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  • P8GT Valencia: October 31, 2013
October 31, 2013, 08:44:42 PM +0000 - Valencia (GP) - UKPnG Season 8 Grand Touring Championship
Driver
 Team
Nat. Make Model Class Qualifying Race
Tyres Pos Time/Gap Pos Time/Gap Laps Stops Best Retirement
reason
Ballast
Rombo27
 Team7
BMW CSL Alpina (#75093) P&G 70s Gr2 O2L 1 1:41.737
87.330mph
1 40:06.301
84.922mph
23 1:43.546
85.805mph
Dunlop  
johnw
 Soggy Bottom Racers Club
Porsche 911 RSR 3.0 (#76074) P&G 70s Gr4 O2L 6 +1.568
86.005mph
2 +27.732
83.955mph
23 1:44.620
84.924mph
Goodyear  
Clive Loynes
 Soggy Bottom Racers Club
Ford Capri 3100 RS (#7503) P&G 70s Gr2 O2L 5 +1.486
86.073mph
3 +35.384
83.692mph
23 1:44.334
85.156mph
Dunlop  
IvanStanchev
 Soggy Bottom Racers Club
BMW CSL Alpina (#75093) P&G 70s Gr2 O2L 4 +1.397
86.147mph
4 +42.144
83.461mph
23 1:44.277
85.203mph
Dunlop  
fzcfede
 Team7
BMW CSL Alpina (#75093) P&G 70s Gr2 O2L 3 +1.255
86.266mph
5 +43.212
83.424mph
23 1:44.457
85.056mph
Dunlop  
Giuseppe Reali
 Team7
BMW CSL Alpina (#75093) P&G 70s Gr2 O2L 7 +1.834
85.784mph
6 +50.198
83.187mph
23 1:45.162
84.486mph
Dunlop  
frex
 Kerb Crawlers
BMW CSL Alpina (#75093) P&G 70s Gr2 O2L 11 +3.464
84.455mph
7 +53.789
83.065mph
23 1:45.048
84.578mph
Dunlop  
Stefan aka Postal
 
BMW 3.0 CSL Gr2 (#7401) P&G 70s Gr2 O2L 12 +3.599
84.346mph
8 +1:26.255
81.984mph
23 1:46.213
83.650mph
Dunlop  
goldtop
 Kerb Crawlers
Porsche 911 RSR 3.0 (#76049) P&G 70s Gr4 O2L 10 +3.245
84.631mph
9 +1:31.271
81.819mph
23 1:47.015
83.023mph
Goodyear  
Mark J
 Legends Racing
Porsche 911 RSR 3.0 (#76049) P&G 70s Gr4 O2L 13 +3.693
84.271mph
10 +1:39.762
81.542mph
23 1:46.176
83.679mph
Goodyear  
Johnny X
 WSL Racing Team
BMW 3.0 CSL Gr2 (#7401) P&G 70s Gr2 O2L 14 +3.726
84.245mph
11 +1L
80.706mph
22 1:46.737
83.239mph
Dunlop  
phspok
 Team Pseudo Racing
Ford Capri 3100 RS (#75031) P&G 70s Gr2 O2L 16 +5.113
83.151mph
12 +2.501
80.623mph
22 1:46.508
83.418mph
Dunlop  
seniordan
 Soggy Bottom Racers Club
Porsche 911 RSR 3.0 (#76049) P&G 70s Gr4 O2L 15 +4.823
83.378mph
13 +1:16.328
78.240mph
22 1:47.324
82.784mph
Goodyear  
Bob
 WSL Racing Team
Porsche 911 RSR 3.0 (#76074) P&G 70s Gr4 O2L 17 +8.558
80.554mph
14 +1:16.517
78.234mph
22 1:49.036
81.484mph
Goodyear  
Animal Ed
 Team Oldie Racing
BMW 3.0 CSL Gr2 (#74002) P&G 70s Gr2 O2L 8 +2.200
85.482mph
15 +2L 21 1:44.682
84.873mph
unknown
Dunlop  
Geoffers
 Kerb Crawlers
Ford Capri 3100 RS (#74005) P&G 70s Gr2 O2L 2 +0.688
86.744mph
16 +10L 13 1:43.989
85.439mph
unknown
Dunlop  
Jarda Zacek
 
BMW CSL Alpina (#75093) P&G 70s Gr2 O2L 9 +2.829
84.968mph
17 +16L 7 1:45.407
84.290mph
engine
Dunlop  

Moderator's Report

Complaint raised for consistently driving beyond the track limits. Having watched several drivers I cannot single out Postal as being worse than others and therefore I will not be awarding a penalty. I realise that the race thread contained graphic examples of what was expected during the race but this seems to have been largely ignored. In future perhaps a more definitive instruction could be posted regarding which off-track concrete areas are on/off limits.
Therefore I advise all drivers to heed any track limit instructions offered by the race administrator.

SimRacing.org.uk Lap Records
GTR2
P&G 70s Gr2 O2L
1:41.737
87.330mph
Rombo27
Qualifying
BMW CSL AlpinaOctober 31, 2013, 08:44:42 PM +0000
P8GT
GTR2
P&G 70s Gr2 O2L
1:43.546
85.805mph
Rombo27
Race
BMW CSL AlpinaOctober 31, 2013, 08:44:42 PM +0000
P8GT
GTR2
P&G 70s Gr4 O2L
1:43.305
86.005mph
johnw
Qualifying
Porsche 911 RSR 3.0October 31, 2013, 08:44:42 PM +0000
P8GT
GTR2
P&G 70s Gr4 O2L
1:44.620
84.924mph
johnw
Race
Porsche 911 RSR 3.0October 31, 2013, 08:44:42 PM +0000
P8GT
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Author Topic: UKPnG Season 8 Grand Touring Championship - Valencia - Oct 31  (Read 9098 times)
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Bob
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« Reply #30 on: October 31, 2013, 09:35:10 PM +0000 »

 laugh laugh laugh   Came in last but had most of the laps racing with Seniordan, great racing Dan it was made even more difficult being lapped but added to the fun. Well done. Bob.
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Geoffers
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« Reply #31 on: October 31, 2013, 09:41:08 PM +0000 »

Running comfortably in 2nd place when everyone disappeared!!!!!!!  Angry
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phspok
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« Reply #32 on: October 31, 2013, 09:51:36 PM +0000 »

Results and Replay Posted

That was hard work, had a great time battling with MJ until I kept understeering off when the tyres wore.
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goldtop
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« Reply #33 on: October 31, 2013, 10:01:14 PM +0000 »

Not a good night for me. Car felt awful for the opening laps, so much so that it led me to check my tyres in xd. Sure enough I was on hards  Roll Eyes Not sure how that happened, but I couldn't get any heat in the front leading to understeer that just got worse as the race progressed  Angry

It didn't help things seeing track limits being blatantly ignored by some even after this was highlighted in this thread  Roll Eyes

Rant over!
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Clive Loynes
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« Reply #34 on: October 31, 2013, 10:11:04 PM +0000 »



It didn't help things seeing track limits being blatantly ignored by some even after this was highlighted in this thread  Roll Eyes

Rant over!

Ranting does no good Tudor, the suspect may not even know that it is him!  If people are using off track areas as part of their "normal" line, you just have to send an incident report and have done with it. 

BTW:  You may imagine that I am devastated to hear of so much ill-fortune befalling your team.   Roll Eyes

I had a great race and a fantastic lights-to-flag battle with Frederico.   Grin
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Mark J
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« Reply #35 on: October 31, 2013, 11:06:45 PM +0000 »

Had a great race I suppose but it was equally as frustrating as I felt like I was driving the wheels off the car just to finish in 10th, and even then only due to the mis-fortunes of others. The RSR was sadly outclassed in anyone but Johns alien hands.
Had a cracking first half race in a gaggle of cars with postal, GT, Matt, JX etc all swapping places or chasing hard.  Cool but It was soul destroying to be left for dead on the sf straight every lap  Roll Eyes

Then postal, GT and me got a gap at about mid point and I was looking forward to a good battle with them to the end but I got an oversteer moment and dropped about 8 secs behind  :'( closed it back to 6 until my tyres went off in last 3 laps and brought it home 10th, soaked in sweat!  Smiley

Cars looked superb on this track and it's a good technical circuit  Cool. Well done Otto, John and Clive on the podium  Smiley
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phspok
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« Reply #36 on: October 31, 2013, 11:12:05 PM +0000 »

This track with it's green concrete outside the flat kerbs just invites people to wander over them/ I was doing it at times though trying not to
as were the people in front and behind.
I think that too much worrying about kerb policing detracts from the fun. I believe that tracks should be driven the way they are designed to be
I am opposed to people driving across grass and through chicanes as if they were hardly there. Here I am personally not too bothered.
If there is hard surface I tend to be lenient about using it.

Just my opinion. "If" I was moderating this series (and I am not) someone would have to go completely off the hard surface to warrant penalties.
Any flames will be doused. Mostly I strongly support my pictures of what is good and bad, here it's less obvious.
I prefer to get on with the racing than complain.

I think the Porks were closer here, but were underpowered. Some upcoming events should favour them more.
« Last Edit: October 31, 2013, 11:16:39 PM +0000 by phspok » Logged

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johnw
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« Reply #37 on: October 31, 2013, 11:24:18 PM +0000 »

It was soul destroying to be left for dead on the sf straight every lap  Roll Eyes

Yep, the words "duck" and "sitting" came to mind Cheesy
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Johnny X
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« Reply #38 on: November 01, 2013, 05:20:40 AM +0000 »

Now then... My first outing with SROUK and what a blast that turned out to be  Cool

Filled with trepidation I ventured onto the track with guys that I know and quite a few guys with the sort of speed I can only dream about. I think it all went fairly well for the noob though, don't think I got in anybody's way and the first half of the race was huge fun dicing in the aforementioned battle with MJ. I was driving the car pretty hard (in JX terms) and the front right started to suffer which forced me to lose ground for a while with a couple of minor off road explorations but the race finished nicely for me as I slowly caught up the ailing Capri of phspok, got past whilst he understeered off and maintained that position to the end with the timely intervention of being lapped. Another lap and phspok might have caught and passed me again.

45 mins is longer than I normally race so I need to get a handle on tyre preservation and also how to make the car go significantly quicker.

Thoroughly enjoyed the evening, top placer for Team WSL and looking forward to the next event.
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« Reply #39 on: November 01, 2013, 08:37:03 AM +0000 »

I didn't have time to practice at all for this and found during practice that I was too far off the pace to make it worth while. Also, this is right up there with Oschersleben among my most hated tracks! So I left.

Congrats to the podium!
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Clive Loynes
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« Reply #40 on: November 01, 2013, 08:48:26 AM +0000 »

This track with it's green concrete outside the flat kerbs just invites people to wander over them/ I was doing it at times though trying not to
as were the people in front and behind.
I think that too much worrying about kerb policing detracts from the fun. I believe that tracks should be driven the way they are designed to be
I am opposed to people driving across grass and through chicanes as if they were hardly there. Here I am personally not too bothered.
If there is hard surface I tend to be lenient about using it.

Just my opinion. "If" I was moderating this series (and I am not) someone would have to go completely off the hard surface to warrant penalties.
Any flames will be doused. Mostly I strongly support my pictures of what is good and bad, here it's less obvious.
I prefer to get on with the racing than complain.


The thing is Matt, that no special announcement was forthcoming ahead of the race; in fact you endorsed my highlighting of the usual rules.

I agree with "lets get on and enjoy the racing" but it isn't a race if some people are using a more lenient track configuration!

For my part, I was resigned to having to take a look at some of Geoffers' lines after the race because it appeared to me that he was regularly using the curb and green concrete rather than the tarmac.  When it's the guy just in front and he is inching away from you then it is a little frustrating.  Anyway, Geoffers resolved matters by disconnecting, so saving me the bother.  Sorry about the disconnection  Geoffers but as for track limits, in my book rules are rules.

I made the odd mistake and ran wide a couple of times and I was also presented with more turn-in than expected on at least one occasion, which resulted in my clipping the apex.  I may also have committed that sin whilst following Frederico on lap one, as I couldn't see where the edge of the track was.  But it is not the occasional transgression that is the problem, it is the people who lap after lap use off track areas as part of their normal line.

I was having a great battle with Frederico for most of the race and would say that, in addition to his being most courteous, he was also making every effort to race within our definition of track limits.

@ John:  I had a real job trying not to pass you when you were parked on the straight!

Great Soggy result of 2nd and 3rd with Ivan there as backup too!  And this time we all reached the finish line!  Grin
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phspok
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« Reply #41 on: November 01, 2013, 09:27:36 AM +0000 »

IF I had remembered how the track was I would have made a pre race announcement, and you are right I should have
I watched a lot of the replay and you were being very good with the kerb limits. Some others were not, me included.

I was understeering off onto the green stuff more than I would have liked, IMHO those green concrete sections were
valid track at this place, a good many were using them as such so It hardly seems worth quoting regs for something like that.

I watched GT and Postal, and both were mostly keeping it legal, with a few exceptions, MJ and I were all over the concrete
some of the time, as was JohnW and some others.

Seems more unsporting to put in incident reports for everyone, rather than go with the flow.

I will try to think of the track rules and post appropriately, but I haven't had time to get on the tracks other than
initial testing recently.
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johnw
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« Reply #42 on: November 01, 2013, 09:37:53 AM +0000 »

I watched GT and Postal, and both were mostly keeping it legal, with a few exceptions, MJ and I were all over the concrete
some of the time, as was JohnW and some others.

Guilty as charged whistling As you say though, more as a result of making mistakes and pushing too hard rather than deliberately trying to take advantage of the track limits.
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goldtop
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« Reply #43 on: November 01, 2013, 09:41:37 AM +0000 »

Gotta say I totally agree with Clive on this one. We have rules in every announcement which are clear for everyone to see and any relaxation of those should be made clear before the race so that everyone can have fun within those restrictions.

I disagreed with the way MARA chose to police similar rules which penalised mistakes and chose not to race there because in my view it took the fun out of it. But as Clive says we are not talking about mistakes here but a choice of line driven consistently through corners which broke the rules and in doing so gained time. That's a very different thing. Report has gone in.
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Clive Loynes
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« Reply #44 on: November 01, 2013, 09:59:52 AM +0000 »



I will try to think of the track rules and post appropriately, but I haven't had time to get on the tracks other than
initial testing recently.

The limits on your time are well understood Matt and we greatly appreciate your efforts.  The thing is that having a universal set of rules, irrespective of the track, cuts down on your workload.  I particularly stressed the rules ahead of the race because I had experienced just how hard it was to stay on the black stuff!
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