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UKGPL => UKGPL Races => Topic started by: EvilClive on August 31, 2011, 09:04:33 PM +0100



Title: UKGPL Season 21 (2011) GT - Le Mans (Sarthe) - Sep 4
Post by: EvilClive on August 31, 2011, 09:04:33 PM +0100
The final round of our 1st GT Championship and we go to what must be the true home of these big GT's..Le Mans, on the famous Sarthe circuit. We race the 67 version of the track with the full Mulsanne straight. No "micky mouse" chicanes just pedal to the metal blast through the French countryside in cars that were designed and built just to win this 24hr endurance race.

We cannot run 24hrs but this final round will be a marathon for us....90 minutes instead of the usual 50 minutes. Maybe we will see the reliability factor eliminate some of the big cars and allow the slower but more reliable chassis to take some of the honours.

You all know the difficulties with the poor rear view in these cars so please be aware that the car in front maybe cannot see you and does not know you are there. Particularly on the first racing lap! The use of the "virtual mirror" may not be exactly historically accurate but it makes things a lot safer..it is your choice.

REMEMBER TO CHECK YOUR USAGE OF THE DIFFERENT CARS BETWEEN TEAM MEMBERS AS THE SEASON PROGRESSES.

DRIVERS IN THE GREY AND PINK TEAMS NEED TO LOOK CAREFULLY AT WHAT CARS HAVE BEEN USED. BECAUSE THERE HAVE BEEN DIFFERENT DRIVERS IN THESE TEAMS, EACH CHASSIS MUST BE USED EQUALLY. THE NUMBER OF TIMES THE TEAM HAS USED EACH CAR IS SHOWN BELOW.


Race List = IGOR
Server = UKGPL_T7_2
IP address = 62.149.202.168
Race date = Sunday Aug 21st
Time = 21:00 UK time (21:00 GMT)
Track = Le Mans Sarthe         http://gpltd.bcsims.com/include/downloadtrack.php?&track=bsarthe&track_link=/tracks/bsarthe.zip

Race length = approx 90 minutes (    28 laps)
Variant = GT mod
Damage Model = Intermediate (see rules below re resets)
Qualifying time = 35 minutes. Don't start until 30 mins left on clock to allow everyone to join the server.
Password: see above
Driver lists can be found on the championship standings page (https://www.simracing.org.uk/smf/index.php?action=LM2R;group=307;theme=6)

There will be rolling starts for all races with full moderation of both the warm-up and first lap.

Guidelines for rolling starts...

The car on pole will lead off the grid and maintain a steady pace for the 1st lap around 175kph
All drivers should form up in single file behind him leaving 3-4 car lengths between each car.
There is NO OVERTAKING on the 1st lap until the exit of the last corner.
It is the reponsibility of the lead car to ensure that all drivers are with him as he approaches the final corner.
Racing and overtaking begin AFTER the exit of the last corner, so you may overtake between the exit of the last corner and the S/F line.

Any driver who loses his position on the rolling lap, by going off, blowing his engine or through contact with another car ( regardless of fault) must rejoin at the back of the field.
Incidents on the rolling lap ( Lap 1) will be fully modded and anyone found to have caused another competitor to lose position through bad driving will be penalised appropriately.
Also, please make sure that you know which car you should be following on the rolling lap, so that you do NOT get out of position.

The teams have been chosen and the cars are polished and ready to go.

TEAMS

RED TEAM          HRISTO ITCHOV,  Evilclive, Paul Badblood  
 Chap 2F / Mirage / Porsche
                                                                
BLUE TEAM        SAMB, Fulvio, Happy Al  
Chap 2F/ Lola/ Mirage

GREEN TEAM     ZACHARIA BLITO, Phil Thornton, Axel Cookie
Chapp 2F/ Ferrari P4 / Mirage

ORANGE TEAM        NIGEL SMITH, Tim FMG,Dave RAndall  
Ferrari P4 / Chapp 2D / Ford GT MK2.

GREY TEAM     Captained by Tim Vosblod who is looking after the part time drivers who cannot be sure to attend every race.

The cars for the Grey team for this season will be
Chapperal 2D.................   USED 7 TIMES
Mirage............................USED  8 TIMES
Ford GT40 MK1.................USED 7 TIMES

a NEW pink team HAS BEEN FORMED TO ACCOMODATE A FEW MORE OF THE TEMPORARY DRIVERS IN THIS SERIES

The Cars for the Pink Team are
Ferrari  ........................USED 2 TIMES
Mk2 GT40.....................USED 3 TIMES
Porsche.....................USED 2 TIMES


All drivers must drive all 3 team cars at least 3 times. At the end of the 10 race championship any TEAM found to be in breach of this rule will have its BEST TEAM points result of the season cancelled. Each driver will drop his worst 2 results, in line with the other championships, this gets over the problem of missed races and 2 man teams looking for a sub at the last minute.

The events will be run on Intermediate damage and allow ONE Shift-R with a compulsory 10 second pit stop regardless of fault. (This means 10 seconds in your pitbox without moving). Any driver who fails to take a 10 second stop within 1 lap after a Shift-R, will be disqualified from the results. For this division the full moderation of lap one now applying across all divisions will include both the warm up lap and lap one proper.

Please check the Season 21 pages for details (https://www.simracing.org.uk/smf/index.php?action=LM2R&group=301&theme=6) regarding rules and the GT Team Challenge pages (https://www.simracing.org.uk/smf/index.php?action=LM2R&group=307&theme=6) in particular.





Title: Re: UKGPL Season 21 (2011) GT - Le Mans (Sarthe) - Sep 4
Post by: FullMetalGasket on September 01, 2011, 04:44:13 PM +0100
Looking forward to this (despite what it'll do to me for Monday morning!) - going to be interesting trying to get the HMS Orange to the finish of the race.

Oh, and woe be-tide anyone in a 910 who gets lapped by me near the end of the Mulsanne  ;D
Should be about a 50mph closing speed!  :o


Title: Re: UKGPL Season 21 (2011) GT - Le Mans (Sarthe) - Sep 4
Post by: BadBlood on September 01, 2011, 05:03:13 PM +0100
Final drivers table:


TeamDriverPorsche   Ferrari P330GT40 Mk1  GT40 MkIIB Mirage M1 Chap Mk2D Chap Mk2F
     Lola      
Races entered
Team RedHristo Itchov
3
0
0
0
4
0
2
0
9
Team RedEvilClive
3
0
0
0
3
0
3
0
9
Team RedBadBlood
3
0
0
0
2
0
3
0
8
Team BlueSamB
0
0
0
0
3
0
2
2
7
Team Bluefpolicardi
0
0
0
0
3
0
3
3
9
Team Bluehappyal
0
0
0
0
2
0
3
3
8
Team Bluenatan5 (for Al?)
0
0
0
0
1
0
0
0
1
Team Greenblito
0
2
0
0
2
0
3
0
7
Team GreenPhil Thornton
0
3
0
0
2
0
2
0
7
Team GreenCookie
0
3
0
0
3
0
3
0
9
Team OrangeNigel Smith/Geoff
0
1
0
2
0
1
0
0
4
Team OrangeFullMetalGasket
0
3
0
2
0
3
0
0
8
Team OrangeDave Randall
0
2
0
3
0
3
0
0
8
Team Greyvosblod
0
0
1
0
2
0
0
0
3
Team GreyGeoff65
0
0
1
0
1
2
0
0
4
Team Greyjhalli
0
0
2
0
4
3
0
0
9
Team Greyb_1_rd
0
0
2
0
1
2
0
0
5
Team Greys2173
0
0
1
0
0
0
0
0
1
Team PinkGuests
1
2
0
0
0
0
0
0
3
Team Pinks1273
1
0
0
3
0
0
0
0
4

In line with the series rules, please make sure that you have driven each chassis three times (or as close as is practicable if you have not made at least eight races so far). Chassis usage for Grey and Pink is obviously slightly different but it would be 'in the spirit' of the rules if drivers could individually equalise their chassis usage.

i.e. Team Red would have BadBlood driving a Mirage, which leaves poor old Clive with the Porsche... he may need a tow. For Team Grey it is generally free chassis but if Juha drives, he should take the GT40 Mk 1. If Sky drives for Pink he CAN'T take the GT 40 Mk IIB. etc etc.


Title: Re: UKGPL Season 21 (2011) GT - Le Mans (Sarthe) - Sep 4
Post by: Rainier on September 02, 2011, 09:13:59 AM +0100
"The car on pole will lead off the grid and maintain a steady pace for the 1st lap around 175kph"

it will be funny on the Hunaudieres  :-\


Title: Re: UKGPL Season 21 (2011) GT - Le Mans (Sarthe) - Sep 4
Post by: s2173 on September 02, 2011, 10:17:08 AM +0100
Hey, i just tought of something... Can two guys from the same team drive the same car? If i drive ferrari and someone else decides to take ferrari, are we in violation of rules? That is if we both haven't driven ferrari so far... Its actually redicilious and ruins the whole idea, but i cant find any rule against it... Maybe it should be added or something?


Title: Re: UKGPL Season 21 (2011) GT - Le Mans (Sarthe) - Sep 4
Post by: EvilClive on September 02, 2011, 01:14:33 PM +0100
Yes Sky, it would be against the rules.

The Team has 3 cars which it bought with its tokens at the start of the season.

Imagine this is real life and your team owns 3 cars which you take to each race on your transporter. In the case of the Pink Team they have 1 Porsche, 1 Ferrari and 1 Mk2 GT40., so you cannot enter 2 Ferraris in the same race.  ;D


Title: Re: UKGPL Season 21 (2011) GT - Le Mans (Sarthe) - Sep 4
Post by: Rainier on September 02, 2011, 01:51:14 PM +0100
Who are the drivers of the Pink team (except Sky and me) ?

if Sky will drive the Ferrari, I would like to drive the Porsche
if Sky will not drive the Ferrari, I would like it !!
anyway, I am not able to drive the Ford during 90 minutes!

Just tell me which car I have to drive  ;)   


Title: Re: UKGPL Season 21 (2011) GT - Le Mans (Sarthe) - Sep 4
Post by: Hristo Itchov on September 02, 2011, 01:55:03 PM +0100
Who are the drivers of the Pink team (except Sky and me) ?

if Sky will drive the Ferrari, I would like to drive the Porsche
if Sky will not drive the Ferrari, I would like it !!
anyway, I am not able to drive the Ford during 90 minutes!

Just tell me which car I have to drive  ;)   

The Ford is built specially for Le Mans I think, so although it sucks in corners, it's supposed to overcompensate on the straights.


Title: Re: UKGPL Season 21 (2011) GT - Le Mans (Sarthe) - Sep 4
Post by: s2173 on September 02, 2011, 02:00:08 PM +0100
OK, take the ferrari... the prosche atleast i can drive reasonably safe. Probably i will outlast someone, but with so many shift'rs, i doubth it...


Title: Re: UKGPL Season 21 (2011) GT - Le Mans (Sarthe) - Sep 4
Post by: Rainier on September 02, 2011, 02:22:01 PM +0100
Who are the drivers of the Pink team (except Sky and me) ?

if Sky will drive the Ferrari, I would like to drive the Porsche
if Sky will not drive the Ferrari, I would like it !!
anyway, I am not able to drive the Ford during 90 minutes!

Just tell me which car I have to drive  ;)   

The Ford is built specially for Le Mans I think, so although it sucks in corners, it's supposed to overcompensate on the straights.


True in the real 1966 (for the MKII) life.
Not sure in the virtual GT mod in 2011  ;D


Title: Re: UKGPL Season 21 (2011) GT - Le Mans (Sarthe) - Sep 4
Post by: Cookie on September 02, 2011, 03:22:15 PM +0100
The Ford is built specially for Le Mans I think, so although it sucks in corners, it's supposed to overcompensate on the straights.

Yep!
I confirm ;D
This is a potentional winning car here!


Title: Re: UKGPL Season 21 (2011) GT - Le Mans (Sarthe) - Sep 4
Post by: FullMetalGasket on September 02, 2011, 04:13:02 PM +0100
Why do you think I asked to have it for Le Mans  ;)
(Although TBH I'd have rather had the MkIV)


Title: Re: UKGPL Season 21 (2011) GT - Le Mans (Sarthe) - Sep 4
Post by: s2173 on September 02, 2011, 04:17:37 PM +0100
So what you're gonna take, Rainer? So I know what to take... we might test both side to side at some practice run sometimes...


Title: Re: UKGPL Season 21 (2011) GT - Le Mans (Sarthe) - Sep 4
Post by: Rainier on September 02, 2011, 06:03:06 PM +0100
So what you're gonna take, Rainer? So I know what to take... we might test both side to side at some practice run sometimes...

Ferrari or Porsche, take your favorite car and I'll take the other.
The 910 is very slow, especially on "Les Hunaudieres", but is the easiest GT to drive.
 


Title: Re: UKGPL Season 21 (2011) GT - Le Mans (Sarthe) - Sep 4
Post by: EvilClive on September 03, 2011, 12:54:56 PM +0100
There is a chance that I will not make this race.  :-[

My daughter is due to give birth to our second grandchild on Sept 5th and my wife and I have been volunteered to babysit grandchild #1 when she goes into hospital. The problem is that we have to rush off to Coventry some 80 miles away when we get "the phone call". It might even happen mid race!! Or I might miss some other event.

I'm really looking forward to this season finale and hope I can be around for it, but some things are ( slightly) more importatant than even GPL  ;)


Title: Re: UKGPL Season 21 (2011) GT - Le Mans (Sarthe) - Sep 4
Post by: Rainier on September 03, 2011, 02:07:45 PM +0100
"The events will be run on Intermediate damage and allow ONE Shift-R "


Maybe, for this specific race, a 2nd shift-R should be authorized to allow a refueling due to the distance (28 laps !!) ????


Title: Re: UKGPL Season 21 (2011) GT - Le Mans (Sarthe) - Sep 4
Post by: BadBlood on September 03, 2011, 02:27:04 PM +0100
Refuelling stops are STRICTLY forbidden under general UKGPL rules...

...but a nice try  ;D


Title: Re: UKGPL Season 21 (2011) GT - Le Mans (Sarthe) - Sep 4
Post by: FullMetalGasket on September 03, 2011, 03:21:53 PM +0100
The GT's will run for at least double the distance needed for this race on a full tank ;)


Title: Re: UKGPL Season 21 (2011) GT - Le Mans (Sarthe) - Sep 4
Post by: EvilClive on September 03, 2011, 04:38:27 PM +0100
If this "longer race" is a success, then maybe we might introduce a few GT endurance races before the start of season 22?


Title: Re: UKGPL Season 21 (2011) GT - Le Mans (Sarthe) - Sep 4
Post by: Rainier on September 03, 2011, 04:57:22 PM +0100
Refuelling stops are STRICTLY forbidden under general UKGPL rules...

...but a nice try  ;D

Not only a nice try :
if you go to the setup of the Ferrari P4 and then fully fill the tank, you will get a maximum of 220 liters for ...20 laps of Le Mans.
I know you can drive more than 20 laps with these 220 liters, maybe even 28 laps ...but not sure ! 


Title: Re: UKGPL Season 21 (2011) GT - Le Mans (Sarthe) - Sep 4
Post by: Hristo Itchov on September 03, 2011, 05:41:43 PM +0100
I find the fuel mileage estimation very wrong for some GT cars. For instance the Porsche can go almost twice the distance it shows in the setup screen...


Title: Re: UKGPL Season 21 (2011) GT - Le Mans (Sarthe) - Sep 4
Post by: s2173 on September 03, 2011, 05:50:48 PM +0100
Il drive the porcshe, Rainer... if i drive at all.

And you can crash on purpose to get your shift'r... :laugh:


Title: Re: UKGPL Season 21 (2011) GT - Le Mans (Sarthe) - Sep 4
Post by: Cookie on September 03, 2011, 06:05:48 PM +0100
Juha posted this some time ago

mk2gt40   _fuel_load_per_lap= 7.43    ; Ford MkIIB AI fuel loading in liters per lap
DChap   _fuel_load_per_lap= 6.94    ; Chap 2D AI fuel loading in liters per lap
Lola           _fuel_load_per_lap= 6.58    ; Lola T70 AI fuel loading in liters per lap
2FChap   _fuel_load_per_lap= 6.94    ; Chap 2F AI fuel loading in liters per lap
ferrari           _fuel_load_per_lap= 6.11    ; Ferrari 330 AI fuel loading in liters per lap
mk4gt40   _fuel_load_per_lap= 7.14    ; Ford MkIV AI fuel loading in liters per lap
mirage   _fuel_load_per_lap= 6.24    ; Mirage M1 AI fuel loading in liters per lap
mk1gt40   _fuel_load_per_lap= 5.96    ; Ford MkI AI fuel loading in liters per lap
porsche   _fuel_load_per_lap= 4.11    ; Porsche 910 AI fuel loading in liters per lap


Title: Re: UKGPL Season 21 (2011) GT - Le Mans (Sarthe) - Sep 4
Post by: EvilClive on September 03, 2011, 06:40:52 PM +0100
It is always possible to extend the number of laps that you can do by careful driving.

Even in the original 67 GPL, on some circuits some cars cannot complete a full GP distance on one tank at max race speed and it is necessary to short shift and conserve fuel...much like modern F1 cars.

But, I think you will find that everyone should be able to complete the 28 laps on Sunday.


Title: Re: UKGPL Season 21 (2011) GT - Le Mans (Sarthe) - Sep 4
Post by: FullMetalGasket on September 03, 2011, 06:59:04 PM +0100
I was practicing with about 50 gals of fuel in the Mk2, I only need 32 for race distance.....
Only way you'll have fuel issues is if you suffer a freak mechanical accident like Hristo did at Pebble Beach last season in the Am's  :)


Title: Re: UKGPL Season 21 (2011) GT - Le Mans (Sarthe) - Sep 4
Post by: Hristo Itchov on September 03, 2011, 07:16:45 PM +0100
Only way you'll have fuel issues is if you suffer a freak mechanical accident like Hristo did at Pebble Beach last season in the Am's  :)

 >:(


Title: Re: UKGPL Season 21 (2011) GT - Le Mans (Sarthe) - Sep 4
Post by: FullMetalGasket on September 03, 2011, 07:32:35 PM +0100
I might have been in some way involved of course - but it was the tree that did it for your fuel tank ;)


Title: Re: UKGPL Season 21 (2011) GT - Le Mans (Sarthe) - Sep 4
Post by: Hristo Itchov on September 03, 2011, 08:13:26 PM +0100
I might have been in some way involved of course - but it was the tree that did it for your fuel tank ;)

Yeah, I should have filed an incident report against the tree.  :D


Title: Re: UKGPL Season 21 (2011) GT - Le Mans (Sarthe) - Sep 4
Post by: BadBlood on September 03, 2011, 09:37:00 PM +0100
Refuelling stops are STRICTLY forbidden under general UKGPL rules...

...but a nice try  ;D

Not only a nice try :
if you go to the setup of the Ferrari P4 and then fully fill the tank, you will get a maximum of 220 liters for ...20 laps of Le Mans.
I know you can drive more than 20 laps with these 220 liters, maybe even 28 laps ...but not sure ! 

Pretty sure you can do it reasonably comfortably on one tank but you do have that one Shift-R - don't waste it ;)


Title: Re: UKGPL Season 21 (2011) GT - Le Mans (Sarthe) - Sep 4
Post by: maddog on September 03, 2011, 10:47:22 PM +0100
I'm a late entry for this Series.  With the Ferrari and Porsche, taken in the Pink team, does that leave the MkII going spare? :whistling:


Title: Re: UKGPL Season 21 (2011) GT - Le Mans (Sarthe) - Sep 4
Post by: BadBlood on September 04, 2011, 12:31:53 AM +0100
Lucky Boy... bet you run out of fuel  ;D


Title: Re: UKGPL Season 21 (2011) GT - Le Mans (Sarthe) - Sep 4
Post by: FullMetalGasket on September 04, 2011, 09:29:36 AM +0100
Bet he doesn't  ;)


On a serious note - where should the lead car start accelerating from at the start Clive?
The last 'slow' corner with a breaking point is Maison Blanche about a mile from the S/F line  :D


Title: Re: UKGPL Season 21 (2011) GT - Le Mans (Sarthe) - Sep 4
Post by: blito on September 04, 2011, 09:41:31 AM +0100
Personally I would say accelerate from Maison blanche but no overtaking before the s/f line...
Mind you , in the GTR2 league I was doing there was no accel before the s/f line and we never had any t1 pile-ups although from last on the grid every time I never got to see another car after the warm up lap :o


Title: Re: UKGPL Season 21 (2011) GT - Le Mans (Sarthe) - Sep 4
Post by: s2173 on September 04, 2011, 10:11:52 AM +0100
You were lucky to see any at warm up...At laguna seca, at the end of warm up lap the leader was already a mile ahead... I guess that would be 3-4 miles here...


Title: Re: UKGPL Season 21 (2011) GT - Le Mans (Sarthe) - Sep 4
Post by: Hristo Itchov on September 04, 2011, 10:33:06 AM +0100
You were lucky to see any at warm up...At laguna seca, at the end of warm up lap the leader was already a mile ahead... I guess that would be 3-4 miles here...

Not my fault you people do crazy things in the middle and at the back. I was literally cruising (ask the others behind me) to try and bunch up the field before the start, but there were simply no other cars in sight even after 20 seconds of going at something like 100 km/h or less. I think people should quit weaving around like modern F1 do to "warm up" their tires, it barely does anything with these cars and it only seems to lead to spins. People should also stick to their lines instead of running glued behind someone, to avoid being caught be earlier braking and rearend others.

As for where to start at Le Mans, IMO it should be out of the last slight link before the s/f straight, instead of out of the last real corner a mile earlier. Also I don't agree with the non-passing rule before s/f line, because the cars have different characteristics, especially the Porsches. If we are to do it, it would mean anyone behind a Porsche would have to lose a lot of ground to the cars in front of the Porsche, because they're not allowed to pass it.


Title: Re: UKGPL Season 21 (2011) GT - Le Mans (Sarthe) - Sep 4
Post by: FullMetalGasket on September 04, 2011, 10:37:27 AM +0100
Personally I would say accelerate from Maison blanche but no overtaking before the s/f line...

We've never run a no overtaking before the S/F line rule for the exact reason Hristo states :)
This is why I was asking for clarification on where the leader should floor it - I don't expect my GT40 to qualify on pole (I'll be suprised at the least if it does!), but it would be nice to know for the off chance  ;D

The kink before the S/F may make most sense I guess although we'll have to wait to hear back from Evil-San....


Title: Re: UKGPL Season 21 (2011) GT - Le Mans (Sarthe) - Sep 4
Post by: EvilClive on September 04, 2011, 11:31:19 AM +0100
Just so that things are simple and clear for everyone.

Racing will start at the slight kink before S/F line, which means that you may overtake BEFORE the S/F line.


This is a very long lap and the rolling start will probably take something like 4 minutes. I would suggest that there is absolutely no need to weave around as your tyres will have ample time to warm up over the rolling lap. It is probably much more important to keep your car under control and just 4-5 car lengths back from car in front so that you are where you should be when the racing starts.

I have noticed on replays of earlier races that some drivers follow the car in front VERY closely all the way around the rolling lap...why???!! Give yourself plenty of room for the first 3/4 of the lap and only close up as you approach the final corner. At the pace that the lead car should be travelling, any car even a Porsche will be able to close up between Indianapolis and the start.

Remember that this is a much longer race than we are used to running and it will be interesting to see if driver fatigue and car reliability play any part in the result..getting to the end will be a success for everyone.

By my reckoning, it is likely that the faster cars could be lapping the Porsches/Mk1 GT40's about twice during this race. The obvious places to pass will be on the Mulsanne aand S/F straight. If you are in a Porshe or slower car please make sure that you drive on one side of the track and stay there, allowing the faster cars to go around you. DO  NOT  TRY AND GET OUT OF THEIR WAY BY MOVING ACROSS AS THEY CATCH YOU. At the speeds that the faster cars wil be travelling this will cause accidents.


Title: Re: UKGPL Season 21 (2011) GT - Le Mans (Sarthe) - Sep 4
Post by: s2173 on September 04, 2011, 12:23:42 PM +0100
This is a very long lap and the rolling start will probably take something like 4 minutes.

I strongly suspect, that with porchse my best lap in the race will be something like 4 minutes...  ;D  Whatever, dont wait for me...  8)


Title: Re: UKGPL Season 21 (2011) GT - Le Mans (Sarthe) - Sep 4
Post by: Hristo Itchov on September 04, 2011, 12:49:27 PM +0100
I can assure you that the warm up lap will be much longer than 4 minutes if I'm on pole.  :D


Title: Re: UKGPL Season 21 (2011) GT - Le Mans (Sarthe) - Sep 4
Post by: fpolicardi on September 04, 2011, 04:46:30 PM +0100
It's only me that can't see any pw on the post header?

T7_2 server is set for 28 laps Long race and listening on Igor.

Ciao


Title: Re: UKGPL Season 21 (2011) GT - Le Mans (Sarthe) - Sep 4
Post by: BadBlood on September 04, 2011, 06:00:31 PM +0100
Nope - wasn't just you - I should NEVER let Clive loose in LM2 ;)


Title: Re: UKGPL Season 21 (2011) GT - Le Mans (Sarthe) - Sep 4
Post by: happyal on September 04, 2011, 07:36:54 PM +0100
Will not be able to make this race, as I'm still at work sorting out some problems.

Can someone please take my place in the Blue team?


Title: Re: UKGPL Season 21 (2011) GT - Le Mans (Sarthe) - Sep 4
Post by: s2173 on September 04, 2011, 08:00:21 PM +0100
What car?


Title: Re: UKGPL Season 21 (2011) GT - Le Mans (Sarthe) - Sep 4
Post by: Hristo Itchov on September 04, 2011, 08:14:05 PM +0100
So many people saying they won't make this race... why do I have a feeling it would be 90 minutes of extreme boredom, with most of us running alone?


Title: Re: UKGPL Season 21 (2011) GT - Le Mans (Sarthe) - Sep 4
Post by: s2173 on September 04, 2011, 08:31:29 PM +0100
Because this is exacly what it will be...

I suspect its possible for me to fall asleep at that long straight...so try not to stay too long behind me, ok? Might be dangerious... :laugh:


Title: Re: UKGPL Season 21 (2011) GT - Le Mans (Sarthe) - Sep 4
Post by: Hristo Itchov on September 04, 2011, 08:37:15 PM +0100
Because this is exacly what it will be...

I suspect its possible for me to fall asleep at that long straight...so try not to stay too long behind me, ok? Might be dangerious... :laugh:

Take the Porsche and I won't be able to stay too long behind you.  ;D


Title: Re: UKGPL Season 21 (2011) GT - Le Mans (Sarthe) - Sep 4
Post by: s2173 on September 04, 2011, 08:47:33 PM +0100
Other cars wont let me fall asleep... naughty cars.

So what car was free for blue team? You might take Rainer in if you want...


Title: Re: UKGPL Season 21 (2011) GT - Le Mans (Sarthe) - Sep 4
Post by: happyal on September 04, 2011, 08:59:08 PM +0100
I was due to take the Mirage at this race, so that will be free.


Title: Re: UKGPL Season 21 (2011) GT - Le Mans (Sarthe) - Sep 4
Post by: vosblod on September 04, 2011, 10:09:56 PM +0100
Hmm not a good idea to race when I have the kids on my own. One reset and a pit put me well back then 'daddy I fell over and hurt my back running around' when she should be in bed :cursing:
End of race, hope some of you made the long haul.


Title: Re: UKGPL Season 21 (2011) GT - Le Mans (Sarthe) - Sep 4
Post by: jhalli on September 04, 2011, 10:16:49 PM +0100
screen freeze  >:(

i dont understand using tracks that are known of disco issues.


Title: Re: UKGPL Season 21 (2011) GT - Le Mans (Sarthe) - Sep 4
Post by: blito on September 04, 2011, 10:17:24 PM +0100
Bad luck Tim....
I was really enjoying that upto about lap 6 when I found my concentration starting to give way.... lap 7 saw several mistakes, lap 8 saw the car a write-off... I still had my shift-R in hand but there would be no point in taking it - the car would go on forever but my body certainly wont....


Title: Re: UKGPL Season 21 (2011) GT - Le Mans (Sarthe) - Sep 4
Post by: BadBlood on September 04, 2011, 10:41:09 PM +0100
OK - I suck in GT's - it is official. I found it hard to break 4min in the Mirage. My twin girl's eleventh birthday and no time to get on board - couldn't remember the track so I was learning in qually and just wanted to keep out of the way. Did that OK generally but the Mirage on default setup was horrid to drive. It was hard to keep it straight on the Mulsanne let alone corner nicely. Never mind. Drove to survive and so I did until the server disconnected me and immediately offered to reconnect... <sigh>

Never mind 13 laps better than expected. Go Reds...


Title: Re: UKGPL Season 21 (2011) GT - Le Mans (Sarthe) - Sep 4
Post by: EvilClive on September 04, 2011, 10:57:05 PM +0100
looks like the server dropped me and about 3 laps later got a screen freeze   :-X



Title: Re: UKGPL Season 21 (2011) GT - Le Mans (Sarthe) - Sep 4
Post by: Phil Thornton on September 04, 2011, 11:02:20 PM +0100
Saw a big crash at the end of the Mulsanne on lap 1.  I managed to avoid the wreckage and picked up a lot of places.  I was still thinking about it (and smiling to myself) when I got to the tight left hander at Indianapolis and I stupidly put a wheel on the grass which caused me to spin and end up beached on the sand >:( .  Managed to reset after the whole field had gone by and then I had to do my 10 second stop and go.  By that time I was dead last by quite a margin so I set off in pursuit.  The Mirage has a great top speed (got 114 mph in slip stream) so I managed to pull quite a lot of places back (up to 6th place) until I got discoed with half a dozen others with about 12 laps to go.

I really enjoyed that race.  There was plenty of action for me and I liked the authenticity of the GT cars at Le Mans.  Pity about the disco.  Grats to whoever finished if anyone  :)


Title: Re: UKGPL Season 21 (2011) GT - Le Mans (Sarthe) - Sep 4
Post by: Hristo Itchov on September 04, 2011, 11:04:11 PM +0100
The Mirage has a great top speed (got 114 mph in slip stream)

That's not great!  :D


Title: Re: UKGPL Season 21 (2011) GT - Le Mans (Sarthe) - Sep 4
Post by: Phil Thornton on September 04, 2011, 11:09:45 PM +0100
The Mirage has a great top speed (got 114 mph in slip stream)

That's not great!  :D

LOL  I meant 214mph   :laugh:


Title: Re: UKGPL Season 21 (2011) GT - Le Mans (Sarthe) - Sep 4
Post by: vosblod on September 04, 2011, 11:16:23 PM +0100
Managed to reset after the whole field had gone by and then I had to do my 10 second stop and go.  
Oh dear just realised I did a SnG but not a 10 seconder. I knew you could only do one reset but forgot that. Slapped hands time.

While I'm in the confessional I was really confused whether the car to the right on the warm up lap was ahead or behind. I went ahead then saw it was Phil on Prib and knew he had quallied ahead. I dropped to the right to let him back in front so no harm done. Apologies anyway.


Title: Re: UKGPL Season 21 (2011) GT - Le Mans (Sarthe) - Sep 4
Post by: FullMetalGasket on September 04, 2011, 11:17:35 PM +0100
I was doing that in clear air Phil  ;D

Until the mass disco at any rate  :(
I had that one in the bag until then, even being kind to the Mk2's engine and letting H catch, me I'd have finished about 30 seconds clear  8)


Title: Re: UKGPL Season 21 (2011) GT - Le Mans (Sarthe) - Sep 4
Post by: b_1_rd on September 04, 2011, 11:20:55 PM +0100
Shame it all ended like it did with many freezes and discos.

I suddenly found myself leading from being in 9th or something like that, was trying to figure out what was going on and flipped the car.  It came to rest the right way up and was drivable so carried on but was down on power so did a reset.  About a mile later I was thinking of sending a message to whoever was left, which looked like 3 of us at that point to see if they wanted to carry on, but before I did anything about it I was so distracted I ran the car off track again!  :laugh: the engine was on fire but the car still moved! I moved forward 5 meters and the screen froze!

Justice I guess as I would have been out anyway as I doubt the car wouldn't have continued much further.

cheers for now!


Title: Re: UKGPL Season 21 (2011) GT - Le Mans (Sarthe) - Sep 4
Post by: BadBlood on September 04, 2011, 11:21:19 PM +0100
I've put up the results for what they are worth but I have not added the correct teams. Wait to see what Clive wants to do... Makes the points table look a bit funny.


Title: Re: UKGPL Season 21 (2011) GT - Le Mans (Sarthe) - Sep 4
Post by: Geoff65 on September 04, 2011, 11:34:58 PM +0100
Blimey, I thought my deodorant had failed and everyone had skipped out. Bloody big lonely place to drive around on your own too.......Mercifully, the engine gave up on lap 19 and dropped a cylinder.....just allowing me to complete the lap. Another 8 laps chugging about would have been purgatory. Bad luck for the mass disco, and not how I like to win races.
I was in that lap 2 shunt at the end of Mulsanne Phil. Whistled down the inside, passing a few cars on the way.......braking well and going to make the corner easily......then got axe murdered from behind by, I figure, a disgruntled pass-ee.
UPDATE Apparently Mr Hunt set the carnage in motion by wandering about under brakes INSIDE the braking zone,   :nono:   and shortening Steve Bird's available braking distance by the length of a Ford GT40. And well, we all saw the rest. After we all got going again, bits of it were fun with a bit of controlled passing and the odd dice.....Holding Evil behind me in his howling Porka was a full time job, sorry about the stuff-up at Tetre Rouge Evil.....put us both on our lids and it ruined a fun dice, requiring a reset and 10 seconds of thinking music for me. Ruined my race as it was solo flying from then on except when FMG lapped me, until I exited as THE last competitor standing. To the post mortem and ritual dissection of the server I suppose.

The first rolling lap and subsequent start worked brilliantly at least as far back as me in the #9 slot. We all kept together, and I even almost had the chance of a crack at Steve in T1.....
but thought better of it eg cold tyres, big fat fuel load etc. Surprisingly though, the 2D was quite stable and comfortable to drive on full fuel. Really enjoyed driving it this time, it just struggled a little for top speed, though I noticed Hristo's 2F was only matching my 198-199mph solo along Mulsanne, so I guess it wasn't doing too badly.


Title: Re: UKGPL Season 21 (2011) GT - Le Mans (Sarthe) - Sep 4
Post by: maddog on September 05, 2011, 12:04:03 AM +0100
Thanks for the preliminary results Paul.  I'm a non-Prib member, and hadn't sorted my pitboard, so was doing this endurance in the dark.  But would it be fairer to score the race, from the moment the magnificent seven,  were forceably removed? :(


Title: Re: UKGPL Season 21 (2011) GT - Le Mans (Sarthe) - Sep 4
Post by: fpolicardi on September 05, 2011, 12:46:36 AM +0100
I think we can summarize this:
After FMG crossed the line of 16th lap he was discoed/freezed (?) and so all the others were discoed apart Geoff, Steve and Hendy. Me and Clive could continue but were lost from results. A lap later Clive was disco. Steve and Hendy crashed/freezed later and when Geoff retired at 20th lap I got the PitIn message on the pitboard. So it wasn't an issue with the race setting (too long), cause the server would have gone on if Geoff hadn't retired.
I ask myself if it wasn't a connection problem for those on a certain route to the server, Geoff is downunder and me in the Beautiful Country  ;D , I don't know where Steve and Hendy are from.
Ciao


Title: Re: UKGPL Season 21 (2011) GT - Le Mans (Sarthe) - Sep 4
Post by: Hristo Itchov on September 05, 2011, 12:48:31 AM +0100
Makes the points table look a bit funny.

The Red Team doesn't mind.  8)


Title: Re: UKGPL Season 21 (2011) GT - Le Mans (Sarthe) - Sep 4
Post by: Geoff65 on September 05, 2011, 06:09:25 AM +0100
I think we can summarize this:
After FMG crossed the line of 16th lap he was discoed/freezed (?) and so all the others were discoed apart Geoff, Steve and Hendy. Me and Clive could continue but were lost from results. A lap later Clive was disco. Steve and Hendy crashed/freezed later and when Geoff retired at 20th lap I got the PitIn message on the pitboard. So it wasn't an issue with the race setting (too long), cause the server would have gone on if Geoff hadn't retired.
I ask myself if it wasn't a connection problem for those on a certain route to the server, Geoff is downunder and me in the Beautiful Country  ;D , I don't know were Steve and Hendy are from.
Ciao


I noticed from my replay Fulvio, you and Clive were lapping.....but the server didn't count you after lap 16. Very odd.


Title: Re: UKGPL Season 21 (2011) GT - Le Mans (Sarthe) - Sep 4
Post by: Cookie on September 05, 2011, 08:56:36 AM +0100
Yes, this was very frustrating...

I just made a post in the SRMZ forum about this track. Hope it will be fixed soon.

It was a real fun race for me with great moments and close racing.
Had maximum fun with Samb who suddenly disappeared. Hope it wasn't me who caused it?


Title: Re: UKGPL Season 21 (2011) GT - Le Mans (Sarthe) - Sep 4
Post by: BadBlood on September 05, 2011, 10:21:55 AM +0100
So what you are saying, Fulvio, is that Geoff voluntarily retired and you finished a couple of laps to take the win...  ;D

I would propose that we reconstruct a couple of drivers based on the fact that the server lost track of them (Clive, Fulvio) and let the rest stand.

Disco's are hugely frustrating but part of life and although it is HUGELY harsh on Tim in particular I certainly don't fancy a re-run! We did also make half distance so precedent suggests that the race result stands.

Modifying Clive's entry would promote him to fifth behind Tim and Fulvio would be first or second dependent on his relative position to Geoff (I think he was ahead...)

They would be the only ones modified as they actually ran longer than the server results suggest whereas all other drivers were dropped where the race result says they finished.

Thoughts?


Title: Re: UKGPL Season 21 (2011) GT - Le Mans (Sarthe) - Sep 4
Post by: fpolicardi on September 05, 2011, 10:38:29 AM +0100
I think it would more fair if we get the results when Tim crossed last time the s/f line at 16th lap so all get their right position. After that there was a mass disco and only 3 drivers were counted.
Ciao


Title: Re: UKGPL Season 21 (2011) GT - Le Mans (Sarthe) - Sep 4
Post by: Hristo Itchov on September 05, 2011, 10:55:32 AM +0100
I think it would more fair if we get the results when Tim crossed last time the s/f line at 16th lap so all get their right position. After that there was a mass disco and only 3 drivers were counted.
Ciao


I was thinking the same, it would be similar to real F1 where they take the result from a lap before or more in case a race had to be cut short.


Title: Re: UKGPL Season 21 (2011) GT - Le Mans (Sarthe) - Sep 4
Post by: maddog on September 05, 2011, 11:10:59 AM +0100
Meanwhile, back at the track - Geoff's finger pointing may be right. I've not raced a GT40 'til now.  It's straight line speed is such, I'd assumed the pack was further back, and changed lanes under braking.  Rear view at high speed is virtually nonexistent in these.  So what is it, Benny Hill said about, "Never assume?" If so, sorry lads! :(

After restoring the horizontal, I determined to stay out of trouble, and settled in, for the long haul.  Cruising along, mid-race, I was starting to reel in the fact, we were re-living history.  Our cars being just slightly pre-Mcqueen, and part of a golden era - and we were racing around the track they were built for. (sans Porsche)  Whereupon, I suddenly found myself inspecting the rear of a sandbank, at Indianapolis, followed rapidly by an escape road at the very next apex, preferring to avoid a sandy end!  I would not have been comfortable with a sandy end!  Nor with a cut short race.  

Having regained my focus, it was with great disappointment, I realized our lives had all been, so tragically cut short.  


Title: Re: UKGPL Season 21 (2011) GT - Le Mans (Sarthe) - Sep 4
Post by: Cookie on September 05, 2011, 11:25:27 AM +0100
I think it would more fair if we get the results when Tim crossed last time the s/f line at 16th lap so all get their right position. After that there was a mass disco and only 3 drivers were counted.
Ciao


I was thinking the same, it would be similar to real F1 where they take the result from a lap before or more in case a race had to be cut short.

I would vote to this solution too!

PS Ginetto just answered my post at SRMZ ;)
Quote from: 'Ginetto'
No news for Le Mans Sarthe; I didn't know about it giving problems :idunno:


Title: Re: UKGPL Season 21 (2011) GT - Le Mans (Sarthe) - Sep 4
Post by: BadBlood on September 05, 2011, 12:00:32 PM +0100
I am pretty sure I was the next car over the line after Tim crossed the sixteenth time. Can I claim second? :D

Very doable and reasonable solution.

I will post a 'pseudo' results board here when I get home tonight. Then it is up to Clive.


Title: Re: UKGPL Season 21 (2011) GT - Le Mans (Sarthe) - Sep 4
Post by: Samb on September 05, 2011, 12:29:32 PM +0100
Yes, this was very frustrating...

I just made a post in the SRMZ forum about this track. Hope it will be fixed soon.

It was a real fun race for me with great moments and close racing.
Had maximum fun with Samb who suddenly disappeared. Hope it wasn't me who caused it?

No no Axel, my off was completely my own doing. Before that happened I was really enjoying that scrap. The Chapp may have masses of power but goodness it was clumsy through the corners  ;D. I had to reset after clouting a tree and didn't have a stopwatch handy, so probably did a 12-15 second stop  :angel:. It was quite a dull drive after that, and eventually I braked too late into Indianapolis and beached myself on the sand, race over.

A shame to end the sports cars in such a way but I've really enjoyed this season. I hope we can feature the sports cars in S21. Thanks to everyone in UKGPL for making this happen  :punk:


Title: Re: UKGPL Season 21 (2011) GT - Le Mans (Sarthe) - Sep 4
Post by: Raoni Frizzo on September 05, 2011, 01:27:00 PM +0100
Hi all!

I saw Cookie's post about the massive discos you all had at Le Mans during this weekend. To be honest, I never drove a league race at Le Mans to say if it has a severe problem, but in GPL Brasil we do races using the night version of the track since 2008 (we used it already 4 times) and we never had that kind of problem.

The night version is as good as the daily version about field of view, although with the dark sky. I recommend you a try, because it seems that the night version is more stable, although I don't know why :laugh:


Title: Re: UKGPL Season 21 (2011) GT - Le Mans (Sarthe) - Sep 4
Post by: BadBlood on September 05, 2011, 02:11:06 PM +0100
Thanks Raoni.


Title: Re: UKGPL Season 21 (2011) GT - Le Mans (Sarthe) - Sep 4
Post by: jhalli on September 05, 2011, 05:12:48 PM +0100
where i can find race replay file ??, i cant find it from usual place, Need to check who and what happened on lap2 Mulsanne straight just before hairpin.


Title: Re: UKGPL Season 21 (2011) GT - Le Mans (Sarthe) - Sep 4
Post by: BadBlood on September 05, 2011, 07:56:44 PM +0100
I am putting it up now...


Title: Re: UKGPL Season 21 (2011) GT - Le Mans (Sarthe) - Sep 4
Post by: jhalli on September 05, 2011, 08:10:32 PM +0100
thanks  :)


Title: Re: UKGPL Season 21 (2011) GT - Le Mans (Sarthe) - Sep 4
Post by: BadBlood on September 05, 2011, 09:17:47 PM +0100
Right - results as at Tim starting the Sixteenth Lap (taking that as the Chequered Flag)

FMG16 Laps57:47
Hristo Itchov+1 Lap55:17
Cookie+1255:29
Fulvio Policardi+4656:03
Rainier+1:3756:54
Phil Thornton+1:5257:09
Steve Bird+1:5457:11
Martin Hunt+2:1357:30
Evil Clive+2:4157:58
Geoff Heard+3:0458:21
Hendy Nichols+2 Laps56:11
S2173+3 Laps55:45
BadBlood+0:1556:00

Replay is up so please feel free to check my results...


Title: Re: UKGPL Season 21 (2011) GT - Le Mans (Sarthe) - Sep 4
Post by: jhalli on September 05, 2011, 10:00:40 PM +0100
I think it would more fair if we get the results when Tim crossed last time the s/f line at 16th lap so all get their right position. After that there was a mass disco and only 3 drivers were counted.
Ciao


no this is only fair to those drivers who was able to race till "mass disco" , not fair at all for drivers who discoed or have screen freezes before "mass disco" and this all is happening because track have disco issues. Should you just say to these drivers it was just a bad luck and please look forward ?

i recommend re -race with another track that is known " no problem track"




Title: Re: UKGPL Season 21 (2011) GT - Le Mans (Sarthe) - Sep 4
Post by: b_1_rd on September 05, 2011, 10:19:34 PM +0100
I think it will open a can of worms if the result is adapted on this occasion for discos. Where next is the line drawn; 5 drivers disco together and we call it a result, 7 maybe? I'm not sure what the best solution is, whether it be a rerun or whatever, but I can see this being brought up in the future as a 'well it was done for le mans in season 21 etc etc'.

I do see the proposed result as an option and a sensible compromise but if it is decided to be accepted I suggest it is indicated as a one off occasion and similar instances will be looked at on a case by case basis, so a full review of the rules for reruns and discos is not required.

Oh how I'm glad I'm not a moderator.

Just my 2p! :)


Title: Re: UKGPL Season 21 (2011) GT - Le Mans (Sarthe) - Sep 4
Post by: Hristo Itchov on September 05, 2011, 10:29:14 PM +0100
I think it would more fair if we get the results when Tim crossed last time the s/f line at 16th lap so all get their right position. After that there was a mass disco and only 3 drivers were counted.
Ciao


no this is only fair to those drivers who was able to race till "mass disco" , not fair at all for drivers who discoed or have screen freezes before "mass disco" and this all is happening because track have disco issues. Should you just say to these drivers it was just a bad luck and please look forward ?

i recommend re -race with another track that is known " no problem track"




We've never compensated drivers who discoed/froze separately on their own in the past, so why demand that we do it now? I've lost whole championships because of freezes I've experienced in numerous races, but it was only when mass disco/freeze happened that we had a rerun. In this case, most people were reluctant to rerun it and given the distance of the whole event, we've covered more than half of it, having ran for about an hour, which is as long as our normal events. IMO it's perfectly fine to take the result before the mass disco and use it as final. Whether you hand out half points or full points, only that's left to be decided.

I would agree if this was our usual 50 minutes race and we had mass disco at mid-point, after 20-30 minutes of racing, but it's not the case here, so I don't think you can compare it.


Title: Re: UKGPL Season 21 (2011) GT - Le Mans (Sarthe) - Sep 4
Post by: vosblod on September 05, 2011, 11:05:57 PM +0100
These are the UKGPL rules relating to red flagging races and mass disco's;
Quote
A race will be red flagged by the moderator only if at least half the drivers are disconnected from the server during lap one due to network problems. This may mean the race will have to be rescheduled due to time factors. Start line crashes will not be red flagged, no matter how many cars are involved.

In the event of a mass disconnection or other server problem the moderator may, at their discretion:
reconstruct the result based on the replay, if available;
declare the race to be red flagged at the end of the preceding lap and take the final results from that lap; or
declare the race null and void and arrange for it to be run again.
So basically it is the division moderators decision on a case by case basis. We don't have a definition of how many constitute a 'mass disconnection' but, by virtue of the first paragraph, I would say it should involve at least half the drivers all crashing out at around the same point in time.
Until Ginetto looks into things I am not sure we can categorically say it is a 'problem' track, sometimes these things are due to servers/connections.

Anyway that is the rule position.


Title: Re: UKGPL Season 21 (2011) GT - Le Mans (Sarthe) - Sep 4
Post by: b_1_rd on September 05, 2011, 11:26:22 PM +0100
Ah, my misunderstanding then, I thought it only applied to lap 1.  Up to the mod to call it then; whatever they decide ITS WRONG, WRONG!!!! I WANT MY SECOND PLACE, ITS MINE!  :laugh:


Title: Re: UKGPL Season 21 (2011) GT - Le Mans (Sarthe) - Sep 4
Post by: BadBlood on September 05, 2011, 11:42:38 PM +0100
To be clear, Juha and Vos and Sam would retain their places as at the moment in addition to the results I have outlined. The reults represent the LAST COMPLETED LAPS before the mass disconnection. I do not think that there can be any argument that this was a mass disco.

Nonetheless it is up to Clive to decide how he wants to proceed. I have merely presented the evidence. The first line of the rules allows Clive some latitude in reconstructing a result. We could also let the current result stand.

Given that we are so close to the end of the season, I am not sure a re-run would attract a large field. I, for one, would not take part.

Whatever we do, it will be unfair to somebody but I am determined to do whatever it takes to remove Steve from his second place...  ;D


Title: Re: UKGPL Season 21 (2011) GT - Le Mans (Sarthe) - Sep 4
Post by: Hristo Itchov on September 05, 2011, 11:51:39 PM +0100

Whatever we do, it will be unfair to somebody but I am determined to do whatever it takes to remove Steve from his second place...  ;D

Unless of course he finally accepts his destiny and joins Hiki-Waza!  ;)


Title: Re: UKGPL Season 21 (2011) GT - Le Mans (Sarthe) - Sep 4
Post by: BadBlood on September 06, 2011, 12:02:57 AM +0100
... in which case he might find he won  :laugh:


Title: Re: UKGPL Season 21 (2011) GT - Le Mans (Sarthe) - Sep 4
Post by: happyal on September 06, 2011, 12:48:24 PM +0100
Unless of course he finally accepts his destiny and joins Hiki-Waza!  ;)

I don't think Steve will join the dark side.


Title: Re: UKGPL Season 21 (2011) GT - Le Mans (Sarthe) - Sep 4
Post by: BadBlood on September 06, 2011, 02:09:40 PM +0100
If you only knew the 'Power of Dreams' (ahem)

hehe  :laugh:


Title: Re: UKGPL Season 21 (2011) GT - Le Mans (Sarthe) - Sep 4
Post by: Hristo Itchov on September 06, 2011, 02:31:07 PM +0100
Unless of course he finally accepts his destiny and joins Hiki-Waza!  ;)

I don't think Steve will join the dark side.

Let's see, green is darker than white. 'Nuff said.  ;D


Title: Re: UKGPL Season 21 (2011) GT - Le Mans (Sarthe) - Sep 4
Post by: b_1_rd on September 06, 2011, 04:58:50 PM +0100
I'll join the hiki-wazas… for a drink, they are buying ;)


Title: Re: UKGPL Season 21 (2011) GT - Le Mans (Sarthe) - Sep 4
Post by: BadBlood on September 06, 2011, 06:36:26 PM +0100
Any time you are in North London...


Title: Re: UKGPL Season 21 (2011) GT - Le Mans (Sarthe) - Sep 4
Post by: EvilClive on September 06, 2011, 08:44:08 PM +0100
Hi guys....sorry but I was out of contact for 48hrs from 2 a.m. Sunday evening, babysitting whilst my daughter gave birth to grandson No2  ;D

Just returned home, so will look at the Le Mans race and try and work out what went wrong  ::)

I am surprised that we had so many disco's etc as I always thought Le Sarthe was a stable track with no issues?  It was shaping up to be a good race and had the feel of a true Endurance GT event, so it was a shame to see so many cars drop out with only just over half the race completed.


Title: Re: UKGPL Season 21 (2011) GT - Le Mans (Sarthe) - Sep 4
Post by: b_1_rd on September 06, 2011, 09:06:28 PM +0100
Hi guys....sorry but I was out of contact for 48hrs from 2 a.m. Sunday evening, babysitting whilst my daughter gave birth to grandson No2  ;D

Congratulations!  :clap:


Title: Re: UKGPL Season 21 (2011) GT - Le Mans (Sarthe) - Sep 4
Post by: happyal on September 06, 2011, 09:25:17 PM +0100
Congrats Clive


Title: Re: UKGPL Season 21 (2011) GT - Le Mans (Sarthe) - Sep 4
Post by: Phil Thornton on September 06, 2011, 10:14:24 PM +0100
Grats Clive  :jumpjoy:


Title: Re: UKGPL Season 21 (2011) GT - Le Mans (Sarthe) - Sep 4
Post by: vosblod on September 06, 2011, 10:17:51 PM +0100
I am surprised that we had so many disco's etc as I always thought Le Sarthe was a stable track with no issues? 
We all did.

Congrats Grandad :wheelchair:


Title: Re: UKGPL Season 21 (2011) GT - Le Mans (Sarthe) - Sep 4
Post by: Geoff65 on September 08, 2011, 01:30:46 AM +0100
I am surprised that we had so many disco's etc as I always thought Le Sarthe was a stable track with no issues? 
We all did.

Congrats Grandad :wheelchair:

I concur.....Congrats Grandad.


Title: Re: UKGPL Season 21 (2011) GT - Le Mans (Sarthe) - Sep 4
Post by: Geoff65 on September 08, 2011, 01:34:05 AM +0100
Seems like the disco's were Internet/node based more than track based. My track and internet were rock solid all race......not a single glitch bar Maddog's occasional dissapearances. Is there upgrade work being carried out on the UK/Euro networks by any chance?


Title: Re: UKGPL Season 21 (2011) GT - Le Mans (Sarthe) - Sep 4
Post by: Hristo Itchov on September 08, 2011, 03:40:24 AM +0100
Quite possible, yes. And IMO it's a combination of factors, because how many times has such thing happened to a Papy track or before we had so many mods and addons? Not very often at all...


Title: Re: UKGPL Season 21 (2011) GT - Le Mans (Sarthe) - Sep 4
Post by: Cookie on September 08, 2011, 04:18:11 PM +0100
Seems like the disco's were Internet/node based more than track based. My track and internet were rock solid all race......not a single glitch bar Maddog's occasional dissapearances. Is there upgrade work being carried out on the UK/Euro networks by any chance?

This was my first thinking too when we had this with italian Formula Libera. But we did a retry with same server a week later and it happened again.
Then we retried with my server (located in Germany) and we had the same again.
Now as it happened with T2 server (located afaik in Italy, Trieste) I don't believe its Internet/node based.

Maybe you have some special core.ini settings?


Title: Re: UKGPL Season 21 (2011) GT - Le Mans (Sarthe) - Sep 4
Post by: fpolicardi on September 08, 2011, 05:02:28 PM +0100
T7 server is located in a Gamesclan server farm somewhere in North Italy, not in Trieste for sure cause where I live is the bottom of the world, speaking of business...

Are you asking about Core.ini settings of the server or the clients? Server is set to the usual 3/84 3/132 with 3 cars behind set by BWpatch.

Ciao

Seems like the disco's were Internet/node based more than track based. My track and internet were rock solid all race......not a single glitch bar Maddog's occasional dissapearances. Is there upgrade work being carried out on the UK/Euro networks by any chance?

This was my first thinking too when we had this with italian Formula Libera. But we did a retry with same server a week later and it happened again.
Then we retried with my server (located in Germany) and we had the same again.
Now as it happened with T2 server (located afaik in Italy, Trieste) I don't believe its Internet/node based.

Maybe you have some special core.ini settings?



Title: Re: UKGPL Season 21 (2011) GT - Le Mans (Sarthe) - Sep 4
Post by: BadBlood on September 08, 2011, 07:48:58 PM +0100
I think we can safely say that the server is rock solid and the settings are correct. Mass disco's like this are usually caused by the way the Internet carries traffic. There is no time guarantee on IPv4 traffic and so a single DNS server can cause many clients to disconnect. It is, however, unusual. We cannot be certain that there was not an interruption at the server end in this particular case since client updates are asynchronous. Unlikely though. If that does not make any sense don't worry.  ;)


Title: Re: UKGPL Season 21 (2011) GT - Le Mans (Sarthe) - Sep 4
Post by: EvilClive on September 08, 2011, 09:06:30 PM +0100
Yeah Paul, that's exactly what I thought the problem might have been. That, coupled with the asynchronous modulation of the sine wave and the contra-rotation of the earth on Sundays.  :punk:


Title: Re: UKGPL Season 21 (2011) GT - Le Mans (Sarthe) - Sep 4
Post by: b_1_rd on September 08, 2011, 09:28:44 PM +0100
so does that all mean the connection may have been pants somewhere along the line?  :blink:


Title: Re: UKGPL Season 21 (2011) GT - Le Mans (Sarthe) - Sep 4
Post by: Cookie on September 08, 2011, 09:55:11 PM +0100
Are you asking about Core.ini settings of the server or the clients?

Yes Fulvio, I know, your server did nothing wrong ;)

This was an answer to Geoffs post ;)

Maybe in his core.ini is a secret why he did not disco, being the one with the longest way to server and highest ping  ::)


Title: Re: UKGPL Season 21 (2011) GT - Le Mans (Sarthe) - Sep 4
Post by: Hristo Itchov on September 08, 2011, 10:32:49 PM +0100
Evil, have you decided what to do with the results yet?


Title: Re: UKGPL Season 21 (2011) GT - Le Mans (Sarthe) - Sep 4
Post by: BadBlood on September 08, 2011, 10:43:53 PM +0100
Yeah Paul, that's exactly what I thought the problem might have been. That, coupled with the asynchronous modulation of the sine wave and the contra-rotation of the earth on Sundays.  :punk:

Glad it was clear ;)


Title: Re: UKGPL Season 21 (2011) GT - Le Mans (Sarthe) - Sep 4
Post by: Geoff65 on September 09, 2011, 07:58:55 AM +0100
[ Communications ]
alternate_ip_addr_lookup=1                  ; Find IP addresses another way  0 = No alternate lookup *  1 = Use alternate way
bcast_augment_status=0                      ; Prepend status with IP address?
bcast_listserv=                               ; IP address of race list server
bcast_listserv_req=                           ; Empty string, or start with '?'
bcast_listserv_req_freq=10.000000           ; Request race list frequency
bcast_ping_disable=0                        ; Disable response to pings
bcast_ping_port=0                           ; Ping port number (0=default)
bcast_port=0                                ; Broadcast port number (0=default)
bcast_recv_disable=0                        ; Disable broadcast reception
bcast_send_disable=0                        ; Disable sending broadcasts
bcast_send_freq=4.000000                    ; Broadcast frequency (seconds)
clock_adj_delay=8                           ; How often may client adjust clock?  Only used when synch_method = 0 (see [ Tasks ]) original=4  in version 1.1 
disable_ipx=0                               ; Disable IPX support
disable_modem=0                             ; Don't look for/use modems
disable_network=0                           ; Disable network support
disable_tcp_ip=0                            ; Disable TCP/IP support
ignore_net_read_errors=1                    ; Don't disco if error reading pkt
ignore_net_send_errors=1                    ; Don't disco if error sending pkt
ip_addr_lookup_timeout=2                    ; Timeout to find own IP address. Default = 2 sec.
log_server_comm_errors=0                    ; Log errors for client channels?
log_server_connect_status=0                 ; Issue messages as clients connect
mem_client_send_every=1                     ; Client packet freq via memory
mem_client_send_size=276                    ; Client packet size via memory
mem_server_send_every=1                     ; Server packet freq via memory
mem_server_send_size=516                    ; Server packet size via memory
net_lan_client_send_every=2                 ; Client packet freq on LAN
net_lan_client_send_size=132                ; Client packet size on LAN
net_lan_server_send_every=2                 ; Server packet freq on LAN
net_lan_server_send_size=388                ; Server packet size on LAN
net_mdm_client_send_every = 3                ; Client packet freq on dialup
net_mdm_client_send_size = 84                ; Client packet size on dialup
net_mdm_server_send_every = 3                 ; Server packet freq on dialup
net_mdm_server_send_size = 384               ; Server packet size on dialup
net_server_port=0                             ; Server port number (0 = default)
net_use_mdm_bandwidth_for_tcp_ip=1            ; Use modem bandwidthfor TCP/IP - 1 = Use net_mdm_ settings *
;net_use_mdm_bandwidth_for_tcp_ip=0            ; Use modem bandwidthfor IPX    - 0 = Use net_lan_ settings


my core.ini as it stands.


Title: Re: UKGPL Season 21 (2011) GT - Le Mans (Sarthe) - Sep 4
Post by: jhalli on September 09, 2011, 09:33:48 AM +0100
looks like standard core.ini, i have same and i guess most of us too.

Juha


Title: Re: UKGPL Season 21 (2011) GT - Le Mans (Sarthe) - Sep 4
Post by: EvilClive on September 12, 2011, 07:29:49 PM +0100
The numerous discos in this race left me with a real dilemma over what to do.

I had hoped that this final race in the first ever GT championship in UKGPL would have been a bit special. It was to have been 50% longer than all the previous races and at a circuit that is surely the true "home" of GT racing I was hoping that we would get a real buzz and feel for the "Le Mans" fever.

Things started well enough and even the rolling start seemed to evoke some real atmosphere. Just as in real life, the bigger faster cars shot away into the distance as soon as we hit Mulsanne and it seems they paid the usual price at Mulsanne corner on the 1st lap where there was a coming together of epic proportions. From then on the race developed into several smaller battles as cars and drivers sorted themselves out and I found things very enjoyable even in my Porsche. I had hoped that the longer race length might have shown up the frailty of some of the more powerful cars towards the end of the race and that might have added an extra spice to the mix.
Unfortunately we never got to find out if there would have been any mechanical retirements as the IT gremlins intervened and disco'd more than half of the racers.

This happened just after half distance and I have thought long and hard about what I should do about it.

Because the majority of the discos happened after half way our rules do not insist on calling this a "void" race.
I suspect that even if we arranged a re-run, we would not wish to do it on the same circuit and not all drivers would be able/willing to take part. That would make any new result somewhat artificial.
To allow the result to stand as the server recorded the race seems to be grossly unfair on all those who were disconnected, but we have always had discos in GPL and we only consider a re-run if the mass disco happens on Lap 1.

Therefore I am going to let the result stand exactly as the race finished on the server. It is harsh on those who were denied a chance to race to the finish, but our rules really do not allow for races to be re scheduled simply because several drivers were disco'd. If we amend this result we set a precedent for future events where maybe 3-4 drivers are disco'd and call for a re-race because we did it here, and that could affect an awful lot of races.

The results as published stand subject to moderation, which will follow in a few days now that the decision over the result has been made.




Title: Re: UKGPL Season 21 (2011) GT - Le Mans (Sarthe) - Sep 4
Post by: BadBlood on September 12, 2011, 10:33:48 PM +0100
I've updated the teams so the Points table looks a little better. Especially for Red GT whose drivers finished 1st, 2nd and ... 14th <ahem> in the individual table (which doesn't count, of course).


Title: Re: UKGPL Season 21 (2011) GT - Le Mans (Sarthe) - Sep 4
Post by: fpolicardi on September 13, 2011, 09:54:22 AM +0100
Clive, what about those that weren't discoed and only lost from results like me and you and still running when Geoff retired and server showed the chequered flag? What are the rules about? I know I'm lazy to search  ;D


Title: Re: UKGPL Season 21 (2011) GT - Le Mans (Sarthe) - Sep 4
Post by: fpolicardi on September 13, 2011, 10:38:32 AM +0100
Sry Juha, I hadn't seen your reply.
I get your point, but I think that single disco/freeze that occurs at any track weren't never take in account by mods, as Hristo said.
We're speaking of 9 drivers discoed and 2 drivers lost by the server results at the same time out of 14 drivers on track at the moment.
Anyway Clive has already posted his decision and it will regret it for the rest oh his years  ;D
Ciao


I think it would more fair if we get the results when Tim crossed last time the s/f line at 16th lap so all get their right position. After that there was a mass disco and only 3 drivers were counted.
Ciao


no this is only fair to those drivers who was able to race till "mass disco" , not fair at all for drivers who discoed or have screen freezes before "mass disco" and this all is happening because track have disco issues. Should you just say to these drivers it was just a bad luck and please look forward ?

i recommend re -race with another track that is known " no problem track"





Title: Re: UKGPL Season 21 (2011) GT - Le Mans (Sarthe) - Sep 4
Post by: fpolicardi on September 13, 2011, 10:59:48 AM +0100
Clive, what about those that weren't discoed and only lost from results like me and you and still running when Geoff retired and server showed the chequered flag? What are the rules about? I know I'm lazy to search  ;D

Find it: https://www.ukgpl.com/index.php/rules/sporting
I know, I haven't better to do today...
 ;D :angel:


Title: Re: UKGPL Season 21 (2011) GT - Le Mans (Sarthe) - Sep 4
Post by: BadBlood on September 13, 2011, 11:47:48 AM +0100
Clive can, at his discretion, ask me to look at the replay and adjust the finishing position of anyone who was 'lost'. I believe that is you and Clive. Server owner and moderator - hmmm. Can't see anyone moaning about that ;)


Title: Re: UKGPL Season 21 (2011) GT - Le Mans (Sarthe) - Sep 4
Post by: jhalli on September 13, 2011, 01:02:47 PM +0100
Sry Juha, I hadn't seen your reply.
I get your point, but I think that single disco/freeze that occurs at any track weren't never take in account by mods, as Hristo said.
We're speaking of 9 drivers discoed and 2 drivers lost by the server results at the same time out of 14 drivers on track at the moment.
Anyway Clive has already posted his decision and it will regret it for the rest oh his years  ;D
Ciao


I think it would more fair if we get the results when Tim crossed last time the s/f line at 16th lap so all get their right position. After that there was a mass disco and only 3 drivers were counted.
Ciao


no this is only fair to those drivers who was able to race till "mass disco" , not fair at all for drivers who discoed or have screen freezes before "mass disco" and this all is happening because track have disco issues. Should you just say to these drivers it was just a bad luck and please look forward ?

i recommend re -race with another track that is known " no problem track"





no i dont mean you should take accounts single drivers discoes ,btw i very rarely have disco issues and screen freezes ,  i mean moderators should look the race as a its entirety, and ask "was this good racing? " no i think, i just dont see any good points and no good racing when over 50% of drivers have disconnected because track have issues, honestly this is the race that should count at all ,mean points.



Juha


Title: Re: UKGPL Season 21 (2011) GT - Le Mans (Sarthe) - Sep 4
Post by: Hristo Itchov on September 13, 2011, 01:39:55 PM +0100
I'm still for the idea of using the classification on the last completed lap before the mass disco and hand out half points (something like Monaco 84 or Adelaide 91).


Title: Re: UKGPL Season 21 (2011) GT - Le Mans (Sarthe) - Sep 4
Post by: BadBlood on September 13, 2011, 04:10:24 PM +0100
That is quite difficult to accomplish with LM2 set up the way it is. The race result can be adjusted but the points are fixed per position I believe. Although this is unsatisfactory it needs a re-run really but as the last race of the season I don't think many drivers would pitch up for it, especially as the series has been decided.


Title: Re: UKGPL Season 21 (2011) GT - Le Mans (Sarthe) - Sep 4
Post by: Hristo Itchov on September 13, 2011, 06:07:48 PM +0100
That is quite difficult to accomplish with LM2 set up the way it is. The race result can be adjusted but the points are fixed per position I believe. Although this is unsatisfactory it needs a re-run really but as the last race of the season I don't think many drivers would pitch up for it, especially as the series has been decided.

I think the biggest demotivating factor for a rerun is "GP distance race at Le Mans Sarthe".  :D If it had been another track and shorter distance, it would have probably been OK, but with this... yawn.


Title: Re: UKGPL Season 21 (2011) GT - Le Mans (Sarthe) - Sep 4
Post by: BadBlood on September 13, 2011, 10:48:24 PM +0100
Quite <yawn>