Race date = Sunday 19-10-2014
Time = 21:00 UK time (21:00 GMT)
Qualifying time = 45 - 30 minutes
Race time = ~21:30 UK time
Red Zone = First lap from the start to the exit of Leathemstown Corner.
Replays = you get here (ftp://ukgpl3.dyndns.org/Replays/Archive/Season27/F2s/)

Please restrict chat to only urgent messages including at the end of the race until ALL drivers still racing have crossed the line.

The full time drivers can start to practice as soon as the server is available.  Reserve drivers can also join as soon as the server becomes available but must leave a full (19 driver) server with 35 minutes of qualifying left, for a total of 5 minutes; this will allow any remaining full timers to join.  If there is enough space on the grid, the reserve drivers will be able to rejoin when there are 30 mins of qualifying left.  

Difficult track,more difficult compared to the Targa due to few reference points.

Jim Pearson placed some significant reference points: hay bales!
Whenever you see single hay bales on the trackside be aware of a corner you have to be carefull  ;)
There are very long parts where you can hammer full throttle until you see a hay bale ;D

I raced here with CanAm71 and 69X, but the F2s and 65s are way easier and less critical to manage here.

The only trackside bales I see are the ones the marshals stand behind , but they seem to be haphazard not just near a corner . There are some single bales in rows of 3 placed "on" the corners , are these the ones you mean ?
Not much in the way of landmarks to say which part of the track we are approaching afaics  :-\

Finding it near impossible to learn this track , probably due to my oncoming dimenture  :'(

Ha, you haven't tried it in the GT's? 

This is one of the greatest tracks ever, it's absolutely brilliant.  Good luck to youse guys learning it as you go.  And watch out for the Leprechauns.

I have tried it, but just some training laps. ::)

The most scaring for me is the downhill jump, if you are not in the perfect line you are lost...

That would be Deer's Leap then ?


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dundrod_Circuit#mediaviewer/File:Dundrod_Circuit.svg (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dundrod_Circuit#mediaviewer/File:Dundrod_Circuit.svg)

Exactly Bernie ;)

With F2's it can work in 5th flat, if not  :cursing: :wheelchair:

Despite the hay bales remain difficult to remeber all curves.Since is a fast track, there is also the problem to see the bails in time ;D

Hmmm.. After reading some of these comments,  not looking forward to my recce laps later...!

This track directory is "dundrod", right?

YES!

I just started the practice server for some laps, be aware of the positioning in the green way before the S+F line ;)

Tis a bit tight there! ;)

Also, flat at Deer's Leap? Not in the F2s....

I was lucky since I've once done a race here many years ago with the Funliga, but it still took me the better part of the afternoon to relearn the track.

I expect a high attrition rate, so my advice would be to keep calm, don't push and keep it on the black stuff. Even the grass / earth embankment all the way around the track is too dangerous to put a wheel on. Better to be safe than sorry :D .

You guys should have fun lapping me , I dont have a clue with this track , completely baffles me  ::)

Had a brief spin round here (can't really say quick!),  but 1x reset per lap seems a bit expensive....!

Maybe we should use 2 servers, as overtaking is very difficult here  ::)

If Jethro is able to host lights with UKGPL_9, I will host the heavies with UKGPL_8.

FTFY. :P

You know a race is going to be tough when the track looks like Bremgarten, but is harder.... and I guess learning the long tracks would be a good way to push back dementia indeed!

PS. Schottenring on Tuesday as well!  ;D

Schottenring's longer compared to here... I rate this narrower than Spa and Bremgarten but way more fun!

Shortest race for a while  ::)

Shortest race for me also Bernie, did a stop and go then got DQ.

Just a couple of laps to go and........................screen freeze!!  :-\

Apologies to Ronnie on lap 1. Sry mate I was fighting for control and you closed up so fast that when I tried to get out of your way, you had already moved to that side  :(

Fran, evil, Iestyn and myself experienced a freeze at exactly the same time, the cause of which I don't yet know. My race GPL install did the same thing to me earlier today on 8, it may be a byproduct of the track.

Whatever the case, that was some of the worst lap 1 driving I've ever seen.

ok, so I was out of the race anyway,  but stayed on the server.
My GPL locked up at 32mins 21seconds in.

Could have done with a practice drive today;  also with race fuel - I think that partially caught me out just before the jump.
Then just dropped it on the easy bit between the hairpin & start-line. Before 1/2 distance.

Shame,  was just starting to enjoy it.

Cheers,
Dave.

Congrats, Tommie!  You old devil!  Taking a BT14 to victory.  Gotta be sweet!  :)  I had wondered why it seemed that you were so off the pace on the straight bits.  I thought that perhaps you under-geared a ton and putting the tacho needle on the peg.  If I'd twigged to the real cause, I may have looked to close in the last laps to make a race of it.  Then, too, a couple of late lap close calls on my part didn't help my pursuit.  Happy with a P3(or perhaps, a P2?)finish.

Horrendous misfortune for Axel.  A last corner, last lap shunt costing the win.  Yes indeed, that last corner can so easily trip one up.  Hate to bring it up but a 15-second time penalty is likely to be applied to you for the reset, Axel.

I've never seen a sim race with so many shunts in viewing the replay cap.  The first lap carnage was something to behold.  Bad luck for all involved.

Point of Order:

I note that Dean Logan is credited with a P7 placing with the standings chart awarding him points and tokens.  He was DQ'd for reversing course beyond GPL's acceptable limits.  Surely, anyone disqualified goes to the bottom of the classification no matter where the finish on the road or how many laps they complete.  In short, no points and no tokens credited.  Correct?

To finish first, you have to finish first....

Yes! I have added the 15sec and ended in a well deserved 3rd place.  ::)

This was a tribute to a night watching the Philip Island MotoGP races, being totally tired and exhausted.
For me it was a miracle how all the fast guys went off and I was suddenly in the lead after half a lap, I had never expected to survive this challenge. So I drove save and just as fast as necessary to keep Tommie and Doni in a "save" distance.
After the last hairpin I allready had some wobbles and said to myself "just cruise home", but this seemed wrong, as I slept into the last righthander and ran wide....



 

Hopefully not! Dean should surely be credited with 7th and his coins if not the 5th place it actually appears he finished. Is Jim Pearson a sadist? He sure likes to stick you out in the middle of nowhere when you go off in certain places with no place to return to track without backtracking 100's of meters. I was worried I might get a DQ too when I had to turn around at Quarterlands.

First, I'd like to apologize to Dave R for sticking my nose back on the track in front of you. I floored it to get back to the side of the track and went too far. I couldn't think fast enough to back up. I was hoping nobody would hit me before I could react. But sure enough Dave comes along on the inside trying to stay out of trouble. Luckily, I only seemed to wreck Dave. I hope you're not too angry with me.

Congratulations Tom! Took the win in a crappy car! Congrats Axel and Donnie for avoiding all the carnage and making it to the flag in one piece. Axel's probably more disappointed with himself than I am with myself. It sucks to piss away such a good opportunity to win.

My apologies to you too Rob. After I got back on the track at Deers Leap, I had a green flag coming to the next rise but I immediately see a car stopped on the left. I swerved to avoid it and with there being another crest I don't see Rob and Fran's cars blocking the track until it's too late to stop. I tried to stop and then thread a needle between the two cars but I couldn't quite do it without slamming into Rob's car. :(

I didn't have a good feeling about turn 1 after the start. With such a strong tow in the F2 cars, such a high speed turn 1, and the brothers Mercaldo breathing down my neck I didn't expect things to go well. I was glad to make it through in one piece and without causing a pileup. I had to wait much later to brake and turn into t1 than I wanted but thankfully Piero gave me a little bit of room. I took it too fast into Leathemstown Corner just a little while later. I ran wide into the grass losing a position to Piero. That really screwed me up in the turn before Deers Leap. I missed my line and lift point with Piero's car blocking my view. That put me in a slide that I couldn't correct once I hit the low spot.

Later in lap 1 at Wheeler's Corner, Marco and Rog came together and I couldn't avoid Marco's car. I actually helped point Marco's car in the right direction and the mechanical report lists him with no damage from the incident. :) After my violent spin at Deers Leap, sticking my chin out so Dave might take it off, nailing Rob, and hitting Marco, I can't believe the Matra was still in running condition. What a tough car!

After my 4:51s 1st lap, I still thought I had a chance to win. The race history graphs confirms that thought. I then proceeded to put in 5 good consistent laps. I started to get impatient trying to close such a huge gap that I made a mistake at Cochranstown spinning the car into the hedges. I tried for almost 30 seconds to dislodge it. That ruined any chance of me catching the leaders. I should have reset as soon I went into the hedge but it likely didn't change the outcome of the race. I do wish I had not used such a high gear for 5th. I never needed it to pass on the start-finish straight. I was probably losing a second a lap with that gear.

Thanks Dean for letting me pass. I wasn't expecting it at that point since it was for position. Sorry to slow you down so much. If I had known you'd do that, I would have passed sooner. Thanks again, that was kind of you. Thankfully we were both somewhat patient. It's a shame you went off soon after that. It's very difficult to follow another car here. I know I need a lot more practice to be proficient at it.

I'm glad and disappointed at the same time. Glad to finish 4th when I had only run one lap without a reset 2 hours prior to qualifying starting but disappointed that I pissed away another rare opportunity to win.

Great fun guys. Thanks again.

No problem, Greg. And I was not angry at all ;)
I saw you at the last second, and could not avoid your car because another car was overtaking me (as far as I remember !?).

I was almost sure there will be a lot of accidents in such a track with a full grid, that's why I choose the BT14 and tried to do a clean and cautious race.
By the way, the BT14 was very nice to drive here.
The qualifications and  the 1st lap was horrific, the most difficult was to survive the 1st lap.
I would be interested knowing how many drivers could join the finish line without shift-R (I did one after the incident with Greg)

Bad luck for Axel, and yes "to finish first, you first need to finish".
Fangio said "the best driver is the winning one, driving the more slowly as he can"   

   
For the Heavy Championship, it's a very good result for Francesco and me !

 

Thought this track was SUPER hard. Couldn't remember the corners - managed 9 crashes on one lap which was a record even for me. Thought I would pootle around at the back but I felt I could get sub 4 mins after some practice and set off with a minute left. Bernie was having none of it and I met him coming round the corner the wrong way.... looking at his replay he span about 8million degrees so it was not wonder he didn't know whether he was coming or going. Waiting for the off when I suddenly remembered TOKENS! ARRRRGGGGHHH. Came out, grabbed the Brabham and....
....couldn't get back in.

Curses. Hope you all enjoyed it.

Ran out of time to prepare for this race and decided to take the BT14 in order to build up some tokens. Did about 4-5 laps before the race at Axel's and at least went sub4m.

But at the practise session I didn't complete a lap, just forgot about where I was. Started dead last and my aim was to go easy and try to make it at least halfway. Followed Bernie, and already after T1 some cars went off, but at Deer's Leap Bernie slowed for a wreck, and some other cars piled in. I was able to clear that mess, but little later I think Marco took it 3 wide with Fran and me... I was just trying to let you guys go as you had way more momentum after the previous mess...

We wrecked hard and blocked the track. Had to wait for all cars to clear/leave, but the carnage got worse and worse. Bernie and I got the worst of it I think...but most of it was unavoidable I guess...not your fault Greg ;)

Did a S&G after reset, but on Lap 2 I didn't even know where I was or doing anymore and halfway that lap had to retire...then watched the rest of the race live, some great driving going on at the front.

Axel losing the win in the last corner after a controlled drive, tough luck, and Tommie doing a superb job in the BT14 whole race. Also grats to Doni for a well deserved podium with a well measured drive racing with Tommie for the most part! Enjoyed watching the racing so still had some fun. I was able to laugh about the wrecks. There was some wacky stuff going on...

Grats Tommie, Doni and Axel, and finishers. Some nice laprecords for Greg as well. Commiserations to the retirements. Will be back on form next F2 race (hopefully) ;)

A lot of incident for me in this race.2 at the start, always touch from the back and one on the start line when 2 cars have suddenly materialized in front of me,but i don't remember the lap.Due to a" freezing game" at lap 7, i must download the replay to understand what happened.In any case the last incident was in full throttle and the consequence was shift-R.

No problem Clive. I felt I fluffed a good chance to get back past when I saw you in difficulty but blew it by myself. Tough luck on the screen freeze.

Grats on a great win Tommie in the BT14 and also Doni and Axl.

Well, that was sweet! And a little undeserved, but hey, who cares! I won in the BT14 ;D . Very tough break though Axel!! But you know what they say, to finish first, first you have to finish!

At the start of quali I still had some trouble recognising and remembering parts of the track, which is a problem as many corners have tight exits and you're in trouble if you don't get your lines just right. In the day and afternoon before I'd tried to do some laps in my head, by memory, and that paid off, although I still had to concentrate a lot on not forgetting where I was all the time. In the end I developed a routine for the bits I found tough to remember, to act as a failsafe to validate where I was. For the junction after Deer's Leap it was -haybale- , -hazard sign-, then for the junction right after it was -haybale-, -big tree-, -silver gate-, then for the follow through to the right some time later it was -haybale 1-, -haybale 2-, -hazard sign-, and for the left-right chicane right after it way just -hazard sign!! turn in!!-  ;D . The rest of the track way easy enough to just remember the usual way. After the chicane it was flat out until the junction with the crest, and from that point on the track had enough difference in the trackside objects to automatically remember where I was. But the middle part stayed tough and I really had to concentrate during the race not to forget a corner, and I still did a couple of times when I was distracted by backmarkers or fellow competitors and didn't keep track of where I was. Thankfully I realized it just in time every time.

I was expecting a high attrition rate and really feared the first lap. I took it easy at the start and Ronnie and Doni passed me. Then came the first corner and I was really surprised why everyone was braking so much when it was almost flat out in quali. I nearly went off together with Ronnie but miraculously managed to keep the car straight despite putting a wheel on the hazardous grass. I took it real easy for the sweepers right after, which was a good thing since I got surprised again by the additional braking of the guys in front for the junction. I had to select a lower gear coming out of the corner and was passed by Clive as well. Dave Curtis also thought of passing me but thought better of it and stayed behind. I had no trouble going through Deer's Leap, then took it real easy under braking for the junction right after. That was a good thing since a recovering Piero Mercaldo suddenly appeared on track! I had a good laugh at the amazing premonition Clive must've had, keeping to the far right there, completely away from the racing line, just as Piero suddenly appeared out of the bushes! He, Clive, Ronnie and I were extremely lucky there not to get involved in a big wreck. Then Ronnie attempted a pass at a slow Clive who'd not had a great exit out of a corner, but hit the bushes instead and it took some skill and luck for him not to spin. I let Piero pass on the straight after, and there was another close call when he banged wheels with Ronnie, but it ended up all right. Then Ronnie went off at the junction with the crest, perhaps shaken by Piero's driving, and for the first time I had nobody around me so I felt a little more safe.

The lap after I noticed Dean was really fast, but he soon fell back due to a mishap. I somehow managed to decrease the distance to Clive and Doni, then Clive made a mistake and I could pass him just as he freed himself out of the bushes. So the next lap I was all over Doni, the slipstream making it easier to keep up. I was a bit cheeky and tried to pressurize him into making a mistake, not so he'd have to retire of course, but just enough so I could squeeze past ánd be able to pull a gap. Doni must've read my mind as he duly pulled over the next lap, letting me through. His pace was getting better every lap though, but thankfully I could motor the BT14 round just fast enough to keep a tiny distance between him and me.

All this time I'd been slowly decreasing Axel's lead from 10 seconds when I inherited 2nd place, to 5 seconds entering the last lap, but it was still not enough to catch a tow and really catch up. Then, last corner, skidmarks, and then a green flag! I knew it must've been Axel so I threw my fist up in the air, both in GPL and from behind the wheel ;D . In the heat of the moment I wasn't completely sure if this had been the last lap and if I'd actually won, but confirmation soon came in the waving marshalls and then the pit sign, seeing 'P1'. Woohoo! Awesome to finally get another win in UKGPL, it had been a while :) .

Kudo's for the bold track choice, it makes for really good stories ;D .

Yes, but... it's what set the whole s***fest off, unfortunately.

Dave clips you (he might even have been staying on that side, knowing I was on the other; if so, thanks!), which makes Bernie check up too fast for Jethro to avoid (as he's in mid-air), and from then on it's cars melange. Add some others trying to go 3-wide, or do multiple 3-point turns in oncoming traffic, and someone should be buying the mods a case of beer for dealing with this one.

I knew I wasn't going to match your pace here, and trying would just have been asking for trouble, so I held the door wide open until you clued in.  :D Only cost a few seconds, if that.

edit: I would also like to see this track on the calendar again, maybe the 65 Pro series?

I like this track too! I knew I would. Like the Isle of Man I had been saving it for future enjoyment.

I'm starting to know the track well. It took me about 40-50 laps over 2 or 3 years to recognize all the turns. I did some more practice after the race and I still completely forgot where I was one time. I also did that once during the race.

It's going to take a lot more practice to get everything I can out of the car and get the setup as good as I feel is possible. I've got the MS7 down to 3:32.80 now. I still think I can cut that time by 2 seconds. I'm starting to think that breaking 3:30 might be possible.

I'm really looking forward to flying through the Irish countryside in a 67 312 and 71 M8F. It's going to be a blast to tame those two beasts on this track!

Thanks guys for getting me on a track that's making me obsessed. These types of tracks do that to me more than any other. Nothing seems to be more fun for me than roaring through the countryside with lots of hills and turns.

I wouldn't say that. Rob was behind Rog and further to the right and he missed my car. After Dave hit me the only part of my car on the track was the LF tire. Iestyn made it by with little trouble too. Rog shouldn't have moved to the left and Jethro's very impatient at times. Jethro hasn't learned you have to be very cautious and patient with Rog? I learned that at Jarama like I learned in my 1st race at Lime Rock with Francesco. And Dave's car was thrown off the track out of everybody's way. I'm totally responsible for Dave's wreck but I won't claim responsibility for Rog and Jethro's collision. I think it's much more attributed to Rog's overreaction and Jethro's impatience. I wish I hadn't screwed up though. I'd like to have seen what might happen at Deer's Leap had I not made the flagman present the yellow just before the turn to Deer's Leap. :)

Yeah, Dave did a good job with the lousy situation he was presented. He tried to move left to avoid me and probably didn't move as much as he'd like since you were beside him. Dave probably would have been better off if he continued straight forward and shoved me out of the way. His car may not have rolled then. I'm extremely pleased to see Dave get a good result after the difficulty I caused him.

Another reminder that those in charge here, should know the rules.  If rules are changed, it would be nice to announce rule changes, so that rule makers do not gain an unfair advantage.  Race what you practice - practice what you . . . ?

Which wouldn't have happened without Bernie checking up (too much IMO, but hindsight) because of Dave's wreck?  ::)

Then Rob wouldn't have slowed so much, and Fran wouldn't have tried to pass him there, and Marco wouldn't have tried to pass them BOTH, and...

You started it. Others made it worse. Some will learn from the punishments.

Oh the mods will have a field day with that incident.... I owe Bernie a massive apology for not checking up earlier and ruining his race.