UKGPL Season 22 (2011-2012) - UKGPL v GPL Brasil - Jan 15, 2012 NOW WITH F2

[Geoff65]

All F2 sounds good to me.           Seems to me that the F2 engine unit weight is well down on the others.....so, BBias of 60-61 is what I'm using effectively....and yes Axel I'm braking later into Para as well with no ill effects. Set a more forward bias and try it out.

[Hristo Itchov]

I don't think my problem comes from brake bias. I don't lock up the rear or front, it's all balanced. It's just that to reach the limit of the tire, it has to go more sideways, and that makes the rear very loose when the weight goes on the front while you decelerate. Similarly, you need to turn the front wheels more than with 67s or other mods, to reach the limit of adhesion. It makes for a rather unpredictable car to handle, especially if you try to push towards the limit of grip. On corner exits it's actually quite understeery, so it's easy to put the power down, but corner entries are tricky.

[1967driver]

I don't think my problem comes from brake bias. I don't lock up the rear or front, it's all balanced. It's just that to reach the limit of the tire, it has to go more sideways, and that makes the rear very loose when the weight goes on the front while you decelerate. Similarly, you need to turn the front wheels more than with 67s or other mods, to reach the limit of adhesion. It makes for a rather unpredictable car to handle, especially if you try to push towards the limit of grip. On corner exits it's actually quite understeery, so it's easy to put the power down, but corner entries are tricky.

I think F2 is the first mod in wich physic tend towards realism, also if car's behavior remains beyond the physical laws.

[clouds]

It is quite impressive how did you find up all these differences between all mods in so few time, thinking I still don't know much about the only 3 mods I've ever used (67, GT and 65 since 2 weeks)  

[Hristo Itchov]

Well, the reason I don't agree on the realism part is because I've read in many sources those cars were quite understeery. That's why they almost always used maximum open differential on coast side and maximum locked diff on power side. The former to allow them to turn better at corner entry and the latter to break the rear under throttle and then drift it around the corner exit. With the F2 mod the cars are much looser because of those larger slip angles of the tires and you really have no feeling for the limit of the car because the limit is beyond the normal direction the car is going. It's almost like driving a 4WD rally car on loose surface, except you don't have front drive to pull you through.

For that reason alone you need to go more conservative with the setup, otherwise you end up in sudden half-spins here and there anytime you push the car to its limit. And while before I thought drivers of the era were not pushing 100%, my opinion changed after reading a few articles written back then. There was no compromise in terms of driving, the drivers were really extracting the maximum out of the cars.

I will continue to experiment with setup changes when I have more time, but so far that's my conclusion. Of course, it doesn't detract from the mod being enjoyable to drive and it should produce some really good and close racing, but if I have to compare it to other mods in terms of realism, I think the 66 mod is much more realistic, at least tire model wise.

[s2173]

Well, about how it feels... I dont know. But it drives more realisticly in my opinion... In 65's and 66's you can really just drift the car (just tapping the brakes wery late in corner, sliding car aside and accelerating to pull yourself out of corner)  which seems to be slower, but not emmidiatly obvious. You can do the same with porsche from gt mod. In f2's it doesnt work, and tuyng to drift these cars gives you really bad exit speed, especialy because of the low power of cars, so the benefit of proper entrance/exit shows. It might be better newbie mod in that sence, because 65's might give bad habits if driven extencivly...   

I did find a setup that brakes wery stable, and so far been using it with all the cars and getting decent times... 60 brake bias helps, but i have the impression the default setup makes the front tyres bite too much on braking too. I cant post files here tho... has 3/2 front shocks, 4/3 rear, -0.60 front chamber, -0.100 front toe, 60 brake bias, 85/30/6 diff... shocks seem to do the trick mostly, but what do i know.

[1967driver]

Everything that prevents GPL's drivers to drive as in rallycar on dirt road, it's a step towards realism, imho.

[Hristo Itchov]

It's the opposite with F2, to drive them on the limit you have to keep them sideways all the time, otherwise you're just not reaching the limit of the tires. That's the point I'm trying to make. Their limit of grip is at much sideways position than the other mods. I wanted to record a video with Fraps to show you that, but for some reason GPL crashes when I press the record button. Not sure if it's the F2 mod or something else went wrong on my system. I'll deal with it when I have more time.

[BadBlood]

Would be happy to turn up if there are enough spaces.
Can someone confirm if Interlagos will be 65 or F2?

It was meant to be up to the participants to vote. I think we are using F2 but I will check with Raoni.

[kinghiro]

working that night

[Doni Yourth]

Sry, fellas, but I'm having to pull my entry.  I'll be out of town.

Best of Luck! 

[Baab]

Hi Guys, I'll be up for this.

Erm...has the mod changed, I thought it was going to 67s at Interlagos, which seemed to be a good match.

How do we expect to match up against the Brazilians?  Are they all Senna types or more Ricardo Zonta?  Just wondering if we are expecting another GPL(no)fun style drubbing!

Bob.

[Hristo Itchov]

I can promise you it won't be a walk in the park for them if I find the time to participate. 

[Raoni Frizzo]

Well...only 4 days remaining for the race. For those who are interested in some training, I put now a server running Silverstone with F2. Tommorow I'll try to put one running Interlagos with the 65s

How do we expect to match up against the Brazilians?  Are they all Senna types or more Ricardo Zonta?  Just wondering if we are expecting another GPL(no)fun style drubbing!

Bob.

Well, don't expect some Ayrton Sennas running for GPL Brasil next sunday, because unfortunately a lot of our drivers won't be able to make up the race I think we'll be more like Ricardo Zonta style or something even worse, like Ricardo Rosset types

Anyway, it'll be surely a very nice event. Interlagos is a very tricky circuit, even with slower cars, and Silverstone is always a challenging one, with lots of overtaking places.

[BadBlood]

It was always 65's at Interlagos Bob. I want to drive this one and I just can't do the 67's at Inter...

You have to get SOME benefit from organising a race.

I have stuck up a practice session for F2s at Silvy. No excuse for not practising now...