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UKGPL => UKGPL Races => Topic started by: Turkey Machine on December 04, 2017, 07:08:11 PM +0000



Title: UKGPL Season 32 (2017-18) 1955 Grand Prix - Aintree - Dec 5
Post by: Turkey Machine on December 04, 2017, 07:08:11 PM +0000
Aintree is undoubtedly famous for the iconic Grand National horse race but for several years it reverberated to the sound of horses of a different kind. The circuit was built in 1954 and hosted the Formula One British Grand Prix five times, in 1955, 1957, 1959, 1961 and 1962. Stirling Moss, driving a Mercedes, won his first British Grand Prix at Aintree in 1955.  It was the first time a British driver had won his home Grand Prix. The first British driver / British car victory in a British Grand Prix was also at Aintree in 1957, when Stirling Moss and Tony Brooks shared a Vanwall. Quite why Grand Prix racing stopped at Aintree is unclear.  The close proximity of housing may have been a factor but the circuit would no doubt have needed to improve safety standards.  The original track can still be seen, and driven on, today. The lack of any run-off areas in the section to the west of the Melling Road all too apparent. The section to the east of the Melling Road which is wide open and relatively safe is still in regular use for motorcycle racing.



Race List =  iGOR
Server = TBA
IP Address = see in iGOR
Race date = 05-12-2017
GPL mod = 1955 F1
60fps patch used = 60fpsV2newmod
Track = Aintree (http://srmz.net/index.php?showtopic=1284#entry8476)
Qualification = 20:45  UK time -> 45min
Race = race starts at ~21:30 UK time
Race length = ~50 min -> 25 laps
Damage Model = Intermediate
Replay = here (https://www.sendspace.com/file/oudsl8)

Password: see above (#post_event_password)

Driver lists can be found on the championship standings page (https://www.simracing.org.uk/smf/index.php?action=LM2R&group=620&theme=6)

The full time drivers can start to practice as soon as the server is available.  Reserve drivers can also join as soon as the server becomes available but must leave the server with 35 minutes of qualifying left, for a total of 5 minutes; this will allow any remaining full timers to join.  If there is enough space on the grid, the reserve drivers will be able to rejoin when there are 30 mins of qualifying left.  

This Season we don't have a Red Zone. Moderating will be on reported incidents only. If you haven't received a PM about an incident before the link below the results table is removed, you can be sure that you will not appear in the moderator's report.

The chassis token system is explained on the 55's standings page. Please ensure you choose a chassis that is within your budget, see the table below.

Please restrict chat to pit messages including at the end of the race until ALL drivers still racing have crossed the line.

Password: see above (#post_event_password)

Available Tokens:
Note: These are the tokens available to each driver before the 10 tokens are added for making the race start.

DriverTokensStatus
Robert Fleurke
10
Pro
EvilClive
16
Pro
Ronniepeterson
19
Pro
DLogan
10
Pro
FullMetalGasket
17
Pro
Doni Yourth
20
Pro
Clive Loynes
15
Pro
Samb
27
Pro
MagicArsouille
10
Pro
Turkey Machine
10
Pro
GregT
23
Pro
Carlos Cendejas
5
Pro
Cookie
1
Pro
Billy Nobrakes
16
Am
maddog
15
Am
bagrupp
2
Am
Geoff65
20
Am
Jeep
20
Am
Gareth
15
Am
Rainier
14
Am
Phil Thornton
7
Am
dave curtis
10
Am
francesco
10
Am
ReiverEcosse
15
Am
Syd Drake
20
Am
Will Tway
18
Am
miner2049er
15
Am


Title: Re: UKGPL Season 32 (2017-18) 1955 Grand Prix - Aintree - Dec 5
Post by: ReiverEcosse on December 04, 2017, 09:10:39 PM +0000
Well this is just horrible for melting the brakes.  Worse than Monaco.  I'm taking the Connaught out and even it's meager power is tough to get stopped.  My best lap time is enough to beat the actual Connaughts that qualified for the 1955 event . . . I don't think that's much to write home about though.


Title: Re: UKGPL Season 32 (2017-18) 1955 Grand Prix - Aintree - Dec 5
Post by: Clive Loynes on December 04, 2017, 09:22:06 PM +0000
You are correct that the brakes need special management here Alex.

Also, you have to hope that the bloke behind has managed his too or you are probably going to be shunted!

I also find it a challenge to keep the engine in one piece!


Title: Re: UKGPL Season 32 (2017-18) 1955 Grand Prix - Aintree - Dec 5
Post by: FullMetalGasket on December 05, 2017, 07:03:40 AM +0000
You must be driving a Gordini tonight then Clive ;)
That's the only car I've found to be especially fragile, you must keep it out of the red!.

And I agree, Aintree is a bugger on brakes. The speed advantage to cars with better brakes is huge (I wouldn't put the Connaught in that group by the way Alex).
In the fun race here I was able to take pole fairly comfortably from Tris in his Lancia, but couldn't live with him in the race in my Ferrari as he had much better brake performance than me.
I went back after the race and did a trial,  my fastest lap in a Lancia was slightly quicker at qualifying speeds, at race pace I was almost a second a lap up in the D50  :o


Title: Re: UKGPL Season 32 (2017-18) 1955 Grand Prix - Aintree - Dec 5
Post by: Billy Nobrakes on December 05, 2017, 07:16:52 AM +0000
Don't forget the Monza fun race at 8.30 tonight
 We would like a good turnout to test connectivity on UKGPL9. As a special  treat you can drive something with functional brakes.


Title: Re: UKGPL Season 32 (2017-18) 1955 Grand Prix - Aintree - Dec 5
Post by: ReiverEcosse on December 05, 2017, 08:17:46 AM +0000
Don't forget the Monza fun race at 8.30 tonight
 We would like a good turnout to test connectivity on UKGPL9. As a special  treat you can drive something with functional brakes.

 ;D

A little early for me I'm afraid, I won't be in until closer to 9.


Title: Re: UKGPL Season 32 (2017-18) 1955 Grand Prix - Aintree - Dec 5
Post by: ReiverEcosse on December 05, 2017, 08:18:37 AM +0000
(I wouldn't put the Connaught in that group by the way Alex).

Nevertheless the Connaught it shall be!  It's part of my grand unifying plan to be able to crash at the highest possible speed at Monza.


Title: Re: UKGPL Season 32 (2017-18) 1955 Grand Prix - Aintree - Dec 5
Post by: Clive Loynes on December 05, 2017, 10:21:47 AM +0000
You must be driving a Gordini tonight then Clive ;)


Nope.

Been detonating Vanwalls.  But I have given it longer legs since then.


Title: Re: UKGPL Season 32 (2017-18) 1955 Grand Prix - Aintree - Dec 5
Post by: FullMetalGasket on December 05, 2017, 06:21:49 PM +0000
I'm going to try and make this, I've got a horrible case of lurgy though so it's anyones guess if I'll finish!
I'll probably miss the test race as a result, I doubt I'll be able to concentrate for both


Title: Re: UKGPL Season 32 (2017-18) 1955 Grand Prix - Aintree - Dec 5
Post by: Clive Loynes on December 05, 2017, 08:20:04 PM +0000
I'm going to try and make this, I've got a horrible case of lurgy though so it's anyones guess if I'll finish!
I'll probably miss the test race as a result, I doubt I'll be able to concentrate for both

Beware the wounded alien!    :eek:


Title: Re: UKGPL Season 32 (2017-18) 1955 Grand Prix - Aintree - Dec 5
Post by: miner2049er on December 05, 2017, 08:57:30 PM +0000
Nope.

Been detonating Vanwalls.  But I have given it longer legs since then.

I'm taking the Vanwall here, I love the sound and it goes OK but I've yet to blow an engine, even with some generous use of engine braking, rather than engine breaking.


Title: Re: UKGPL Season 32 (2017-18) 1955 Grand Prix - Aintree - Dec 5
Post by: Clive Loynes on December 05, 2017, 10:39:16 PM +0000
Kept it together, it was me that fell apart.

Kept the revs below 7,000 in top and all was well.

Grats to Tim, Sam and Will.

Two daft early spins cost me dear.  But if it were easy I wouldn't be interested.  ;-)


Title: Re: UKGPL Season 32 (2017-18) 1955 Grand Prix - Aintree - Dec 5
Post by: bagrupp on December 06, 2017, 10:06:53 AM +0000
Came together with Axel at the start and had to s/r.
Bad start, difficult track and Gordini...hoped for more.
Too many spins and an engine blower...couldn't get worse.


Title: Re: UKGPL Season 32 (2017-18) 1955 Grand Prix - Aintree - Dec 5
Post by: EvilClive on December 06, 2017, 10:41:48 AM +0000
OK, so my blood pressure has returned to ( almost) normal levels and my post here will not contain so many expletives that I get banned from the forum for life!  :-\

Last lap and closing on Tim after about 15 laps of sustained pushing and 10/10ths driving. Got to the level crossing at T2 with Tim clearly in sight, there might be an opportunity for a lunge at the end of the lap?? to take the win. Maybe, maybe not.

Win 10 decided NOT!!! and dumped me to BSOD!!! :censored: :taz: :taz: :taz: :taz: :censored: :censored: :censored:

It is bad enough when it happens during the first few laps, but to have survived 95% of the race and had a tremendous fight with Tim, being dumped like that is hard to take  >:(

More investigations on the web this a.m. suggests that it might be Nvidia drivers?? or the Logitech driver, although I felt that I had explored that avenue already??

Grats to Tim who was very quick in his Fezza and took full advantage of my brain fade ( combined with brake fade ) at around lap 10 to escape my attentions.
Once I got my head back together and remembered how this car/setup should be driven I started to close the gap (with the help of a few backmarkers  ::) ). The last lap could have been epic as I was finding that the car was getting quicker and quicker...or maybe that was me?

Grats to all those who finished, see y'all next time.


Title: Re: UKGPL Season 32 (2017-18) 1955 Grand Prix - Aintree - Dec 5
Post by: Billy Nobrakes on December 06, 2017, 11:56:45 AM +0000
If not for braking, corners & other traffic I might be quite good with the 55s. Unfortunately Aintree had lots of these complicating factors. The odd lap of 2.07 demonstrated what was possible & I quite liked the little Vanwall. Even managed not to break it.


Title: Re: UKGPL Season 32 (2017-18) 1955 Grand Prix - Aintree - Dec 5
Post by: miner2049er on December 06, 2017, 12:36:10 PM +0000
I broke mine. Blew 2 engines in fact, having never blown one in practise. The second time I expected it as I dropped it to 1st as I was about to go into a wall anyway.

Qualified OK and the early race was good, getting up to 4th, but I made too many mistakes and blew 2 engines which dropped me right down the field. Had the pace to do much better but it wasn't to be.

I do like the Vanwall but I struggled with the brakes, particularly at Cottage where I collected Fran and later Billy. I almost took Evil out as he lapped me as well but I headed towards the outside so I would have my own accident and not collect him if it went wrong.

The problem with races in this mod is that you know where you can brake but not where anybody else can brake as you don't know how their brakes are which makes it tricky to start a pass under braking.

It's fun but I'm still getting used to it.

Monza will be a very different prospect.


Title: Re: UKGPL Season 32 (2017-18) 1955 Grand Prix - Aintree - Dec 5
Post by: FullMetalGasket on December 06, 2017, 01:02:02 PM +0000
Utterly gutted for you Clive. That was an epic battle for the first 10 laps or so  ;D
I'm not sure how much of your brain fade was entirely self inflicted though - I'd been saving my brakes in a lot of spots so I could lunge at you in others and keep you on your toes ;)
When you ran wide and had to check up entering the S/F straight it was like a gift from the gods!
I'd been running steadily enough that I could push you hard for a few corners before returning to my normal brake preservation, and you fought back just as hard as I'd hoped  :P

A few corners later and all that extra heat got you.

Once you'd dropped way back I returned to full brake management. It looks like I was lapping in the 2:03, and sometimes 2:02's.
Yet again I let ego get in the way of what should have become an easy win and decided to go for a FL. Cue doing a lap and a half gently without using the brakes before going hell for leather to see what I could manage! Unfortunatly I dropped a good 6 or 7 seconds back towards Clive while performing the cool down...
The shocking part is that Clive's fastest lap was a few tenths slower and was done at normal race pace :o
Had you been driving at that pace earlier you'd have dropped me like a stone - 2:02 is the absolute limit for the 625 here I think, and would have left me with no brakes to fight with had the opportunity arisen.

I'm impressed at Sam's climb back up the order after his record attempt at trackside parking.

Well done to everyone that made it to the end - Aintree is probably the most difficult track we race at for the 55's IMO

Hopefully Clive will finally have his Win10 installation excised by the next round  :(



Title: Re: UKGPL Season 32 (2017-18) 1955 Grand Prix - Aintree - Dec 5
Post by: Clive Loynes on December 06, 2017, 01:50:43 PM +0000


Monza will be a very different prospect.

It is but you still have to preserve brakes for Parabolica.


Title: Re: UKGPL Season 32 (2017-18) 1955 Grand Prix - Aintree - Dec 5
Post by: GregT on December 06, 2017, 02:55:52 PM +0000
Congrats Tim, Sam, and Will!

I'm glad that's finished. I'd call it uneventful for me, except multiple spins.

You'd think I might be good at this mod since I have a road car that needs it's brake fluid replaced more often than it's brake pads. I can run a decent lap occasionally and I can run a decent pace sometimes. But any variation and I start struggling. If I set the cruise control, I'm good. If I try to increase my speed a little, I usually spin.

I'm glad to see Sam recover well from an early mistake. It's sad to see Clive suffer such misfortune. I'm glad Clive L managed to avoid me when I spun in front of him. I moved right to get off the track for him but he was passing me on the right in the grass. I was very relieved you made it by without me wrecking you. I guess you left me a car's width of room off the side of the track.

I think I've amassed enough tokens to finish the season in an open wheel Mercedes. I'll try to practice more for the remaining races. For other's sake, I need to have better control of my car. I could/should be closer to Tim, Clive, and Sam?

Tim, I'm surprised you took another chance at throwing away a win. Clive and Sam might be the only ones that would argue that you're not the fastest.

Thank guys. I hope to see you next time.


Title: Re: UKGPL Season 32 (2017-18) 1955 Grand Prix - Aintree - Dec 5
Post by: Will Tway on December 06, 2017, 03:35:07 PM +0000
I can't ever recall a disco on the last lap. So sorry Evil. The ultimate evil of gpl or the worst of two evils. lol

Glad to be back after a short recess. Super fun circuit which requires massive concentration. Smooth race in Connaught. I had no chance against Sam so I just cruised along happy to take 4th...

Hope to be back in Italy in a few weeks with plenty of tokens in my pocket..... ;)

Cheers,

Will


Title: Re: UKGPL Season 32 (2017-18) 1955 Grand Prix - Aintree - Dec 5
Post by: FullMetalGasket on December 06, 2017, 04:25:58 PM +0000
Tim, I'm surprised you took another chance at throwing away a win. Clive and Sam might be the only ones that would argue that you're not the fastest.

It's not me trying to argue I'm fastest, it's me trying to put under-powered cars on the lap record boards  ;)
If I'd continued at a normal safe race pace then my best lap would have been a second or more slower than Sam and Clive - I think a high 2:01 somehow squeaked in on one of my normal laps.

I'd judged it to be a safe gamble as Clive was 13 seconds back when I started my cooldown lap. I really didn't expect him to find the secret Waza brake bucket under his seat and to start putting in consistant 2:01's and 2:00s!

If anything that was the worst part of Clive's disco for me. I was a couple of seconds clear entering the last lap and just catching a pair of backmarkers who were 2 wide and fighting, the last lap was likely to be incredibly intense had it not been rudely cancelled :(


Title: Re: UKGPL Season 32 (2017-18) 1955 Grand Prix - Aintree - Dec 5
Post by: Samb on December 06, 2017, 04:48:57 PM +0000
Congrats to Tim for a fine win! Commiserations to Clive for that last lap disco. That was especially cruel given your PC troubles recently.

My race was a case of what if. I used my previous setup from a fun race in the Maserati and the 'improvements' I made, made the car worse frankly  ::). It was only when I reverted the changes at the end of quali allowed me to vault up to third on the grid.

Made a good start to pass Clive into second on the first lap, but threw it all away with a silly spin and overheating brakes..... Rejoined the circuit plum last, but it did set the scene for a fun recovery drive. Apologies to anyone whom I passed somewhat desperately. It was overheating brakes and avoiding action more than anything! About a third of the way through the race I experimented with engine braking into the hairpins, shifting down into first gear. It worked a treat lap time wise, and the poor Maserati motor held tough despite the mistreatment I was giving it. If only I could have figured that out before the race started, but of well.

Ended up in 3rd, despite a late spin, but that became an undeserved 2nd after Clive's demise. Had I not binned it on the first lap, perhaps I could have joined Tim & Clive's battle up front but it was not to be.

Has anyone had the issue of a more rearward brake bias, the quicker the brakes seem to overheat?! Maybe it's just me...


Title: Re: UKGPL Season 32 (2017-18) 1955 Grand Prix - Aintree - Dec 5
Post by: Doni Yourth on December 06, 2017, 07:05:58 PM +0000
Grats on the fine win, Tim!  Splendid recovery from the Lap01 spin, Sam.  Great run by Will for a podium.  Dave a good job for P6.

Oh, Clive!  Robbed hardly describes it.  :(  So sad to learn this but even so, you still finished ahead of me!  LOL!

I had a good run with a terrific duel with Fran.  I chased him closely for 15 laps or so til he slid wide in T1 and spun.  He recovered quickly to give me concerns over the last couple of laps.  And poor Ray...  A gift and clearly just not your day.

I had a couple of incidents.  On Lap01, I thought that Dave was leaving the door opening for me at T2 but no, he arced down for the apex and I had skip over the grass on the inside to miss him.  On Lap03, Dean gave me a fright with a jam up the arse going into the Melling complex which cost a ton of time.  Lucky to be able to continue without apparent damage.

As a comentary to our two events here in just three days, I present the following stats and ask...

What's wrong with this?

------------------------------------------------------
GP55's
Track: Aintree             Tue Dec 05 16:33:46 2017
ON TRACK LAPS
Driver                           Laps/Total    Percent
 Doni55                             (21/23)      91.30
Will Tway55                         (15/24)      62.50
fran55 Molteni                      (15/23)      65.22
Dave Rainier55                      (14/24)      58.33
Tim Muttram55                       (12/24)      50.00
Sam Blood                            (8/24)      33.33
Clive Loynes55                       (7/24)      29.17
Ronnie Peterson                      (7/23)      30.43
Reiver Ecosse                        (7/22)      31.82
Billy Nobrakes55                     (6/22)      27.27
Mike James55                         (6/22)      27.27
Greg 55 Taber                        (5/24)      20.83
Dean Logan 55                        (3/23)      13.04
Axel Cookie                           (1/1)     100.00
Bastian Grupp                        (1/23)       4.34
 55evil                              (0/23)       0.00

------------------------------------------------------
GP 66's Historic
Track: Aintree             Sun Dec 03 18:06:20 2017
ON TRACK LAPS
Driver                           Laps/Total    Percent
 Doni66                             (25/25)     100.00
Tim Muttram66                       (18/25)      72.00
Dave Rainier66                      (16/20)      80.00
Alessandro Isacchini                (15/25)      60.00
Andreas Gebhardt                    (14/25)      56.00
Dean Logan 66                       (11/25)      44.00
Bastian Grupp                       (11/25)      44.00
Phil Thornton66                      (8/19)      42.11
Arf ArfArf66                         (4/25)      16.00
Axel Cookie                          (4/11)      36.36
Fulvio Policardi-66                  (3/25)      12.00
J. JonnyO                             (1/9)      11.11


Title: Re: UKGPL Season 32 (2017-18) 1955 Grand Prix - Aintree - Dec 5
Post by: Clive Loynes on December 06, 2017, 07:11:28 PM +0000


Has anyone had the issue of a more rearward brake bias, the quicker the brakes seem to overheat?! Maybe it's just me...

It appears to me that the front and rear brake fade are independent but when I voiced this opinion I was told that it was all in my head!

With a forward brake bias the fronts fade quicker.  Then you find that the rears lock up, because they are still working, and you are offski!


Title: Re: UKGPL Season 32 (2017-18) 1955 Grand Prix - Aintree - Dec 5
Post by: FullMetalGasket on December 06, 2017, 07:39:38 PM +0000
I tend to run a higher rear bias - this seems to help when brake fase starts as I have enough rear braking to at least initiate a slide.
It's not too great for an actual braking power point of view, but outside of qualifying that seems irrelevant here  ;D


Title: Re: UKGPL Season 32 (2017-18) 1955 Grand Prix - Aintree - Dec 5
Post by: EvilClive on December 06, 2017, 10:07:44 PM +0000

All my quali was done on race fuel, so to be second on the grid was a confidence boost and I was looking forward to giving Tim something to worry about  ;) as he is definitely "the man to beat" IMHO with these cars.

FWIW Tim, I had no need to preserve my brakes if I drove the car as the setup required. It did require that my downshifts/braking points and lines were correct for each lap. I could maintain 2:01 laps with brakes only going red at one point and that was just before the turn onto the straight...which is where I screwed up in front of Tim. All I had to do was be careful there.......simples!!
As the chase after Tim proved, I did not need "cool down" laps as my brakes fully recovered within the length of the straight, and I could push on for lap after lap.

This makes the the Windows 10 crash all the more annoying  :-\


Title: Re: UKGPL Season 32 (2017-18) 1955 Grand Prix - Aintree - Dec 5
Post by: francesco on December 06, 2017, 10:48:18 PM +0000
Quote
I had a good run with a terrific duel with Fran.
Yes was a battle but without my error ,probably,i was the winner.The Fer 625 is not the best car(and also the pilot)but your Gordini don't give you good chance for an overtake ;D.I have suffered with the brakes,was the same for you?
My compliments to all that have done times under 2,05,a dream for me.


Title: Re: UKGPL Season 32 (2017-18) 1955 Grand Prix - Aintree - Dec 5
Post by: Clive Loynes on December 07, 2017, 07:25:57 AM +0000

All my quali was done on race fuel, so to be second on the grid was a confidence boost and I was looking forward to giving Tim something to worry about  ;) as he is definitely "the man to beat" IMHO with these cars.

FWIW Tim, I had no need to preserve my brakes if I drove the car as the setup required. It did require that my downshifts/braking points and lines were correct for each lap. I could maintain 2:01 laps with brakes only going red at one point and that was just before the turn onto the straight...which is where I screwed up in front of Tim. All I had to do was be careful there.......simples!!
As the chase after Tim proved, I did not need "cool down" laps as my brakes fully recovered within the length of the straight, and I could push on for lap after lap.

This makes the the Windows 10 crash all the more annoying  :-\


Hard luck about the Windows10 crash.

Your brake management sounds interesting though.  I don't have any brakes to use on Canal Curve and I don't use any at Waterway either.  My brakes were stable so long as I wasn't following anyone closely as that causes my left foot to keep dabbing the brakes on when I sense that I'm going to hit him.

I must look at the replay to see what you are up to.  These beasts require me to drive in an entirely different manner to my usual approach.  To me, they seem to require "chucking" into corners sideways.  This caused one of my "offs" as when I was trying to recover my brakes after passing someone I backed off and forgot to chuck.  So I ran out of road.




Title: Re: UKGPL Season 32 (2017-18) 1955 Grand Prix - Aintree - Dec 5
Post by: EvilClive on December 07, 2017, 09:46:27 AM +0000
Probably I am chucking my car at the corner in a far more sideways manner than I think I do.  ::) ::)(I rarely watch replays, especially my own!! Far too scary!   :scared:).

There are a few corners at Aintree where I try and avoid using any brakes ( or just a single quick dab to be sure ), relying on a downshift and a sideways flick to lose enough speed to get through the corner.
I did notice that my 250F was much quicker through the hedges and the Esses at the end of the straight than Tim's Fezza, perhaps the Maserati is just more balanced?? I was dropping to 4th just after the first white marker board before the hedge and keeping some power on to force some oversteer until I was straightened up for the Esses. A quick downshift to 3rd ( no brakes)  and a squirt through the right/left before a drop to 2nd and a good stomp on the barkes to hook up the inside line around the final corner.

Yes Clive, I do find that these cars require a different approach/style to extract the quickest lap times. There is definitely a need to scrub off speed either with the gearbox or the tyres and I find that it I have to be almost nail my braking foot to the leg of the desk to avoid the temptation to dab the brakes just to balance the car like I do in the other mods. Those tiny touches on the brake pedal can just destroy any chance of preserving brakes for when you really need them. I think it is that restriction which dictates a change in driving style.
 For me that means picking my braking points, and sticking to them, but always with an eye on that dashboard in case the light has turned red for whatever reason and then giving myself an extra 10 metres to slow the beast. Also, unlike my usual style, I try and avoid braking deep into corners and rather get off the brakes to allow the car to almost coast into the corner? before picking up the gas and balancing the power on oversteer to pull the car around and get a quick exit.

I should really spend more time with these cars and develop some base setups. The only cars that I have seriously worked with so far are the Connaught, Mazza 250F and the Lancia. I am hoping that a similar approach to setups and driving might work well with most of the other cars with the possible exception of the Gordini?


Title: Re: UKGPL Season 32 (2017-18) 1955 Grand Prix - Aintree - Dec 5
Post by: Clive Loynes on December 07, 2017, 03:55:57 PM +0000
Probably I am chucking my car at the corner in a far more sideways manner than I think I do.  ::) ::)(I rarely watch replays, especially my own!! Far too scary!   :scared:).



I tried to watch but it made me feel ill!


Title: Re: UKGPL Season 32 (2017-18) 1955 Grand Prix - Aintree - Dec 5
Post by: FullMetalGasket on December 07, 2017, 05:42:24 PM +0000
There are a few corners at Aintree where I try and avoid using any brakes ( or just a single quick dab to be sure ), relying on a downshift and a sideways flick to lose enough speed to get through the corner.
Same here, although this is another reason for my heavier than normal rear bias as I properly back the car in like a rally car. From the replay I can see you look unusually tame in comparison ;D

I did notice that my 250F was much quicker through the hedges and the Esses at the end of the straight than Tim's Fezza, perhaps the Maserati is just more balanced?? I was dropping to 4th just after the first white marker board before the hedge and keeping some power on to force some oversteer until I was straightened up for the Esses. A quick downshift to 3rd ( no brakes)  and a squirt through the right/left before a drop to 2nd and a good stomp on the barkes to hook up the inside line around the final corner.
That was a different approach to the corner I think, and also to brake management. You generate heat more quickly at higher speeds as the energy you're shedding is proportionately higher, so I coast from one of the hedges before the brake markers until I can select 4th for engine braking and then maybe tap the brakes before giving some power to make the turn.
This also gives me a better line into the 2nd chicane and gives a good drift angle when I have to come off the power again - all that energy has been shed through the tires and gearbox so much less is generated during braking. Something that's critical in the Ferrari's and other mid/low ranking cars.
I also noticed that I was taking the 2nd chicane faster and it allowed me to more than make up any advantage you pulled on me in the 1st chicane and kept me on the track for the most part :P


Title: Re: UKGPL Season 32 (2017-18) 1955 Grand Prix - Aintree - Dec 5
Post by: Clive Loynes on December 07, 2017, 07:50:44 PM +0000

That was a different approach to the corner I think, and also to brake management. You generate heat more quickly at higher speeds as the energy you're shedding is proportionately higher, so I coast from one of the hedges before the brake markers until I can select 4th for engine braking and then maybe tap the brakes before giving some power to make the turn.



I'm on board with the theory but just not brave enough in all places to go for it!  The Melling Crossing being one of them!  OK. I'm a wimp!


Title: Re: UKGPL Season 32 (2017-18) 1955 Grand Prix - Aintree - Dec 5
Post by: Phil Thornton on December 07, 2017, 08:23:44 PM +0000
I've loaded the chassis the drivers used into the token calculator spreadsheet.  For the next race the available tokens will be as declared in the table below (the table will also appear in the next race announcement).  The calculated values are automated but selecting the cars is a manual process so please check your tokens to make sure I haven't made a silly error.  There was no token overspend for this round so no one is disqualified.

Available Tokens:
Note: These are the tokens available to each driver before the 10 tokens are added for making the race start.

Driver   TokensStatus
Robert Fleurke   
5
Pro
EvilClive
14
Pro
Ronniepeterson
29
Pro
DLogan
20
Pro
FullMetalGasket
17
Pro
Doni Yourth
30
Pro
Clive Loynes
15
Pro
Samb
25
Pro
MagicArsouille
10
Pro
Turkey Machine
3
Pro
GregT
33
Pro
Carlos Cendejas
5
Pro
Cookie
11
Pro
Billy Nobrakes   
16
Am
maddog
15
Am
bagrupp
12
Am
Geoff65
10
Am
Jeep
10
Am
Gareth
15
Am
Rainier
19
Am
Phil Thornton
7
Am
dave curtis
10
Am
francesco   
10
Am
ReiverEcosse
20
Am
Syd Drake
10
Am
Will Tway
23
Am
miner2049er
15
Am


Title: Re: UKGPL Season 32 (2017-18) 1955 Grand Prix - Aintree - Dec 5
Post by: EvilClive on December 07, 2017, 09:40:22 PM +0000
I can't ever recall a disco on the last lap. So sorry Evil. The ultimate evil of gpl or the worst of two evils. lol

Glad to be back after a short recess. Super fun circuit which requires massive concentration. Smooth race in Connaught. I had no chance against Sam so I just cruised along happy to take 4th...

Hope to be back in Italy in a few weeks with plenty of tokens in my pocket..... ;)

Cheers,

Will

Great to see you back Will. Looking forward to locking wheels with you on track if Mr Gates and Win 10 allows  ::)


Title: Re: UKGPL Season 32 (2017-18) 1955 Grand Prix - Aintree - Dec 5
Post by: Clive Loynes on December 07, 2017, 11:14:27 PM +0000
My money is on Bill Gates!   :P


Title: Re: UKGPL Season 32 (2017-18) 1955 Grand Prix - Aintree - Dec 5
Post by: EvilClive on December 07, 2017, 11:32:26 PM +0000
 :-\ He does appear to be holding all the aces at the moment  :-\


Title: Re: UKGPL Season 32 (2017-18) 1955 Grand Prix - Aintree - Dec 5
Post by: Clive Loynes on December 08, 2017, 09:43:32 AM +0000
:-\ He does appear to be holding all the aces at the moment  :-\

However, I must thank you so much for ably demonstrating that I just do not have the time to contemplate Windows10 at the moment.  No matter how much I might like the idea of a new PC, it just isn't possible!


Title: Re: UKGPL Season 32 (2017-18) 1955 Grand Prix - Aintree - Dec 5
Post by: Will Tway on December 08, 2017, 03:48:33 PM +0000
Evil, Excited to be back. As for Mr. Gates, I ditched 10 and reverted back to 7 which has made a world of difference. I'm sure you know this though. lol

Good luck!!!!

Will


Title: Re: UKGPL Season 32 (2017-18) 1955 Grand Prix - Aintree - Dec 5
Post by: Ronniepeterson on December 09, 2017, 03:38:42 PM +0000

I had a good run with a terrific duel with Fran.  I chased him closely for 15 laps or so til he slid wide in T1 and spun.  He recovered quickly to give me concerns over the last couple of laps.  And poor Ray...  A gift and clearly just not your day.


I was stunned to see yourself and Fran I think closing I really thought the race was over  and panicked when I saw we had one lap to go. But good fun. This circuit is a corner cutting festival and I'm not sure it should be used in its current form.


Title: Re: UKGPL Season 32 (2017-18) 1955 Grand Prix - Aintree - Dec 5
Post by: Doni Yourth on December 09, 2017, 04:16:41 PM +0000
And, Ray, that's exactly why I posted the 'On Track' laps charts from our two recent races.  I think that it's appalling to not achieve at least 90% of laps without going off the road even here at Aintree.  Sure, we all make mistakes and sometimes get shunted off but the number of runners that I see cutting corners...especially at Melling...is really disappointing.  And I'm being kind in saying that.


Title: Re: UKGPL Season 32 (2017-18) 1955 Grand Prix - Aintree - Dec 5
Post by: EvilClive on December 09, 2017, 04:45:36 PM +0000
Although I do understand your point of view Doni and applaud your driving standard, the rules only say that 2 wheels should stay on the tarmac at all times.
So, clipping an apex and risking putting two wheels on the grass is "legal".
IMHO Occasional misjudgements are acceptable, as is running wide on the exit and ploughing furrows across the grass.

However, deliberate and consistent corner cutting ( 4 wheels OFF the track ) is not legal and could be penalised by the moderators under our current guidelines.

As an aside here, it might be considered a shame that GPL does not have the same inbuilt monitoring that GTL does, where it monitors corner cutting and 3 transgressions in a race will get you an automatic SnG. Failure to comply results in an automatic DQ.


Title: Re: UKGPL Season 32 (2017-18) 1955 Grand Prix - Aintree - Dec 5
Post by: Cookie on December 09, 2017, 08:43:23 PM +0000
I agree with Clive to be in the limits as long as 2 wheels are on the tarmac!

There are some tracks where the groove line definitely is at some points just within this limit!

I often wondered that when I was thinking to have made a clean lap the report said "off track" an vice versa...
To me it seems very unpredictable how the track limits are seen by GPL. Maybe we have to ask some track maker like Ginetto.  

PS
GPL tracks have build in checkpoints! You get black flags when you go over the limit there!
I still remember my first online league race at Silverstone when I got a DQ for such a violation...


Title: Re: UKGPL Season 32 (2017-18) 1955 Grand Prix - Aintree - Dec 5
Post by: Phil Thornton on December 09, 2017, 10:16:11 PM +0000
GPL tracks have build in checkpoints! You get black flags when you go over the limit there!
I still remember my first online league race at Silverstone when I got a DQ for such a violation...
We've tended to run league races with checkpoints disabled (it is an option in IGOR) because internet lag can generate false black flags. We could try a race with checkpoints enabled given that modern connections are much better now??????


Title: Re: UKGPL Season 32 (2017-18) 1955 Grand Prix - Aintree - Dec 5
Post by: Clive Loynes on December 10, 2017, 10:44:49 AM +0000
GPL tracks have build in checkpoints! You get black flags when you go over the limit there!
I still remember my first online league race at Silverstone when I got a DQ for such a violation...
We've tended to run league races with checkpoints disabled (it is an option in IGOR) because internet lag can generate false black flags. We could try a race with checkpoints enabled given that modern connections are much better now??????

Perhaps something to try out of season?


Title: Re: UKGPL Season 32 (2017-18) 1955 Grand Prix - Aintree - Dec 5
Post by: EvilClive on December 10, 2017, 12:01:49 PM +0000
Christmas fun race perhaps??


Title: Re: UKGPL Season 32 (2017-18) 1955 Grand Prix - Aintree - Dec 5
Post by: Clive Loynes on December 10, 2017, 12:59:02 PM +0000
Christmas fun race perhaps??


Thought that that was the '55 race at Monza10K.   ::)


Title: Re: UKGPL Season 32 (2017-18) 1955 Grand Prix - Aintree - Dec 5
Post by: miner2049er on December 10, 2017, 10:54:37 PM +0000
We've tended to run league races with checkpoints disabled (it is an option in IGOR) because internet lag can generate false black flags. We could try a race with checkpoints enabled given that modern connections are much better now??????

At tracks like Albi, it is very easy to get black flagged because the checkpoints aren't quite right at DD.