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  • S24Pro Mont-Tremblant: April 30, 2013
April 30, 2013, 10:36:15 PM +0100 - Mont-Tremblant - UKGPL Season 24 (2013) Professionals Trophy (65)
Driver
 Team
Nat. Make Model Class Qualifying Race
Tyres Pos Time/Gap Pos Time/Gap Laps Stops Best Retirement
reason
Ballast
Hristo Itchov
 
Lotus 33 (Climax 1965) F1 1965 1 1:40.980
94.458mph
1 51:20.221
92.900mph
30 1:41.006
94.434mph
Dunlop  
EvilClive
 Blue Moose Racing
Lotus 33 (Climax 1965) F1 1965 2 +0.447
94.042mph
2 +21.248
92.264mph
30 1:41.860
93.642mph
Dunlop  
Ronniepeterson
 Clark-Hill Racing
Brabham BT11 (Climax) F1 1965 4 +0.900
93.624mph
3 +24.307
92.173mph
30 1:42.357
93.188mph
Goodyear  
DLogan
 
Lotus 33 (Climax 1965) F1 1965 3 +0.894
93.630mph
4 +38.916
91.741mph
30 1:41.859
93.643mph
Dunlop  
kinghiro
 Clark-Hill Racing
BRM P261 (1965) F1 1965 5 +1.176
93.371mph
5 +54.994
91.270mph
30 1:43.120
92.498mph
Dunlop  
Rainier
 Black Night Racing
Brabham BT11 (Climax) F1 1965 9 +2.852
91.864mph
6 +1:04.903
90.983mph
30 1:43.422
92.228mph
Goodyear  
Clutch4
 Mountside Racing
Brabham BT11 (Climax) F1 1965 11 7 +22L
87.787mph
8 1:45.418
90.482mph
Disco
Goodyear  
natan5
 NVRacing
BRM P261 (1965) F1 1965 7 +2.383
92.281mph
8 +27L
88.315mph
3 1:44.925
90.907mph
Disco
Dunlop  
Cookie
 Antipasti Racing
Brabham BT11 (Climax) F1 1965 6 +2.179
92.463mph
9 (+2) +1.134
88.007mph
3 1:44.750
91.059mph
accident
Goodyear  
AnGex
 Black Night Racing
Lotus 33 (Climax 1965) F1 1965 8 +2.404
92.262mph
10 (+3) +30L
---
0 ---
---
Disco
Dunlop  
MagicArsouille
 
Brabham BT11 (Climax) F1 1965 11 DNS ---
---
Goodyear  
UKGPL 8
 
Brabham BT7 (Climax) F1 1965 10 12 ---
---
Dunlop  

Moderator's Report

There was one incident in the red zone that could have caused a big carnage...
But it didn't!
No other incidents reported.


Server replay time: 0h00m57s

Andreas follows Cookie over the hill in T2 and has a better acceleration after the jump.
Andreas seems to underestimate the speed difference and rearends Cookie.


Server replay time: 0h06m58s

Cookie follows Natan too close into T8 and is surprised by an earlier braking. No excuse!

SimRacing.org.uk Lap Records
Grand Prix Legends
F1 1965
1:40.980
94.458mph
Hristo Itchov
Qualifying
Lotus 33 (Climax 1965)April 30, 2013, 10:36:15 PM +0100
S24Pro
Grand Prix Legends
F1 1965
1:41.006
94.434mph
Hristo Itchov
Race
Lotus 33 (Climax 1965)April 30, 2013, 10:36:15 PM +0100
S24Pro
Pages: [1] 2
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Author Topic: UKGPL Season 24 (2013) Professionals Trophy (65) - Mont-Tremblant - Apr 30  (Read 4376 times)
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Cookie
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« on: April 28, 2013, 08:23:08 PM +0100 »

UKGPL Season 24 - Pro Trophy - Race 7 St.Jovite  

We will be at Mont-Tremblant in Quebec. The track was built in 1964 and hosted the first ever CanAm race (in 1966, winner John Surtees on a Lola)  and two Formula 1 GP (in 1968, winner Denny Hulme and in 1970, winner Jacky Ickx, in 1970 it was also the first ever  F1 GP for a Tyrell).  

The Pro Drivers will have a free car choice. Drivers will have to remain in that chassis for the rest of the season, they will only be allowed to swap chassis in exceptional circumstances and only with the approval of the moderator.

There will be full moderation of lap one Red Zone and reported incidents for the rest of the race.
Please submit incident reports within a week after the race so that the moderators report may be out before the next race.
Full time drivers have priority access to the server until 21.00 UK time.
Please restrict your chat to a minimum!

The specific division rules for the Pro Trophy have changed as the INT division has been suspended.
Handicapping will be introduced from race three onwards and will only affect the top three drivers in the championship. The top three drivers may, at the moderator's discretion, be limited to a slower car. If handicapping is in action then handicapped drivers will be notified in the race post.

Tristan is allowed to take a BT11 for the next races.


Race List =   IGOR
Server = UKGPL_8
IP Address = tba
Race date = 30-04-2013
Qualification Time   = ~20:45  UK time -> 30-45 min
Race Time = race starts at 21:30 UK time
Track = StJovite
Variant = 65F1 the 2.02 Release of the 65mod should be used
Damage Model = PRO
Race length = ~50 min -> 30 laps
RED ZONE = from race start to the exit of T8
Password = see above
Replay = you will get here


GLA
« Last Edit: May 03, 2013, 10:30:37 PM +0100 by Cookie » Logged

Axel "Cookie"

Poor man, not seeing the stars without being hit in the face.
My translation of an aphorism of  Stanislaus Jercy Lec
Ronniepeterson
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« Reply #1 on: April 29, 2013, 09:00:14 PM +0100 »

First up let me say I'm all for this series to be run in future with its usual no handicap rules. But this season for reasons which have already been explained we are using handicapping, or are we?Huh?

Handicapping will be introduced from race three onwards and will only affect the top three drivers in the championship. The top three drivers may, at the moderator's discretion, be limited to a slower car. If handicapping is in action then handicapped drivers will be notified in the race post.

Current standings:-
Florian Gebhardt (R1)203.0

Cookie (FT)196.0

Hristo Itchov (FT)193.0

DLogan (FT)160

Top three have a 30 plus point lead over Dean let alone a much bigger lead over everyone else.
 
Florian was handicapped last time, but did not race and but has no handicap this time so gets to keep his Lotus?

Meanwhile Tristan gets a BT11, good for Tristan?

Has handicapping been scrapped?
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Hristo Itchov
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« Reply #2 on: April 29, 2013, 09:10:59 PM +0100 »

The way I see it, handicap in this division is meant to keep the championship battle alive, not to give a chance for people who are not on par with the top drivers to mix in with them. In other words, it's to prevent one of the top 4-5 in the division to get a big lead in the standings over the other 3-4.
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« Reply #3 on: April 29, 2013, 09:36:29 PM +0100 »

The way I see it, handicap in this division is meant to keep the championship battle alive, not to give a chance for people who are not on par with the top drivers to mix in with them. In other words, it's to prevent one of the top 4-5 in the division to get a big lead in the standings over the other 3-4.

I do believe you are right Hristo. Its the dead opposite of what I thought the handicapping was meant to achieve for EVERYBODY, but you are so so right in your summary.

The most telling and dare I say chilling observation you make is "not to give a chance for people who are not on par with the top drivers to mix in with them".

I appreciate your honesty and candour but I cannot promise not to attempt to "mix in with them" tomorrow night.
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« Reply #4 on: April 30, 2013, 01:03:35 AM +0100 »

I don't see why someone not deserving to win the title should win it, please explain so I can get your point of view. Handicap is not meant to rob from victory those who deserve to win, it is to keep things closer but maintain the perspective. A 60 points difference is just a single victory, it's nothing by our points system. You must be forgetting this division is called Professionals and I honestly don't care about the demands of Inters who got mixed in it, it's like asking for a total revamp of the division balance for the sake of slower drivers mid-way (and past it really) through the season. Isn't it a bit late for your remarks? Where's your post in the mid-season review? Oh wait, you didn't post there at all.

If it was a championship-based consistent systematic handicap from the start, then by all means, I'm up for it. It's working fine in the Historics and F2 divisions. For some reason 65s are stubbornly keeping to the same old flawed system of one-chassis for the whole season, with the addition of subjectively decided handicaps (or suddenly an undercap as seen with Tristan here). Demanding suddenly more severe handicaps when the championship is at the final stage of being decided between a couple of us (who are very close pace-wise) is ridiculous though.
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« Reply #5 on: April 30, 2013, 10:17:45 AM +0100 »

It depends how much you want to handicap.
...
For 65s I would suggest something like this:

Top driver leading by 50 or more - BT7 and Cooper only.
Top driver leading by less than 50 - Honda or BT11 (depending on track), plus BT7 and Cooper (not that anyone sane would bother).
2nd placed driver - Honda, BT11, BT7 and Cooper, regardless of track.
3rd placed driver - all cars except Lotus and maybe BRM (though it's mostly competitive at tracks with long straights).
4th placed driver - same as 3rd, or no handicap.
All other drivers - free choice in EVERY race. In other words, no mandatory use of single chassis for the whole season. I simply don't see the point in it if we have handicap.

We were just following your logics, when asked by Tristan.
Honda or BT11 seem to be equal, regarding the handicap level...
« Last Edit: April 30, 2013, 10:20:14 AM +0100 by Cookie » Logged

Axel "Cookie"

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« Reply #6 on: April 30, 2013, 12:38:01 PM +0100 »

Yes, I know, I'm just saying it's an undercap to give someone the choice of another car in addition to his normal one, instead of limiting them to 1 different car as is normal handicap. I don't really mind in this case though, it's fine by me, in fact I would prefer if Tristan was racing a top car as well so we can really fight on par. I was just mentioning it to point out to Ronnie how things are being done this particular season.
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« Reply #7 on: April 30, 2013, 05:26:40 PM +0100 »

I don't see why someone not deserving to win the title should win it, please explain so I can get your point of view. Handicap is not meant to rob from victory those who deserve to win, it is to keep things closer but maintain the perspective. A 60 points difference is just a single victory, it's nothing by our points system. You must be forgetting this division is called Professionals and I honestly don't care about the demands of Inters who got mixed in it, it's like asking for a total revamp of the division balance for the sake of slower drivers mid-way (and past it really) through the season. Isn't it a bit late for your remarks? Where's your post in the mid-season review? Oh wait, you didn't post there at all.

If it was a championship-based consistent systematic handicap from the start, then by all means, I'm up for it. It's working fine in the Historics and F2 divisions. For some reason 65s are stubbornly keeping to the same old flawed system of one-chassis for the whole season, with the addition of subjectively decided handicaps (or suddenly an undercap as seen with Tristan here). Demanding suddenly more severe handicaps when the championship is at the final stage of being decided between a couple of us (who are very close pace-wise) is ridiculous though.

Am I missing something? Anyone who races has a chance to win. Its not for anyone to pre-ordain who can and cannot win.

As I said I am all for the Pro series to be run with no handicapping. This sentiment had already been made in the mid season review by others and so I don't see the need to add anything at this stage. But for this season it was agreed before the first race that we would be operating a handicap on the leading three drivers. I don't see why rules agreed and now being ignored.

Its just getting extremely stupid. First we had people requested not to take the Lotus turning up in the Lotus. Next we had people using more than one chassis in a single chassis series. This was followed by the series leader being handicapped and refusing to use thew handicap car. In addition they received no penalty for this infringement of the rules. The leading three drivers have built up a sufficient lead to warrant handicapping (for comparison see the much harsher point differential that was used so successfully in the inters last season) but they have not been.

I merely ask the question are or are we not operating a handicap system this season. If we are, can the moderator confirm if it is the one agreed at the start of the season or the one insisted upon by disgruntled drivers during the season. In short have the lunatics taken over the running of the asylum!
« Last Edit: April 30, 2013, 07:01:31 PM +0100 by Ronniepeterson » Logged
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« Reply #8 on: April 30, 2013, 05:41:42 PM +0100 »

hi

i don't know what's append, but my 65 mod don't work any more  Sad    ...igot an error message of GPL.!..... i'll try to fix it but i don't know how....so maybe I'm not racing whith you this evening........ Undecided
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« Reply #9 on: April 30, 2013, 06:45:28 PM +0100 »

hi

i don't know what's append, but my 65 mod don't work any more  Sad    ...igot an error message of GPL.!..... i'll try to fix it but i don't know how....so maybe I'm not racing whith you this evening........ Undecided

what was the error message ?
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« Reply #10 on: April 30, 2013, 07:33:07 PM +0100 »

Am I missing something? Anyone who races has a chance to win. Its not for anyone to pre-ordain who can and cannot win.

As I said I am all for the Pro series to be run with no handicapping. This sentiment had already been made in the mid season review by others and so I don't see the need to add anything at this stage. But for this season it was agreed before the first race that we would be operating a handicap on the leading three drivers. I don't see why rules agreed and now being ignored.

Its just getting extremely stupid. First we had people requested not to take the Lotus turning up in the Lotus. Next we had people using more than one chassis in a single chassis series. This was followed by the series leader being handicapped and refusing to use thew handicap car. In addition they received no penalty for this infringement of the rules. The leading three drivers have built up a sufficient lead to warrant handicapping (for comparison see the much harsher point differential that was used so successfully in the inters last season) but they have not been.

I merely ask the question are or are we not operating a handicap system this season. If we are, can the moderator confirm if it is the one agreed at the start of the season or the one insisted upon by disgruntled drivers during the season. In short have the lunatics taken over the running of the asylum!

Yes, you're missing something. It's one thing to say anyone has a chance to win races, but who is more likely to win it's what it's about. Otherwise you may as well say Caterham have a chance to win a race in F1. Currently we have a couple of top drivers who deserve to win based on their ability, and they've been winning races this season to prove that. How is it justified to handicap one or two of them so late in the season and rob them of their chance to fight for the title with the rest who are on similar pace? We're not using the same system as in Historic and F2, so it makes no sense to suddenly do that.

The handicap for the 3 leading drivers would have worked if it was done systematically, every race, but that's not been the case, so who is to decide when and why someone is handicapped, and when not? It's like you want an interference for the championship for the last races, even though it didn't happen consistently so far. I'd rather see a fair fight without such interference.
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« Reply #11 on: April 30, 2013, 07:35:59 PM +0100 »

      " GPL HAVE ENCOUNTER A PROBLEM AND HAVE TO CLOSE ....SORRY ABOUT....."
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« Reply #12 on: April 30, 2013, 07:59:32 PM +0100 »

      " GPL HAVE ENCOUNTER A PROBLEM AND HAVE TO CLOSE ....SORRY ABOUT....."

Maybe try reinstall gpl and gem+ with 65 mod? Or try rebuild the exe files with GEM+? You have 1 hour to fix it, so there's time.
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« Reply #13 on: April 30, 2013, 09:41:47 PM +0100 »

SORRY Natan! oops
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Axel "Cookie"

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« Reply #14 on: April 30, 2013, 10:27:44 PM +0100 »

np Axel !
Can you find some other drivers to ruin they are race and season please ?It doesnt has to be me all the time !!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Huh
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