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  • S3255F1 Indianapolis: October 24, 2017
October 24, 2017, 08:36:03 PM +0100 - Indianapolis (Oval) - UKGPL Season 32 (2017-18) 1955 Grand Prix
Driver
 Team
Nat. Make Model Class Qualifying Race
Tyres Pos Time/Gap Pos Time/Gap Laps Stops Best Retirement
reason
Ballast
Samb
 Black Night Racing
Mercedes W196 F1 1955 1 1:03.294
142.217mph
1 48:24.973
139.439mph
45 1:03.558
141.627mph
Continental  
Cookie
 Antipasti Racing
Lancia D50 F1 1955 3 +0.761
140.528mph
2 +30.770
137.978mph
45 1:04.050
140.539mph
Pirelli  
EvilClive
 Blue Moose Racing
Maserati 250F F1 1955 2 +0.588
140.908mph
3 +39.598
137.564mph
45 1:04.148
140.324mph
Pirelli  
MagicArsouille
 
Mercedes W196 F1 1955 10 +1.473
138.983mph
4 +50.658
137.049mph
45 1:04.310
139.970mph
Continental  
ReiverEcosse
 
Lancia D50 F1 1955 5 +1.071
139.851mph
5 (+2) +1:03.371
136.462mph
45 1:03.985
140.681mph
Pirelli  
bagrupp
 Team Groundhog
Mercedes W196 SL F1 1955 15 +2.266
137.302mph
6 +1:03.580
136.453mph
45 1:04.408
139.758mph
Continental  
DLogan
 
Lancia D50 F1 1955 6 +1.072
139.849mph
7 +1:03.732
136.446mph
45 1:04.056
140.526mph
Pirelli  
Carlos Cendejas
 
Lancia D50 F1 1955 8 +1.413
139.112mph
8 +1L
135.569mph
44 1:04.842
138.822mph
Pirelli  
Doni Yourth
 Blue Moose Racing
Ferrari 625 F1 1955 11 +1.915
138.041mph
9 +16.069
134.828mph
44 1:04.899
138.700mph
Englebert  
GregT
 Team Baarf
Ferrari 625 F1 1955 12 +1.951
137.965mph
10 +16.315
134.817mph
44 1:05.125
138.219mph
Englebert  
Clive Loynes
 Soggy Bottom Racers Club
Lancia D50 F1 1955 14 +2.082
137.688mph
11 +31.997
134.101mph
44 1:05.315
137.817mph
Pirelli  
Phil Thornton
 Antipasti Racing
Mercedes W196 F1 1955 9 +1.429
139.077mph
12 +2L
133.172mph
43 1:04.756
139.006mph
Continental  
Ronniepeterson
 
Mercedes W196 F1 1955 4 +1.017
139.968mph
13 +12.544
132.600mph
43 1:04.867
138.769mph
Continental  
francesco
 Antipasti Racing
Lancia D50 F1 1955 13 +1.999
137.863mph
14 +14.916
132.492mph
43 1:05.266
137.920mph
Pirelli  
dave curtis
 Black Night Racing
Maserati 250F F1 1955 16 +3.701
134.361mph
15 +19.871
132.268mph
43 1:06.021
136.343mph
Pirelli  
Rainier
 Black Night Racing
Ferrari 625 F1 1955 17 +4.612
132.558mph
16 +47.594
131.027mph
43 1:07.378
133.597mph
Englebert  
Gareth
 
Lancia D50 F1 1955 18 +15.753
113.875mph
17 +21L
135.594mph
24 1:04.479
139.604mph
Disco
Pirelli  
Will Tway
 Antipasti Racing
Ferrari 555 SS F1 1955 7 +1.197
139.578mph
18 +28L
129.372mph
17 1:05.782
136.838mph
Disco
Englebert  
60fps UKGPL8
 
Gordini T16 F1 1955 19 19 DNS ---
---
Englebert  

Moderator's Report

Server replay time: 0

Ronnie and Dave both reported this as Lap 19, but nothing happened on Lap 19, so I spent several long minutes going forward for 5 laps and then back, until I found Lap 17!! At which point my replay shows Reiver and Ronnie exchanging paint samples??
Reiver is faster into T3 and holds a tighter line, it looks like he thought he had completed the pass and allows his car to drift out towards the wall. Unfortunately Ronnie is still alongside and they tangle.
Ronnie was in Reiver's blind spot but Reiver should have been more careful until he could actually see Ronnie in his mirror before moving across.
Penalty for Reiver moving across the track


Server replay time: 0

Lap 36 Reiver is closing fast on Doni and has the advantage of the tow plus a faster car.
He has admitted his fault and recognised that he was attempting a pass that was just not possible at that point. However Doni did suffer and I feel that a penalty is in order.
Penalty avoidable rear end collision 1 place


Server replay time: 0

Lap 13 Ronnie is running the low line in his Merc through T1/T2 and is closing on Fran who is running a wider line. The speed of the Merc gains more ground approaching T3 but does not get an overlap. Ronnie has been just about invisible to Fran for 3 corners and he turns in for T3 unaware that Ronnie is poking his car into a vanishing gap. There is contact and Fran suffers because he is on the outside. The accident is made worse because C.Cendejas is shadowing Ronnie and gives him an extra punt.
I am calling this a Racing Incident, but with an advisory to all 3 drivers. Indianapolis is a special case and racing on ovals often involves cars in very close proximity for extended periods.
Fran might have been aware that a car was gaining on him and had moved into his blind spot. Maybe he could have played safe and taken a wider line?
Ronnie was aiming for a gap that might well get closed and had not achieved any overlap to claim the inside line.
C.Cendejas could se the action unfolding ahead and could have just lifted slightly to give himself a better chance of avoiding any contact.
Racing Incident.

  • Racing incident

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Author Topic: UKGPL Season 32 (2017-18) 1955 Grand Prix - Indianapolis - Oct 24  (Read 4651 times)
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Clive Loynes
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« Reply #60 on: October 25, 2017, 09:48:53 PM +0100 »

Thanks Sam, evilC and Axel.

@Sam have you looked at Axel's setup? He has the left harder than the right!  Obviously not an exact science.

@EvilC if it's any consolation, me old mate, you didn't have enough fuel in the Lancia either!   Grin  However, your Lancia setup did actually provide me with something that I could chuck into a drift and hold it, sometimes!  That is after I received a petition from those sitting in the front row of the stands, demanding that once I remove the insane 5:1 steering ratio.  They were fed up with being showered with hot Lancia bits.  So long as I kept it in the groove the tyres were fine. 

@Axel Sorry but I couldn't get on with your setup.  My first flying lap was good but I never got close to it again.  Sad


@EvilC again, can you do me a Lancia for Spa now please?   Roll Eyes
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« Reply #61 on: October 25, 2017, 10:14:56 PM +0100 »

You are not the first to be astounded at the 5:1 steering ratio and my hyper quick reflexes.......................a man can dream can't he?  Wink

Seriously though, glad you found the setup controllable and stable, and hopefully quicker than what you had before. It was only because this was an oval race and I had never had any success on ovals before that I spent a little time on this.

If I get time I might try and cobble a setup for Spa and the Lancia, just coz it's you  shifty :shifty:lol. Watch yer emails buddy.

But, these days I tend to arrive on the server, hack a setup about ( or use one that I had from another circuit ) and drive wot I got.  Undecided  More fun that way  Grin




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« Reply #62 on: October 25, 2017, 10:32:56 PM +0100 »

Samb, youre Merc Setup is great. I managed 1.04.05 with 50 liters fuel and no tow. Just a little bit oversteer and tires stay in temperature.

Evil, the lancia is really fast, its understeering not as much as my setup but its really fast.

I stick to my german car. thanks a lot for sharing your experience. it will take time until i can develop such setup.
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« Reply #63 on: October 25, 2017, 11:03:55 PM +0100 »

..have you looked at Axel's setup? He has the left harder than the right!  Obviously not an exact science.

That's what I learned from EOLC oval specialists...

Inside is allways way stiffer!

Look here at TvO's post: http://srmz.net/index.php?showtopic=9600&#entry94871
« Last Edit: October 25, 2017, 11:14:24 PM +0100 by Cookie » Logged

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« Reply #64 on: October 26, 2017, 09:33:17 AM +0100 »

I find it fascinating when drivers talk about setups and what works and what does not.  Grin Which is why I was keen to hear member's experiences with my two offerings.

I had read somewhere that on ovals the inside tyre pressures should be harder than the outside tyres, but whenever I tried to make that concept work I got no joy. I am sure that it works for some drivers and I suspect that it depends upon driving styles and preferences? But it just did not work for me.

I like a car that turns in quickly when I lift off, and also generates oversteer when I press on the gas. The trick for me is to make the transition from lift off, to power on as smooth and stable as possible, so that I do not have to wait to be able to accelerate through a corner.

If the stiffer inside works for Axel and other drivers and allows them to get around an oval faster than they did before, that is great and no-one can argue about what is right and wrong.

 I have always felt that all the different parameters within the GPL setups all react with each other, and because of that there are many ways of arriving at the same result. If you factor in different driving styles as well, I would guess that there are a hundred ways of achieving a fast lap time.

I have to confess that I was very pleased with that Lancia setup....1:04.5 on the first flying lap which was far from perfect and no tow. I think that without tow, it would go sub 1:04 comfortably and with a perfect slipstream around the whole oval ( almost impossible in practice) a low 1:03, or even a dip into 1:02's would be possible.
 I only tried the Lancia because it is the fastest car, so that I had a benchmark for whatever car I chose to race. I did try the Connaught, but although I like a challenge that did seem a step too far, and I opted for the 250F.
So I set about getting the car to carry speed through T1 and T3. The obvious route was to more or less copy the Lancia setup and then tweak things to suit the Maserati.
Whatever I did appears to have worked for me, but some drivers have found that they cannot drive my setups with my 5:1 steering ratio?? which goes back to driving styles and preferences.

IMHO There is no right or wrong in GPL setups, only what works for you, and allows you to drive more quickly.


« Last Edit: October 26, 2017, 11:09:50 AM +0100 by EvilClive » Logged

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« Reply #65 on: October 26, 2017, 09:56:24 AM +0100 »

I have tested the setup of Axel and i have done 1,0450   0,070 less than my best into the race(with stream).I must say that i was on the right way with my setup but with value clearly less extreme.This setup allow me to enter the curves more easily and the front right tire seem less stressed.
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« Reply #66 on: October 26, 2017, 12:01:56 PM +0100 »

I can't get my head around Axel's stiffer on the inside setup.  My set up (which seemed not to spike the outside tyre temp too much) was much softer on the inside than the outside so, along with the camber, the car would naturally lean into the turns (indeed I had to apply a smidge of left lock all the way down the straights to prevent it).  I had a comparatively stiffer ARB at the rear than the front to promote the rear breaking away first.  Pressures are a matter for each wheel (as is Camber) but generally I was softer on the outside than the inner.

One thing which I've done in real life in Autograss and Stockcars is offset the right rear wheel so when the diff kicks power to it the turning force is magnified under power and you can also get the power down sooner.  you can't do that in GPL so a hyper aggressive diff is essential at minimum, it was 30/85 all the way.

I can't figure out how you can get an inclination for the car to turn in off power if you have a stiffer inside than out.  I'll have to drive that set-up and some point and see how it feels.  It certainly works . . . I just don't know how!
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« Reply #67 on: October 26, 2017, 04:24:12 PM +0100 »

..have you looked at Axel's setup? He has the left harder than the right!  Obviously not an exact science.

That's what I learned from EOLC oval specialists...

Inside is allways way stiffer!

Look here at TvO's post: http://srmz.net/index.php?showtopic=9600&#entry94871

Shows what I know Axel  Grin. My thinking was in-line with Reiver's but if oval specialists recommend a stiffer inside.....more investigation required  smartass.
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« Reply #68 on: October 26, 2017, 04:52:53 PM +0100 »

I am certainly curious about the "stiffer inside " theory. It obviously works for many racers, but my experiments with it have been total failures.

Maybe I am not understanding things correctly, because it just feels counter intuitive to stiffen the inside settings.  Huh If I had known about this theory 18 months ago I would have pinned Tommie v Ostade to the ground and extracted an answer when we met at Brands Hatch for the JSMT gathering 2016!!!

 In real life the Indy cars are totally offset towards the inside. I have no idea if they run stiffer inner suspension in RL, but I would have thought that you would want the car to naturally lean in through the corners? Perhaps it is the rebound shocks that are stiffer on the inner wheels to prevent them lifting?

All total guesswork on my part  Undecided

When we say "stiffer ", are we referring to Spring Rates, or Shocks, or Tyre pressures, or all 3??? and How much stiffer is stiffer? 10% or 50%??

Like Sam, I shall have to dig deeper just because it is supposed to work. On the other hand, I did have a setup that worked OK and was pretty quick, so I am not going to lose any sleep over this.  Roll Eyes
« Last Edit: October 26, 2017, 04:54:52 PM +0100 by EvilClive » Logged

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