SimRacing.org.uk

Grid/server capacity: 22

Track: 70's Spa-Francorchamps

Cars allowed: Ferrari 512 S Coda Lunga

PM WT for track/car download pack which is required for this event.

Practice: ~19:20 GMT (60 mins)
Qualifying: 20:20 GMT (20 mins)
Race: 20:40 GMT (14 laps)

Time of Day Setting: 14:00
Start: STANDING
Tyre wear: Normal
Fuel consumption: Normal
Pit stops: Not Required

Server: simracing.org.uk Wednesday
Password: see above (#post_event_password)

Notes:
(1) It's best if all drivers can make sure they are connected before the Qualifying session as drivers on track during qualifying will not see cars that join after they are on track until they go back to the garage.
(2) Please make sure you are fully aware of the SimRacing.org.uk Rules.
(3) The AI control should be turned off so that you have control of the car at all times, including pitting. Your player file should therefore read
Autopit="0"
Force Autopit Off="1" // Forces autopit always off
No AI Control="1" // AI never has control over car
If you still finding pitting problematic, experience tells us that its less to do with positioning and more to do with approach speed. A slow approach to pit crew chief has proved most reliable.

Special Notes: None

Looks like it's donations time at SROUK again.

So instead of buying unnecessary gifts for a significant other, why not spend your money more wisely by offering us a festive donation.

Happy Christmas  ;)

I will splurge some cash when I fire up my other PC.....honestly I will  ::)

In the meantime does anyone have a setup for this dumb Ferrari double Lungo Expresso ( is that a coffee??) that does not destroy the front tyres within 1.5 laps??? The Race post says PIT STOPS not required!!! I am thinking someone is 'avin a larf!!  :hang:

Pit stops are not required for fuel.

You can pit as often as you want for anything else  ;)

Actually Clive my car is killing the rears  ??? ::) I am on the server. You can come if ya want.  ;D

Another restart Matt and Clive.

That was short. thanks to the restart, and I am strongly opposed to restarts except when there is catastrophic network failure
I rolled on the grid and got a stop go. so left. If you cause a crash then you caused a crash. We don't do restart here historically
If people think they can get a restart they take less care.

No words

I'll post tomorrow.

No comment  >:(

We've had restarts like that before, so it's not like this is a first. I'm OK with either, but that's why a question is raised in chat and people agree to it or not. From what I saw, most were OK with the first two restarts.

As for the third one, apologies for the mess my off caused at Stavelot. My car was completely wrecked in that one, which was surprising, as I thought we were running less damage. In any case, I assumed I was out for good but then someone raised the question to restart again and those running parked it.

At the very least it should've been decided what we were going to do, instead of just leaving half the grid on the server waiting without a clue what was going to happen.

This is a very risky (but awesome) car and track combination, and with half or more of the grid barely done any practice (by the looks of it), it's better to have restarts until the thing gets going, no? Even with practice it's just so easy to go off.

Perhaps we can have the pole position driver lead the way without any overtaking, for a rolling start at the exit of Les Combes or something?

As I have no free slots to reschedule this event it will be deleted.

The final results therefore are as the Championship table currently stands.

Very disappointing I know but there it is.

I agree with Matt Re: restarts. But If more than one driver calls for it I like to oblige.

I think that for 2022 I will rule that restarts will only be given for server/Internet issues.

Apologies for my contribution to the less than perfect starts, I really was trying my best not to screw things up. :angel-wings:

In mitigation, the dreaded FF gremlin was at work and try as I might I just could not control the tendency of the car to skew sideways without over correcting  :-\. Even if I suspect ( or even know) that the wheel is going to be super light, I have discovered that the ALT/F solution will not kick in until the car is rolling.

We have a similar issue in UKGPL with the 1971 Can Am cars where available horsepower overcomes any degree of horse sense and traction. After too many chaotic/traumatic starts from the grid, we now have rolling starts up to the exit of the bend that leads onto the first decent straight section. There are still fatalities but the total death toll is greatly reduced  ::)

Apologies to Tony and all. Everything started with my big mistake at the beginning. I will know from now on that restarts are not the solution. See you next time guys.

To all,
just calm down a bit at the start ! Would you rather do restarts and lose time (when allowed) or waste your race night ?
And also, Tony's races (GPL's too ) are in reduced damage !...
As in the races we simulate, you have to be reasonable and patient  ::)

One other issue with this car in particular was that if you are running behind someone else, you have almost zero visibility, and with the speeds involved, the level of grip, the way the car handles, and the treacherous track edges and objects, one small imprecision easily led to a tragic outcome.

Still though, extremely enjoyable to drive this around the old Spa. I wish we ran more cars like this one so we get used to them. Rolling start sounds like a better option too, for combinations like these.

Having watched the replays of both starts, I can see no problems  ???  (Apart perhaps from the cars rolling, but this can be mitigated by keeping it in neutral, and only pressing clutch and shift into 1st once the countdown is well under way)

The problems causing the restarts were all much later on the first laps, and I can't see a rolling start helping with preventing this.

Hristo's qual lap time yesterday was even more surreal than usual.  When you're on the edge of what you can do, seeing him lap 8 seconds quicker, is way beyond sobering.  Tried his provided setup - thanks - but found it near undriveable, surprisingly. Car was way too nervous and oversteery for me to handle, so makes his speed seem even more incomprehensible

Actually Erling, I was outside the circuit and there was no coming back, Also Daz and someone were victims of my mistake and I am sure they had a ton of damage.

Yes, but that wasn't at the start?  I saw you hit the stone wall and take out Daz, but that was at the start of the long straight

Yes, but on Lap 1 of 14.

Yes and I fail to see how a rolling start could have prevented this?

The idea was the rolling start to begin after that corner.

Hmmm, I see...  But then the 2nd incident, starting with Hristo, collecting me & everyone behind us, was further down the track.   Maybe just urge a bit of caution, especially on the 1st lap, with cold tyres - no need to win a 14-lap race on the 1st lap..

If nothing else it gives an appreciation of how dangerous it was to race around circuits like these in cars like these.....

No, you're right, some of the incidents wouldn't have been helped out by a rolling start and it's also why I wasn't expecting a 3rd restart after my off, but then because it caused others to crash, it made sense. My comments about the rolling start was mainly because of the 2nd start and just a suggestion in general with cars like this one.

As for my setup and lap time, it really was (similar to the hill climb event on Monday) down to experience with the track (I must have lapped it thousands of times in GPL) and the car handling very similar to GPL cars (despite it being a different sim). It's all about pedals control (especially throttle) with this car, to make it turn against its natural understeer / lack of grip. It's basically using the excessive power to push it forward instead of letting it drift to the side (which is what happens when you just lift up), so early braking and then throttle up all the way, well before the apex on many of the corners.

Here's my 3:06.5 cropped as highlights from my stream, you can see what I mean (with Dimitar talking to himself because I didn't set up my microphone right in OBS lol):

https://www.twitch.tv/videos/1235663094

Lost about 2 tenths at one place, but it felt pretty much on the limit.

The 2nd start looks weird in my replay - I'm the only one moving, driving straight through the cars ahead of me.  In the race, I couldn't see any other cars at all, wondering why I was alone on the grid/track, so something was obviously wrong.

Thanks for the explanation & video; will watch it later and possibly see if I can apply the technique you mention - maybe that requires the 'lively' setup you provided?

Yes, you need the car to rotate without having to turn the steering much, so you can carry more speed into the corners and also accelerate early (4 wheel drift). It's mostly about playing with the throttle. I guess it's more difficult if you're using proper right foot braking, blipping and manual clutch. I could never do it like that  :surrender:

Finally got round to trying this. Conclusion is that it requires a technique, skill and/or talent I simply don't pocess, or would require much much more practice to master.  With the loose setup, the car wallows from left to right all the time, even when just going in a straight line. Makes me fearful of getting too close to the track edges and getting trapped by those gravel strips (which happens repeatedly anyway), meaning I can't exploit the entire track.  The wallowing also makes it unstable under braking, with the rear often breaking away, so I have to compensate, losing time.  With power-on into, through and out of corners, it's mostly a toss between too much powerslide, often spinning, or the car pushing wide, off track and into those slowing gravel strips.  I just can't control it precisely enough.

Have to devote time to practice for tonight's race, so will have to let this rest for now.

For sure it's mostly down to technique than anything else, probably the transitions between turning and pressing the pedals. The wallowing sounds like what Dimitar complained about, so I wonder if his setup may suit you better.

It could be that you're turning too much (for the steering lock of the setup?) or too sharply. I usually try to make minimal movements with the steering. Also if you turn and at the same time lift up the throttle, the frontend would bite significantly and rotate the car too much. Another reason could be that you're actually not turning enough to produce a bit of understeer at the front and then only use the throttle to control how much the differential opens. Yet another reason is that you're not using any throttle under braking to compensate (I'm left foot braking and using throttle a lot sometimes, GPL habit...). All that about corner entry.

For corner exit, it has to be set up properly before the apex, with the car not going sideways too much, otherwise it would either understeer or snap oversteer. Again, I try to make it so there's minimum amount of steering involved once I press the throttle harder. In the transition before that, I play with the throttle a bit to search for the limit of traction.

I don't think it's a technique that is useful for all cars, in fact it can be detrimental with some cars, but it helps to have it in your arsenal.  ;D

Thanks for the added details Hristo. It definitely sounds like it's a very delicate balance that needs to be struck.  I left foot brake as well, and depending on car, may keep some throttle during braking, to keep the car under control - did that all race yesterday with the Datsun.  May need to try it as well with the Ferrari, but doubt it will be enough to solve my problems with mastering this.