Phil Thornton
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« on: October 16, 2008, 09:42:54 PM +0100 » |
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Season 16 Division 1 - Round 4 - Le Mans SartheThe fourth round of the championship and the first one on European soil. 1.UKGPL seems to be working OK so we are back on VROC for this round. This is a very high speed track, it is difficult to to avoid slow and stationary cars when approaching at high speed. So it is particularly important that drivers execute very careful rejoins, keeping well off the racing line until they are fully up to speed. Also drivers must stay well over to the right hand side when slowing down to make their pit stops. If you are not making a pit stop then you are well advised to keep to the left of the start/finish straight during the pit stop window. Please be in VROC UKGPL chatroom by 8:55 p.m. Server 1.ukgpl IP address 194.105.176.22 Race date = 19-10-2008 Track = Le Mans Sarthe Variant = 67F1 Damage Model = PRO Qualifying time = 35 minutes. Don't start until 30 mins left on clock to allow everyone to join. Race length = 50 minutes ( 14 laps) Password: see aboveDriver lists can be found on the championship standings pagePit Stop Times | Single Stop Time | | Double Stop Time | Cooper | No Stop | | N/A | Brabham | 17 | | N/A | BRM | 17 | | N/A | Ferrari | 31 | | 10 | Honda | 33 | | 11 | Lotus | 53 | | 21 | Eagle | 67 | | 29 |
First Pit Window is: 12 (to go on your pit board) to 8 (to go on your pit board) Second Pit Window is: 10 (to go on your pit board) to 4 (to go on your pit board)
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bernie
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« Reply #1 on: October 18, 2008, 11:49:57 AM +0100 » |
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Can't bring myself to practise for this one , It has to be a candidate for the most boring track ever in GPL . After what seems like 15 mins leaning on elbows , then "Hey whats this " anyone got a bucket and spade
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Iestyn Davies
Full Member
Posts: 303
Variety comes in packs of 7 GPL cars! Drive 5/day!
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« Reply #2 on: October 18, 2008, 03:40:25 PM +0100 » |
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Hehe Bernie I can see what you are saying. A race is the only reason I am gonna drive it Classic track with the Le Mans races, waiting for the different mods to be finished! Will take some good driving to make a good race with the 67's though... !
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GPLrank = -75 Monster = -400 See ya online
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bernie
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« Reply #3 on: October 18, 2008, 05:49:26 PM +0100 » |
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Well Le Mans is an "endurance" race after all So I suppose I will simply have to 'erm ............ "endure" it
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Storm_Cloud
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« Reply #4 on: October 19, 2008, 04:38:22 PM +0100 » |
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I can't make this race - sorry.
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Hristo Itchov
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« Reply #5 on: October 19, 2008, 06:32:44 PM +0100 » |
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I see Honda has a longer stop than the Ferrari. Again the issue of using WRs or something for calculating pitstops and not taking reliability in account. There's no way in hell you can be faster in a race with the Honda than with the Ferrari and make it to the end to tell about it. I dare anyone who thinks it's possible to do it, I'd call him/her the luckiest person ever!
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« Last Edit: October 19, 2008, 06:34:33 PM +0100 by Hristo Itchov »
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Phil Thornton
UKGPL Consigliere
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« Reply #6 on: October 19, 2008, 06:50:54 PM +0100 » |
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I see Honda has a longer stop than the Ferrari. Again the issue of using WRs or something for calculating pitstops and not taking reliability in account. There's no way in hell you can be faster in a race with the Honda than with the Ferrari and make it to the end to tell about it. I dare anyone who thinks it's possible to do it, I'd call him/her the luckiest person ever! We have tried to take reliability into account this season. Have a look at the Pit Stop Calculator and you will see we have introduced a race pace factor for Division 1. The Pit Stops are still based on WR times as we need some logical basis on which to calculate the stops. The race pace factor for the Honda and Ferrari is 1.005. This effectively shortens the Pit Stops for the faster cars to compensate for reliability etc. Using a race Pace Factor for the Honda of 1.008 (effectively lengthens the Honda WR time by 0.8%) would bring the Pit Stop down from 33 to 25 seconds. Maybe that would have been more appropriate in this case but it is difficult to call it correctly at the start of the season when we have to put everything in place. If we use this track again (unlikely if the comments from Bernie and Neil reflect the majority opinion) then we could go for 1.008 for the Honda. The race pace factors for the rest of this season's D1 races are all in the Pit Stop Calculator too. If anybody thinks they are wildly out I can ask Clive as the Divisional Mod to consider revising them.
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« Last Edit: October 19, 2008, 08:56:44 PM +0100 by Phil Thornton »
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Glyn
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« Reply #7 on: October 19, 2008, 08:27:11 PM +0100 » |
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Really not sure I can endure 14 runs down the Mulsanne tonight so I will give this one a miss and hope it doesn't effect my championship position too much!
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No arguments please, the moon IS made of cheese!
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Hristo Itchov
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« Reply #8 on: October 19, 2008, 08:54:14 PM +0100 » |
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I see Honda has a longer stop than the Ferrari. Again the issue of using WRs or something for calculating pitstops and not taking reliability in account. There's no way in hell you can be faster in a race with the Honda than with the Ferrari and make it to the end to tell about it. I dare anyone who thinks it's possible to do it, I'd call him/her the luckiest person ever! We have tried to take reliability into account this season. Have a look at the Pit Stop Calculator and you will see we have introduced a race pace factor for Division 1. The Pit Stops are still based on WR times as we need some logical basis on which to calculate the stops. The race pace factor for the Honda and Ferrari is 1.005. This effectively shortens the Pit Stops for the faster cars to compensate for reliability etc. Using a race Pace Factor for the Honda of 1.008 (effectively lengthens the Honda WR time by 0.8%) would bring the Pit Stop down from 33 to 25 seconds. Maybe that would have been more appropriate in this case but it is difficult to call it correctly at the start of the season when we have to put everything in place. If we use this track again (unlikely judging by the comments) then we could go for 1.008 for the Honda. The race pace factors for the rest of this season's D1 races are all in the Pit Stop Calculator too. If anybody thinks they are wildly out I can ask Clive as the Divisional Mod to consider revising them. I realize it's difficult to have a balance over an entire season unless the pitstop lengths are calculated separately for each race taking the characteristics of each track, so it was more of a joke than blaming anyone. I'm not sure how much of a loss in time there would be by running a safe 5th gear ratio in the Honda on this track and also short shifting up the gears, but I predict some 1-2 secs over a lap, perhaps even more if you really want to be on the safe side. At the same time the Ferrari is so robust you can even get away by running qualifying gearing. But anyway, those are details and of course they're not so valid for different tracks. So it's up to those who calculate the pitstop times if they're willing to bother with analysing each track in advance and separately. I actually like this one for a race, but not for running alone, but in a race you can have good battles as I can remember from our French series in B.R.E.A.S.T.S. some years ago. It would've worked great in the old Masters division with the top in standings taking slower cars thus giving chance of people down on points to move up with a better chance than at any other track (even more so than say Spa or Monza), but I guess that's not the case in D1.
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Phil Thornton
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« Reply #9 on: October 19, 2008, 10:03:28 PM +0100 » |
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I realize it's difficult to have a balance over an entire season unless the pitstop lengths are calculated separately for each race taking the characteristics of each track...
Well that's the idea. I've written the spreadsheet to be capable of doing that, but it still means someone has to plug in the right numbers. That's not an easy thing to do, someone has to know the characteristics of each car and each track or trawl through reams of historical data. Other than that all we can do is make a judgement after each race this season and suggest revisions to the current race pace factors.
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Phil Thornton
UKGPL Consigliere
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Posts: 7965
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« Reply #10 on: October 19, 2008, 10:10:50 PM +0100 » |
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Well another disastrous race for me . Out on Lap 1 again. Not really at fault just bad luck, slowed down for an incident and got rear ended. Reminds me a bit of John Roberts Masters races in S13, always in the wrong place at the wrong time. Anyway hoping for better luck at Kyalami.
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bernie
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« Reply #11 on: October 19, 2008, 10:31:02 PM +0100 » |
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Found out today I cant count , missed the pit in window , then got lost counting down from 53 secs (then got disco'd for being sationary too long ) My only excuse , Its a long time since I was at skewl Managed to navigate the T1 madness then later was shaping up for a scrap with Ken after his pit stop but got meself bunkered and by the time I'd dug the car out everyone was on ther way home. I then kept the crowds entertained for a while, making sand pies , they do make a change from meat and spud but do grind a bit , suppose you could say "there Grate " ) Will be away on hols for the Sefafrican GP so hope you all enjoy the w/e
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Iestyn Davies
Full Member
Posts: 303
Variety comes in packs of 7 GPL cars! Drive 5/day!
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« Reply #12 on: October 20, 2008, 05:18:41 AM +0100 » |
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Good and bad for me.... First D1 pole? I think... Yet Burt called for someone to beat off the line and sadly that ended up being me, after my engine started smoking as the flag dropped ! Managed to get out of the way so Ken could pass , did 2 slow laps and the engine gave out. I agree on the pitstops... I'd say the Honda is probably the only one that should get the extra calculations ~ The other 6 cars can all be driven with full revs in the race, just with varying degrees of tolerance to mis-shifts and over-revs. Whereas you could run an error-free race in the Honda capped at 10,750rpm and still blow the damn thing ! It'd just be up to either guesswork or looking at data. I'd suggest guesswork - after a while we'd be pretty spot on I think. And I can't see everyone plumping for the Honda in the meantime, seeking an advantage - Even if that did happen, I think we'd see a lot of engine blows........ Hakkinen @ Spain 2001 anybody?
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GPLrank = -75 Monster = -400 See ya online
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Burtoner
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« Reply #13 on: October 20, 2008, 10:50:41 AM +0100 » |
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Well that wasnt much good.
Off the line i got fairly decent start, then all of sudden Phil put anchors out and I had to as well, Phil went upside down (sorry Phil) but luckily i could continue. 3-4 laps in race i struck the wall, and then lost 2 wheels, and it was over :/
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UKGPL Season 14 Club Champion
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bernie
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« Reply #14 on: October 20, 2008, 12:57:27 PM +0100 » |
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I agree on the pitstops... I'd say the Honda is probably the only one that should get the extra calculations ~ The other 6 cars can all be driven with full revs in the race, just with varying degrees of tolerance to mis-shifts and over-revs. Whereas you could run I seem to remember in "real life" the H16 BRM had the worst reliability record , unless farther time has blurred my memory more than I can remember iyswim
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