NGT Sprint Cup - Season 1, Round 6, Spa - Aug 16th

[fozzmeister]

[ABS in race cars works by noticing when the wheels are locked doesn't it, as apposed to road cars where it releases the brakes all the time...

ABS in road cars works by detecting if wheels are not rotating. Some of the cheaper systems can't control each brake individually so release a brake that may not have locked because it in the same hydraulic circuit to a locked wheel.

Ah right, well in any case road cars take a severe hit when in the ABS zone don't they? I dunno, never driven one, do they unlock fully, I've seen them judder I think, unless that was in Fozz's alternate universe (TM) :-S

Fozzmeister

[Dave 'Gizmo' Gymer]

Ah right, well in any case road cars take a severe hit when in the ABS zone don't they? I dunno, never driven one, do they unlock fully, I've seen them judder I think, unless that was in Fozz's alternate universe (TM) :-S

Road going ABS systems vary considerably in both quality and style of application.

Most modern systems sense and control all 4 wheels independently (which gives them a huge advantage over the nut behind the wheel) and sense a sudden decrease in wheel rotation speed - they don't wait for full lockup. The good ones cycle very quickly (several times a second) but do unlock fully during each cycle - they don't attempt to threshold brake (though I guess it's only a matter of time...).

A modern ABS system will outperform a human driver even in the dry (older systems would only really shine in the wet), getting close to maximum braking out of all four wheels all the time.

[fozzmeister]

Interesting, I would have thought that computers could do threshold braking very easily, at least powerful ones, maybe not for F1 (weight and power draw) but GT cars, but clearly not.

Anyway, totally off topic...

Fozzmeister

[ProtoSpecs]

NGT Sprint Cup - Season 1, Round 6 at Spa Francorchamps

hi , i am a reserve ngt driver (registerd,Driver name:ProtoSpecs)but i did not get a password sent ,does that mean i can use the old one  (t..t....) or does it mean i am not in this race.
Also do (reserve) drivers have to tell in advance they want to join the race, and if so where?

[fozzmeister]

Your allowed to go in 5 mins before end of practice one, and yes, its the old PW.

Fozzmeister

[Dave 'Gizmo' Gymer]

hi , i am a reserve ngt driver (registerd,Driver name:ProtoSpecs)but i did not get a password sent ,does that mean i can use the old one  (t..t....) or does it mean i am not in this race.

It doesn't normally change round to round, as per your original password PM: Until further notice, the password for all bla races will be bla.

Also do (reserve) drivers have to tell in advance they want to join the race, and if so where?

No, just follow the instructions in this post (which I really ought to move into the rules ).

[[ZiP]Tyf]

Was going to ask if you could make that a sticky post at least Dave! But since I'm easily the laziest person on this board I hadn't actually found time to mention it to ye! 

T

[PaulW]

At the risk of sounding like a fool (don't snigger at the back) how many laps is tonights race and how mnay minutes fuel should I put in?

I still don't get it 

[[ZiP]Tyf]

Race = 31 mins!

So if you were to lead the whole race (bloody unlikely  ) you would have to have fuel for 31 minutes of racing (including the pace lap by the way) to make it till the end.
If you drive really really fast though you will be able to reach the limit set in kilometers which is 500 Km for a 3 hour race, so .../me gets calculator out ... 31 mins = 17.2% of a 180 minute race... 86.111 Km for our 31 mins race is the limit (I think ). Spa is how long? .../me goes to check... 6.968 Km! So 12.35 = 13 laps for the race leader to reach the Km limit! (I feel a flaw in my calculation, but can't find it yet ). Which will be impossible in an N-GT car m8. (2.22.8 would have to be your average lap times for all 13 laps and with no pace lap!) So no worries this Spa race will be decided on time not Km. So put in enough fuel to drive 31 mins.

All this bla bla bla is for nothing though, because (N)GT races will not be won by putting the exact amount of fuel in, they will only be lost by putting not enough in as Shark in his infinite wisdom (and NO I refuse to use his setups ) has already mentioned here on the forum! 

T

[PaulW]

(bloody unlikely 

Oi!

Thanks for all that work m8- it's much appreciated because I'll have to commit hari kari if I run out of fuel again. On the other hand I don't want to finish and still have 15 litres in the tank!

[fozzmeister]

Race = 31 mins!

So if you were to lead the whole race (bloody unlikely  ) you would have to have fuel for 31 minutes of racing (including the pace lap by the way) to make it till the end.
If you drive really really fast though you will be able to reach the limit set in kilometers which is 500 Km for a 3 hour race, so .../me gets calculator out ... 31 mins = 17.2% of a 180 minute race... 86.111 Km for our 31 mins race is the limit (I think ). Spa is how long? .../me goes to check... 6.968 Km! So 12.35 = 13 laps for the race leader to reach the Km limit! (I feel a flaw in my calculation, but can't find it yet ). Which will be impossible in an N-GT car m8. (2.22.8 would have to be your average lap times for all 13 laps and with no pace lap!) So no worries this Spa race will be decided on time not Km. So put in enough fuel to drive 31 mins.

All this bla bla bla is for nothing though, because (N)GT races will not be won by putting the exact amount of fuel in, they will only be lost by putting not enough in as Shark in his infinite wisdom (and NO I refuse to use his setups ) has already mentioned here on the forum! 

T

Wow that's some work Tyf, are you a Mathemetician (looking at that spelling I can't figure I passed english!)

Fozzmeister

[fozzmeister]

Thanks for all that work m8- it's much appreciated because I'll have to commit hari kari if I run out of fuel again. On the other hand I don't want to finish and still have 15 litres in the tank!

Your lucky, I had > 60 in my tank at the end of Enna (unbound pit controls, every time it put 100L of fuel in!)

Fozzmeister

[[ZiP]Tyf]

(bloody unlikely 

Oi!

Thanks for all that work m8- it's much appreciated because I'll have to commit hari kari if I run out of fuel again. On the other hand I don't want to finish and still have 15 litres in the tank!

Oi Oi LOL!

I never really bother too much with the fuel load to be honest. I just put in 2-3 more minutes than the race time says and that has so far always worked for me. Usually have a bit left at the end, but like I said 10-15 liters of fuel isn't going to weigh a car of 1150 KG down a lot!

Wow that's some work Tyf, are you a Mathemetician (looking at that spelling I can't figure I passed english!)
Fozzmeister

Nah, not really, just got too much time on my hands sometimes (well often actually ) and in a way I wanted to know it myself as well.
http://www.fiagt.com/results.php?season=2005&event=57&session=PM%20Test%20Session helped a little by the way, but most is just simple maths (in which I may have even made a mistake as in you may get a slightly different result when you start with the 500KM limit first and then calculate it back to a 31 minute race . Although saying that... Nah, that's also 'bloody unlikely' !  )

T

[fozzmeister]

LOL

I don't know whether to race or not, It'd be nice to qual and then if its poor, drop out. I seem to have a problem with passing slower cars. I would feel guilty doing that though as other people may want to race anyway...

Perhaps If my first lap or two is pap,  3 laps of fuel then see is the way forward, at least then if I drop out others will join prolly.

[silver53]

Hi Guys as you may or may not know I am a vehicle technician by profession and a part time tutor in that subject . ABS I had great faith in ABS until on Jan the 1st this year, I had to brake hard on sheet ice on a motorway in scotland as there was a muliple shunt in front of me at around midnight doing about 30mph in a blizzard my lovely vectra did not respond to kadence or any other braking and wrote itself off on the back of a merc sprinter van. At the time of impact I think it picked up speed. I work closely with the police vehicle examiners and the theory with pre 2000 cars is that if all wheels lock it just gives up for a split second taking the option of braking at all from the driver. I think we all know the sound of skidding on ice it sort of whistles , well I can tell you all I knew we were in trouble as there was eirey silence. I now through economic hard ship drive an old carlton and have much more faith in the brakes. It completely sh**t me up and I only did about 50 on the return journey in a hired car. I no longer have any faith in fancy braking. see you all tonight.gerald