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Author Topic: Trouble shooting and tips  (Read 10532 times)
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Rich_A
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« on: January 25, 2006, 02:13:49 PM +0000 »

Disconnections.

Disconnections back to lobby aren't Simbin fault either. Internet is a complex thing. What you will probably find is that your line stats are poor, i.e poor attenuation and poor signal to noise ratio!! If you have a router you can find these things out.. I had poor stats and tried different things but eventually I phoned my ISP and they asked me to connect to btwholesale line test for 12 hours or more. After that period they said I had been disconnected several times and would send an engineer out to investigate. The engineer did some tests on my line, went down the street to a box somewhere came back and said he changed a few boards around - no idea what he did but my stats were excellent after that even good enough for 8mb line!! Sometimes lines can be like a blocked toilet, you got to phone for a plumber to flush the blockage away.

Strange decrease, then normal then decrease in frame rate.

Those sudden low FPS is for sure throttling of GFX card which is caused by too much heat. When it reaches certain temp GPU and RAM speeds are lowered considerably to slower speeds in an attempt to decrease temps.

I know Nvidia are quite harsh on throttling. I had it on my previous FX5900.. only way I fixed it was by making a bios for it with no throttling at all and then flashing it but that's quite difficult to do!! If you want me to explain more how to do it I can? Anyhow I flashed FX5900 and it fixed it but there is a risk always doing that sort of thing.

Other way is some better cooling on GFX card i.e more expensive heatsink and fan, also got to keep case cool. Or alternatively, buy an ATI card cause they can take higher temps and have little or maybe no throttling at all - not sure but my x850xt gets to 50+ frames all the time. I cap frames at 50 by underclocking refresh rate to 50hz and then vsync on and triple buffering forced on via ATI Tray Tools. I got 50 all the time no matter what including starts.. and it's super silky smooth due to the vsync [no tears] and triple buffer [completely removes latency caused by capping frames and totally removes tiny stutters that occur without triple buffering].

You got two choices really, flash bios or buy ATI card!!

Also, to keep my case cool I have PSU out side of case, side panel off and funneled ventilation system [using three big case fans and then re-directed 90 degrees] blowing cold air from outside window directly onto CPU and therefore around mobo. The funnel is made from card board and is air tight.  Smiley

Been there, got the T-Shirt. Nvidia, never again!! I have no complaints at all about both ATI cards i've had and using ATI Tray tools you got loads of additional tweaks and options.

Operating system and driver tweaks.

Firstly make sure that no programs can interupt D3D. Things like scheduled live updates and windows messenger. If you have messenger enabled in services it can bring you back to desktop and give you an advertisement. To disable this go to control panel\administrative tools\services - go down to messenger, right click, properties, startup type and select disabled. Also turn off automatic updates in service list.

L2 Cache registry mod if you have 512kb L2 cache CPU as windows defaults to 256k. Download CPUz fro here http://www.cpuid.com/cpuz.php. Load CPUz and on first CPU page on right side at bottom it says what L2 cacheis. If it's 512 or more do this registry tweak.

The L2, or second-level, cache, is an integral part of your CPU. However, XP is very shoddy at detecting it, so setting it manually is sometimes necessary. It's easy to do, though, you simply have to navigate to

HKEY_LOCAL_MACHINE\SYSTEM\CurrentControlSet\Control\Session Manager\Memory Management\

in the registry and find the value SecondLevelDataCache. You must then adjust it to the value (in kilobytes) of the L2 Cache of your processor. The L2 Cache of your processor should be entered in Decimal.

So all you do is find that registry entry by doing 'run' regedit, and then put your L2 cache with the 'Decimal' option selected as oposed to hexadecimal. I put 512 in decimal seen as my Barton is 512k L2 cache.

I am also currently investigating other registry tweaks and will add them if they are successful.

Another good one is disabling sideband addressing [SBA] for GFX card as this can cause CTD and lockups. First find out if it's enabled by loading CPUz http://www.cpuid.com/download/cpu-z-132.zip, look on 'Mainboard' tab and at bottom it says if enabled or disabled. If enabled the only way I know to disable is through powerstrip. Download powerstrip from here http://www.entechtaiwan.net/util/ps.shtm. Install it and probably reboot is required. Then right click PStrip task tray icon\options\preferences and make sure 'autoload with windows' is ticked. Now go to Pstrip task tray\options\adpator information.. here you can disable SBA. Untick 'Read-only' and then untick SBA. Also you can set latency of AGP - I set to 64. And you can disable or enable fast writes here too but that is better done via a bios option. Fast writes on most cards causes instability, i.e lockups CTD.. but some cards need it enabled like 9600XT and my X850XT. Once you've disabled side band addressing check again with CPUz.

Another thing to try to help with stability is increasing vagp in bios. My previous 9800 Pro needed 1.6vagp otherwise I got CTD and hangs. Default is 1.5vagp so I wouldn't go above 1.6vagp cause it could damage a card.

I found out that Video RAM cacheable, Video BIOS cahcheable and System RAM cacheable can cause instability when enabled. So perhaps if you're having crash to desktop try disabling all three options if possible. These options on my NF7 are in the bios under 'Advanced Options'. For a while I had Video RAM cacheable enabled and I got crash to desktops eventually in all 3D applications, so this option is best left disabled for stability.

GTR tweaks.


First thing is I always delete config.ini after rebooting and starting a session. Then I make new by running 3dconfig. Once new config is made make sure to open and set VBSTRATEGY=0.

Do this tweak - Try in userdata\defviews.cam under cockpit these settings

OrientationRate=(360.000000, 360.000000, 360.000000)

This stops any unnatural resistance and removes any small jitters in cockpit and espceially jitters in a turn.

This is for seeing actual dampers settings rather that clicks.. Damper Units="1" // Show damper settings as (0)clicks or (1)actual force units [found in your .plr in userdata folder.

To decrease lag disable high process priority in .plr High Process Priority="0" // Improves FPS on some systems, but may conflict with some background applications


If you're having any further issues, let me know and i'll try to help.

KeyDelay


This program assign's buttons on wheel to key strokes. Logitech Profiler has some bugs i.e it can cause sticking gears or loss of FFB, then use KeyDelay instead. I only ever used Profiler for key strokes so np not using it anymore.

Press button on wheel you want to assign key stroke, then highlight this button on left. Put in delay time, 200 ms is what I use and then choose which key stroke to use. i.e for shift up I use M and down N. Now in sim I assign shift up to M and shift down to N. This is ideal for any double shift problems, especially in GTR as it is able to recognise shifts within a very short space of time.

http://www.auyu41.dsl.pipex.com/KeyDelay.zip

« Last Edit: March 23, 2006, 10:44:38 AM +0000 by Rich_A » Logged

fozzmeister
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« Reply #1 on: January 25, 2006, 02:51:05 PM +0000 »

Disconnections.

Disconnections back to lobby aren't Simbin fault either. Internet is a complex thing. What you will probably find is that your line stats are poor, i.e poor attenuation and poor signal to noise ratio!! If you have a router you can find these things out.. I had poor stats and tried different things but eventually I phoned my ISP and they asked me to connect to btwholesale line test for 12 hours or more. After that period they said I had been disconnected several times and would send an engineer out to investigate. The engineer did some tests on my line, went down the street to a box somewhere came back and said he changed a few boards around - no idea what he did but my stats were excellent after that even good enough for 8mb line!! Sometimes lines can be like a blocked toilet, you got to phone for a plumber to flush the blockage away.

Strange decrease, the normal then decrease in frame rate.

Those sudden low FPS is for sure throttling of GFX card which is caused by too much heat. When it reaches certain temp GPU and RAM speeds are lowered considerably to slower speeds in an attempt to decrease temps.

I know Nvidia are quite harsh on throttling. I had it on my previous FX5900.. only way I fixed it was by making a bios for it with no throttling at all and then flashing it but that's quite difficult to do!! If you want me to explain more how to do it I can? Anyhow I flashed FX5900 and it fixed it but there is a risk always doing that sort of thing.

Other way is some better cooling on GFX card i.e more expensive heatsink and fan, also got to keep case cool. Or alternatively, buy an ATI card cause they can take higher temps and have little or maybe no throttling at all - not sure but my x850xt gets to 50+ frames all the time. I cap frames at 50 by underclocking refresh rate to 50hz and then vsync on. I got 50 all the time no matter what including starts.. and it's super silky smooth as you can probably imagine.

If anyone want me to look into flashing bios on GFX card, I can do send me PM cause I think even with better temps it will still after a while throttle down. You got two choices really, flash bios or buy ATI card!!

Also, to keep my case cool I have PSU out side of case, side panel off and funneled ventilation system [using three big case fans and then re-directed 90 degrees] blowing cold air from outside window directly onto CPU and therefore around mobo. The funnel is made from card board and is air tight.  Smiley

Been there, got the T-Shirt. Nvidia, never again!! I have no complaints at all about both ATI cards i've had and using ATI Tray tools you got loads of additional tweaks and options.

My god, running a CRT screen at 50Hz, I'm surprised your not blind!

The PSU sucks air out of the case, no idea why you would want to remove it from the case, yes its hot in there, but its an exhaust. ATX design is to bring cool air in through the bottom front and expel through the top rear (around the PSU area). If you move too far away from away from the basic ATX princiles, using side fans or as you have done, houshold fans you may not actually move air in a predictable way or recycle hot air. If you have serious problems tho, this might be a potential solution, but I would look to a higher quality case (eBuyer have ChiefTec Dragon's for 23 quid but they are green) with some good quality fans.

Thanks for your SimBin bug workarounds.
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Rich_A
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« Reply #2 on: January 25, 2006, 03:03:38 PM +0000 »

Lol i'm used to 50hz now, and you get clearer IQ at lower refresh rates. But it can be a bit of strain on the eye after a while I agree. The pro of getting a consistant 50 frames all the time far out weight the con of damaging my eyes lol!! And it really helps give me a totally consistant feel to my laps, in fact it's absolute consistancy as it is in reality.. of course I use standard 85hz for desktop. I use powerstrip to set refresh rates for specific resolutions and also to underclock or set specific refresh rates like 50hz which is lowest my CRT will go - I recommend it. I use 1280x960x32@50hz for sims..

If you got time this is an interesting thread I started - http://forum.rscnet.org/showthread.php?t=220389&highlight=light.

I'm sure a proper case works well but with my system I gain about 10 degrees on CPU cause it ventilated cold air directly from an open window and then all funnelled through a tiny 7000 rpm fan half an inch from CPU heatsink and fan.. I can do 2.5ghz at 2.0vcore np of an evening on my Barton, on a A64 Venice I could probably do very high overclock.
« Last Edit: January 25, 2006, 03:07:00 PM +0000 by Rich_A » Logged

fozzmeister
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« Reply #3 on: January 25, 2006, 03:07:12 PM +0000 »

Yeh I understand all that, why not just set your FPS at 50 (I believe rF at least can do that), and refresh at 100, that'd be the far wiser choice.

ISI based engines have quite high latency I read, which is greatly reduced with FPS, so high consistent FPS is a good thing, but so is eye candy.
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Rich_A
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« Reply #4 on: January 25, 2006, 03:20:43 PM +0000 »

Reason I do it with vysnc on is cause it's a true 1:1 sync with gfx card and CRT. With fram rate cappers like rfactor I found out there are errors [v-retrace errors!!] which cause tiny stutters and bad loops. As my frames get higher with better hardware I can increase refresh rate but atm I got to run a bare minimum of 50 with 7 cars visible and medium detail cars.. but still I got nice IQ from x850xt with 4xFSAA and 4xquality with trilinear AF. Also I force triple buffering cause without it I get stutters even when vsynced at 50hz which is qute odd but I guess the extra buffer gives my card some time to sort stuff out before I see it cause it is super smooth like perfect motion is in reality.

With powerstrip you can set any refresh rate above 50 so you can be very specific i.e 54, 63 ect.. just got to make sure you know what frames are first with vysnc off. Once you know lowest frame rate you can set refresh rate one or two frame lower and be sure with vsync on it will run at that refresh rate consistantly. If you want to change refresh rate with powerstrip it's right click Pstrip task tray\display\configure then switch to resolution you want to edit refresh rate for. Then go to advanced timing options. Put marker infront of first number in refresh rates and delete numbers before decimal point using numpad delete cause otherwise it changes in real time and is impossible to get desired number. So delete with numpad and enter desired refresh rate then press ok. Make sure the padlock is ticked [depressed] and then that resolution will force selected refresh rate every time that resolution is loaded regardless of game settings.
« Last Edit: January 25, 2006, 03:31:12 PM +0000 by Rich_A » Logged

mo
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« Reply #5 on: January 25, 2006, 03:26:26 PM +0000 »


My god, running a CRT screen at 50Hz, I'm surprised your not blind!


OMG you will go blind, seriously though that's really bad for your eyes Rich.
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Truetom
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« Reply #6 on: January 25, 2006, 05:02:04 PM +0000 »

Lol, I heard somewhere that you can go blind if do things with your hand under the blanket...  Tongue
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locutos ukgtr
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« Reply #7 on: January 25, 2006, 06:07:16 PM +0000 »

Under the blanket? Oh sh*t.....lol
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PaulW
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« Reply #8 on: January 26, 2006, 09:41:42 AM +0000 »

Lol, I heard somewhere that you can go blind if do things with your hand under the blanket...  Tongue
I'm living proof that isn't true! Wink  Grin
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« Reply #9 on: January 26, 2006, 09:59:04 AM +0000 »

Tx Rich, gonna try OrientationRate=(360.000000, 360.000000, 360.000000) Smiley

Can set it in GTL as well btw peeps. Not sure if it will do anything for me though, since... I don't really have any of these problems, lol! Cheesy

The average TV has 50Hz refresh as well btw, maybe try to use that for gaming Rich Wink LOL! /me can still remember the good ole days of C64 and MSX sitting behind the tele at about 60 cm and having this weird burning sensation in his eyes after a couple of hours! ROFL!

T
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fozzmeister
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« Reply #10 on: January 26, 2006, 11:32:40 AM +0000 »

You look at TV's in a totally different way to monitors I think, or at least your sat a long way further back.

Fozz
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Rich_A
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« Reply #11 on: January 26, 2006, 09:13:16 PM +0000 »

360 thing is very important cause with default I get these tiny stutters in a turn.
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« Reply #12 on: January 26, 2006, 09:33:54 PM +0000 »

360 thing is very important cause with default I get these tiny stutters in a turn.

Didn't need it for performance but I'm glad you reminded me about OrientationRate, 'cause that's what I did to the views in GTR to get a proper bonnet-cam which supports 100% World Movement and doesn't have the world and the bonnet rolling around in turns - just the world. Grin
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Rich_A
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« Reply #13 on: February 27, 2006, 08:00:07 PM +0000 »

I've been thinking lately and have come up with a theory. There's a high priority option in .plr.. I bet there are a few who have this enabled. I know I used to have it enabled to prevent CTD, but this was before I got good PSU. Then I thought recently if it's enabled then it could potentially cause lag. I might be talking complete nonsense but I did notice a little less lag with it disabled.
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Rich_A
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« Reply #14 on: March 10, 2006, 08:01:50 PM +0000 »

Bump, i've added KeyDelay which is much better than Logitech Profiler. Profiler is a buggy program so I don't use it anymore. Shark, you had sticking shifts right? Perhaps not using Profiler will fix this and then KeyDelay to prevent double shifts.
« Last Edit: March 10, 2006, 11:05:17 PM +0000 by Rich_A » Logged

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