UKGPL Season 26 (2014) Historic Trophy (66) - Le Mans - Jan 28

[Cookie]

So, the discussion has already happened. And, I would add, many, many times...Now the question is, where are those 'in series' penalties gone? Has anyone ever actually served any of them? I am pretty sure this is not the first time I ask this question, and somehow I just cant recall the answer.

Yes, it has been served by me in the pro division when I was mod there! A s+g penalty was given for the following race.

[Ronniepeterson]

...Looking at the replay in my opinion the fun and games start when two Fezza's simply don't give each other enough room or more precisely one Fezza does not see/drifts into the other one...

And then someone else does not see/drifts into another Fezza who had seen the incident and was trying to avoid it, knocking them sideways to join in the fun (and the very early find-something-else-to-do).  

Not sure who you are blaming there Dean? Saw it, slowed , several cars go past/are ahead of me, nowhere to go, bystander in someone elses accident. Anyone seeing it differently needs their eyes testing. End of story.

[Flow]

What happened from my PoV. Started good, made 3th place, then had to slow down a bit in T1 because Tristan was sliding a bit. Took a quick look on pribluda where the others were, only saw someone with -20m behind, didnt see the one digit number that must have been there and didnt see someone in my mirror, cause I had to concentrate not to touch Tristan. So I just went to the right side for the next corner, then touched with Dean, who was there, which I didnt knew. End of my race. If you think that a harder punishment would have avoided this accident, then you are wrong. Just didnt see him, thats all. Actually I wonder why you discuss harder punishments now? It´s not like every race starts with a carnage.

[maddog]

Thank you for your description Florian, as it is helpful in sorting what went wrong.  Sounds like a misreading of a digital enhancement, started the trouble.

I'm going to make myself unpopular, but believe this Pribluda addiction is not entirely helpful to races.  Using it to orientate during the 1st couple of corners, seems crazy to me.  We have eyes and ears, and beyond that, caution is preferable to distraction.  No, I havn't tried using it,  during a race start, so it's only common sense I'm using for judgement. 

[AnGex]

...
My start yesterday was very careful in anticipation and also to avoid incident(Alexander  G. Know what i mean),...

Who is this Alexander G. that you are palare about?

[Tom van Ostade]

What happened from my PoV. Started good, made 3th place, then had to slow down a bit in T1 because Tristan was sliding a bit. Took a quick look on pribluda where the others were, only saw someone with -20m behind, didnt see the one digit number that must have been there and didnt see someone in my mirror, cause I had to concentrate not to touch Tristan. So I just went to the right side for the next corner, then touched with Dean, who was there, which I didnt knew. End of my race. If you think that a harder punishment would have avoided this accident, then you are wrong. Just didnt see him, thats all. Actually I wonder why you discuss harder punishments now? It´s not like every race starts with a carnage.

Florian, at the start, ALWAYS stay to your side of the track. ALWAYS. Especially when someone askes in chat to be carefull at the start of the race. I see you didn't do it on purpose (obviously) but please remember to ALWAYS stay on your side of the track, at least untill after the first corner. In this case, Dunlop isn't really a corner because there is no braking involved in lap 1. I'm not actually sure if it's in the Recommended Driver Behaviour, but I've always stuck to my side of the track at starts and rarely get taken out. Look at what I did at Borovaya during the test race. I started dead last on the right side of the track, stayed right all the way down the straight, braked carefully, avoided the carnage and won the race.

...
My start yesterday was very careful in anticipation and also to avoid incident(Alexander  G. Know what i mean),...

Who is this Alexander G. that you are palare about?

It must be you 

[DLogan]

...Saw it, slowed , several cars go past/are ahead of me, nowhere to go...

So you go left into the space where I am. 

...bystander in someone elses accident...

Didn't say or imply it would have made a difference, but I went from having a tiny chance of getting through to having none at all thanks to your involvement.

...Anyone seeing it differently needs their eyes testing. End of story.

Hey, thanks for being allowed to have my own opinion about some things, even if it differs from yours. 

[Ronniepeterson]

...Saw it, slowed , several cars go past/are ahead of me, nowhere to go...

So you go left into the space where I am.  

...bystander in someone elses accident...

Didn't say or imply it would have made a difference, but I went from having a tiny chance of getting through to having none at all thanks to your involvement.

...Anyone seeing it differently needs their eyes testing. End of story.

Hey, thanks for being allowed to have my own opinion about some things, even if it differs from yours.  

Have you looked at the replay Dean? We were not the only cars slowing to avoid Axel and Flo. The car on my right moved over to the left to avoid them and so I naturally moved left to avoid him and them. Since you were already on my left I appreciate you had nowhere to go with the wall on this section of track and so contact was almost inevitable unless you had been able to slow more than us. But please don't apportion any blame to me because none is due in my opinion. Like I said the problem started ahead and we were innocent bystanders. Obviously I am not stopping you from expressing your opinion but the fact on this occasion I made contact with you does not make it automatically my fault. I don't do incident reports Dean but please please if you do feel I was to blame in any way whatsoever I urge you to submit a report. I would not like to get away with anything if another driver feels I ruined their race.

[DLogan]

... the fact on this occasion I made contact with you does not make it automatically my fault...

The fact that you (not Flo, not Cookie) went into space that you should have known was occupied and were the first one to involve the car that was there in the accident kind of does.

The fact that you are not the one at fault for the initial incident does not absolve you of ALL responsibility, is all I said.

Red zone, so report will be filed (I didn't initiate, they've asked for my opinion) about the whole thing.

[BadBlood]

@Fran. You were up against the wall and spun your wheel to get yourself pointing the right way.

On this interpretation we can start a discussion.Look season 25 at Monaco.Could not be the same consideration?

Not sure what you mean - I didn't race you at Monaco in Season 25.

I simply said you chose to spin across the track in front of me. It was avoidable and put me out without any mistake on my part.

[BadBlood]

Red zone, so report will be filed (I didn't initiate, they've asked for my opinion) about the whole thing.

I think you will find that the request for info refers to the Pros at Zolder, not Historics.

[francesco]

Who is this Alexander G. that you are palare about?

Sorry for the mistake,was Andreas Gebhart.At the moment i don't know i thought Alexander.Anyway this track had not the characteristics for one of my classic start and crash.

[francesco]

I simply said you chose to spin across the track in front of me. It was avoidable and put me out without any mistake on my part.

Sorry initially i have not understood what you meant.The spin over the track that i remember was only during the
qualifications.At the start of the race i was second last and after the touch of Elvinclive ,my race was with myself.
I have not seen the replay until now and i not remember,in my only 5 laps,to have seen others cars excluding Gebhart but from far .

[Robert Fleurke]

To add in this discussion: in general I think ppl need to be better aware of other cars, especially at the start, and give (more) room. I have a F10 button programmed on my wheel, and both sideviews ofcourse (ofen take a glance after start). Together with prib you almost can be fully aware when other cars are alongside. Despite the dead angle in GPL.

And always keep your line, only move over when you are 100% sure there's no car alongside. You can still race and pass cars at the start, just rather be safe than sorry.

Surely no one intends to wreck at the start, but again, more awareness and respect to other cars is nescessary to avoid (start) incidents. Don't follow to close and take too much risks, and give the other car enough room. Incidents will always happen, but we need to try as hard as we can to avoid them...this goes also for aggressive rejoining, check prib and your views you have available...

[BadBlood]

Not a problem Fran. More a general observation that drivers need to take a little more care when recovering from incidents. Not just you.