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  • S2367W Dijon-Prenois: November 04, 2012
November 04, 2012, 10:35:25 PM +0000 - Dijon-Prenois (GP) - UKGPL Season 23 (2012) Works Trophy (67)
Driver
 Team
Nat. Make Model Class Qualifying Race
Tyres Pos Time/Gap Pos Time/Gap Laps Stops Best Retirement
reason
Ballast
Podkrecony_Ziutek
 Clark-Hill Racing
Ferrari 312 (1967) F1 1967 3 +0.905
101.345mph
1 52:34.689
99.700mph
37 1:24.036
101.154mph
Firestone  
Arf Arf Arf
 Team Baarf
Brabham BT24 (Repco) F1 1967 8 +2.165
99.845mph
2 +24.324
98.937mph
37 1:24.836
100.201mph
Goodyear  
Al Heller
 Clark-Hill Racing
Cooper T81b (Maserati) F1 1967 5 +1.699
100.395mph
3 +25.233
98.909mph
37 1:24.691
100.372mph
Firestone  
AndyL
 
Cooper T81b (Maserati) F1 1967 7 +1.998
100.041mph
4 +50.124
98.141mph
37 1:25.388
99.553mph
Firestone  
s2173
 Team7
BRM P115 F1 1967 9 +2.392
99.580mph
5 +1:00.130
97.835mph
37 1:25.631
99.270mph
Goodyear  
EvilClive
 HikiWazaRacing
Honda RA300 F1 1967 10 +3.157
98.695mph
6 +1:06.950
97.628mph
37 1:25.151
99.830mph
Firestone  
Raoni Frizzo
 Team Coyote
Ferrari 312 (1967) F1 1967 12 7 +2L
99.012mph
35 1:23.880
101.343mph
Firestone  
Baab
 Team Baarf
Cooper T81b (Maserati) F1 1967 2 +0.717
101.573mph
8 +23L
98.493mph
14 1:24.233
100.918mph
Disco
Firestone  
Hristo Itchov
 HikiWazaRacing
Honda RA300 F1 1967 4 +1.464
100.674mph
9 +25L
99.955mph
12 1:23.602
101.680mph
Disco
Firestone  
Artiglietti
 
Cooper T81b (Maserati) F1 1967 1 1:22.973
102.450mph
10 +30L
99.778mph
7 1:23.960
101.246mph
Disco
Firestone  
Ronniepeterson
 Clark-Hill Racing
Cooper T81b (Maserati) F1 1967 6 +1.985
100.057mph
11 +36L
87.035mph
1 1:35.560
88.956mph
accident
Firestone  
Gpg UKGPL
 
Eagle T1G (Weslake 1967) F1 1967 11 12 DNS ---
---
Goodyear  

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Author Topic: UKGPL Season 23 (2012) Works Trophy (67) - Dijon-Prenois - Nov 4  (Read 7027 times)
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Al Heller
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« Reply #15 on: November 06, 2012, 01:33:22 PM +0000 »

The server replay (not available via the thread link btw) matches mine & shows the full horror of the warp between me & Bob (screengrabs from server replay):

Me & Bob seem to leave each other plenty of room here...



yet on the very next frame Bob gets thumped sideways



I don't remember seeing a warp collision with cars that far apart before. Is that normal? I've got a wired connection to my router but I know Bob did use wireless in the past - might that be a contributing factor?

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Hristo Itchov
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« Reply #16 on: November 06, 2012, 02:49:04 PM +0000 »

When a driver sees everyone around him warping, but others see only that driver, then it's that driver's connection end which is at fault.

BTW this race was yet another example that without the 50-75% distance rule for point scoring, the championship does not reflect very well what happens on the track. Myself and Art retired so early in the race, yet because of the small grid, we still score a substantial amount of points. I imagine this makes it rather frustrating for those who go on to finish the whole distance and still don't reduce the points gap by much. I've been in that position and it was the main reason I was asking for that rule to be introduced, so I don't quite understand why we don't apply it to all divisions.
« Last Edit: November 06, 2012, 02:51:17 PM +0000 by Hristo Itchov » Logged

Artiglietti
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« Reply #17 on: November 06, 2012, 05:20:17 PM +0000 »

Honestly I have never quite understood that idea, it always seemed to me somewhat artificial. With the 50% distance rule, you end up giving an excessive advantage to someone who crashed out at L20 instead of L15. Also, if you consider the people who were wiped off by others' mistakes at T1 in some races (erm erm.. Embarrassed), that would be a further undeserved punishment. Maybe theres something I dont see, but I think the 50% rule feels a bit like an on/off switch which is forced upon your race, and is not going to reflect the real values showed on track anyway. There is always going to be a random element in the points you get when you hit trouble in a race, but I think the best thing would be getting rid of this system that allows everyone to pick up points just by taking the green flag. We had this discussion already though, and I seem to remember the overwhelming majority was in favour of the new point system...
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Hristo Itchov
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« Reply #18 on: November 06, 2012, 06:03:37 PM +0000 »

That's why I'm more supportive of the 75% distance rule than the 50%, especially since we don't do full GP races. The main thing is that with smaller grid, it's next to impossible to recover gaps in the points because drivers just have to enter a race and then even if they retire, they'll still score well.
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Al Heller
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« Reply #19 on: November 06, 2012, 06:59:14 PM +0000 »

That's why I'm more supportive of the 75% distance rule than the 50%, especially since we don't do full GP races. The main thing is that with smaller grid, it's next to impossible to recover gaps in the points because drivers just have to enter a race and then even if they retire, they'll still score well.

Judging by the speed of some of the Privateers I would hope the Works grid will be getting bigger next season...

The scoring issue struck me after one of the F2 races this season when my internet connection went down soon after I'd joined qualifying - I missed the race entirely yet still managed to score 13 points - not a bad return for a couple of minutes of practice! 
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maddog
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« Reply #20 on: November 06, 2012, 07:01:21 PM +0000 »

The idea behind a closer points scoring system, was to encourage slower drivers to join in?  Adding a requirement to survive beyond half way, seems to discourage unskilled drivers, who struggle to make race distance. These 2 ideas conflict with each other.  The middle ground would be to abandon both, and that would be my choice. Cool
« Last Edit: November 06, 2012, 07:03:31 PM +0000 by maddog » Logged
Ronniepeterson
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« Reply #21 on: November 06, 2012, 07:37:26 PM +0000 »

That's why I'm more supportive of the 75% distance rule than the 50%, especially since we don't do full GP races. The main thing is that with smaller grid, it's next to impossible to recover gaps in the points because drivers just have to enter a race and then even if they retire, they'll still score well.

I agree it is very fortuitous to pick up good points when retiring early from a race with a small grid. But this could be helped if people who register for a series actually turned up on a regular basis. There are 14 full time Works drivers and yet only the first two races of the season have had more than 14 drivers turning up including non FT drivers.

I fear a 50% distance rule would thin the grid, just look at the Historics

and a 75% distance rule would more or less empty the grid.

One for further discussion in the season review I suspect.
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Baab
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« Reply #22 on: November 06, 2012, 07:54:16 PM +0000 »

  It was a bit close but the move seemed to be on when Al's car jumped sideways into mine and sent me into the barrier, losing both right hand wheels.  A look at the replay confirmed the warp and thankfully Al seemed unaffected (was this the case?).

Oops I see we posted around the same time Bob. So as a technical question, if your replay shows me jumping sideways & my replay shows nothing at all - which one of us provided the warp factor? Or is the server replay the only way to find a definitive answer?

Either way, I'm sorry you ended up in the barrier as it looked like we were going to have a good scrap Sad



Yeah a cheeky bit of warp, I had to laugh when I saw your pics, I'm laying down a proper amount of rubber for a good few yards...do I tend to drive more sideways than most?

I am using a wireless connection, although I did use a cable a while back (until our rabbits chewed through it).  I generally have a good connection these days, with low latency.  All other cars appeared warp free so I didn't suspect anything.  Did anyone have any concerns about my possible warping from qual/the start?  Please feedback any concerns at the next race, I certainly don't want to spoil the fun of others.

Afterwards I obviously rued the situation and thought I shouldn't have been so hasty, but as you pointed out, we were a reasonable distance apart.  I still enjoyed the racing.


Bob.
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« Reply #23 on: November 06, 2012, 09:44:01 PM +0000 »

Although I have raced mainly on a wire this Works season, this was largely to do with a problem with my wifi (now cured with the removal of PowerDVD which would switch it on and off!)

As such I can, and have, used wifi/wires interchangeably with absolutely no perceptible difference in connection quality.......inasmuch as I get massive warp on both sometimes.........

...and whilst we're on the subject, I only race on a laptop. I have to use GPL PowerMonger, otherwise warp is guaranteed, and I have to double check every time that my router knows that my GPL profile is associated to the laptop (it sometimes drops this association for reasons I've never been able to work out). However, I have raced many times on wifi, on a laptop...........
« Last Edit: November 06, 2012, 09:49:38 PM +0000 by Arf Arf Arf » Logged
Hristo Itchov
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« Reply #24 on: November 06, 2012, 10:02:27 PM +0000 »

The idea behind a closer points scoring system, was to encourage slower drivers to join in?  Adding a requirement to survive beyond half way, seems to discourage unskilled drivers, who struggle to make race distance. These 2 ideas conflict with each other.  The middle ground would be to abandon both, and that would be my choice. Cool

That's why we have separate divisions. When I said I would like to see the rule introduced to all divisions, I should have specified that I meant the divisions I race in, so that doesn't include the privateers/novices/heavies.

As for the points system, I'm totally supportive of a more spaced out point system as the one we had in the past. Finishing higher up should be rewarded better compared to a lower finishing position.

I fear a 50% distance rule would thin the grid, just look at the Historics

and a 75% distance rule would more or less empty the grid.

One for further discussion in the season review I suspect.

Racing shouldn't be just about speed, but consistency and not making mistakes. Scoring by just hotlapping in the beginning and retiring early (for whatever reason) doesn't make sense to me. I very much doubt the thinner grids have anything to do with the 50% distance rule.
« Last Edit: November 06, 2012, 10:09:24 PM +0000 by Hristo Itchov » Logged

Ross Neilson
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« Reply #25 on: November 09, 2012, 09:05:58 PM +0000 »

The server replay (not available via the thread link btw)

Apologies Al, there was a typo in the link. Fixed now.
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Racing as Ross Neilson 65/66/69 for Clark-Hill Racing
Ross Neilson
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« Reply #26 on: December 01, 2012, 09:36:30 PM +0000 »

Mod published, apologies for the delay.
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Racing as Ross Neilson 65/66/69 for Clark-Hill Racing
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