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  • S19Gr Monaco: April 11, 2010
April 12, 2010, 12:41:14 PM +0100 - Monaco (1929-71) - UKGPL Season 19 (2010) Graduates Cup (67)
Driver
 Team
Nat. Make Model Class Qualifying Race
Tyres Pos Time/Gap Pos Time/Gap Laps Stops Best Retirement
reason
Ballast
EvilClive
 HikiWazaRacing
Honda RA300 F1 1967 4 +2.285
79.767mph
1 50:50.789
78.419mph
34 1:28.022
79.940mph
Firestone  
john roberts
 
Cooper T81b (Maserati) F1 1967 7 +3.403
78.769mph
2 +18.033
77.958mph
34 1:28.316
79.674mph
Firestone  
Al Heller
 Clark-Hill Racing
Cooper T81b (Maserati) F1 1967 3 +2.017
80.010mph
3 +29.759
77.662mph
34 1:28.265
79.720mph
Firestone  
Baab
 
Brabham BT24 (Repco) F1 1967 11 +6.042
76.508mph
4 +1L
75.118mph
33 1:27.302
80.599mph
Goodyear  
FullMetalGasket
 Black Night Racing
Brabham BT24 (Repco) F1 1967 2 +1.006
80.941mph
5 +2L
79.093mph
32 1:26.713
81.147mph
Goodyear  
Billy Nobrakes
 Black Night Racing
Brabham BT24 (Repco) F1 1967 13 +8.295
74.679mph
6 +15L
69.050mph
19 1:34.950
74.107mph
accident
Goodyear  
BookieW
 HikiWazaRacing
Brabham BT24 (Repco) F1 1967 14 +12.846
71.238mph
7 +21L
68.243mph
13 1:38.759
71.249mph
Disco
Goodyear  
Rick Nauman
 
Ferrari 312 (1967) F1 1967 6 +2.640
79.447mph
8 +25L
77.108mph
9 1:28.522
79.489mph
Disco
Firestone  
kinghiro
 Clark-Hill Racing
BRM P115 F1 1967 9 +3.563
78.628mph
9 +27L
71.196mph
7 1:32.842
75.790mph
Disco
Goodyear  
b_1_rd
 Clark-Hill Racing
Cooper T81b (Maserati) F1 1967 10 +5.471
76.986mph
10 +0.525
71.142mph
7 1:33.124
75.560mph
accident
Firestone  
hannah
 
Ferrari 312 (1967) F1 1967 15 +52.712
50.754mph
11 +2:08.165
60.068mph
7 1:47.673
65.351mph
Disco
Firestone  
Hristo Itchov
 HikiWazaRacing
Honda RA300 F1 1967 1 1:25.928
81.888mph
12 +30L
80.282mph
4 1:26.744
81.118mph
Disco
Firestone  
Turkey Machine
 HikiWazaRacing
Honda RA300 F1 1967 5 +2.446
79.622mph
13 +10.400
77.969mph
4 1:28.907
79.144mph
accident
Firestone  
Podkrecony_Ziutek
 Clark-Hill Racing
Cooper T81b (Maserati) F1 1967 8 +3.536
78.652mph
14 +32.025
73.562mph
4 1:32.545
76.033mph
accident
Firestone  
Michael Turner
 Soggy Bottom Racers Club
Cooper T81b (Maserati) F1 1967 12 +7.576
75.253mph
15 +34L
---
0 ---
---
Disco
Firestone  
2 UKGPL_T7
 
BRM P115 F1 1967 16 16 DNS ---
---
Goodyear  

Moderator's Report

A win by Evil in an eventful race. The combination of slow and fast drivers mixed in with Monaco did cause problems.
Whilst we want to encourage everyone to take part, the 67's take some mastering, so for those not confident to jump into these beasts yet we reccomend trying the 65 Novices first.
Also, if you feel warp is an issue, and it is not clearly shown on the server please submit a clip of your client replay when reporting incidents. Without a clip we can only view the server replay and use that.


Server replay time: 0h09m30s

A gaggle of drivers (King Hero, Steve B and Bob W) were following the slower Hannah.
Bob rear ends Steve at a corner. The server does not show any warp and, in the absence of a client replay, this is discounted. It is appreciated the snake was very slow hence we can reduce the penalty to a warning, nevertheless Bob should have taken extra care bearing in mind the concertina effect.


Server replay time: 0h12m24s

Having passed Hannah when the driver span Steve B is following King Hero.
Steve then rear ends Tom. This would normally incur a place penalty however Steve's apology is taken into account and the fact that Tom was much slower at this point then on previous laps (85 v 100+ mph) which Steve could not expect.


Server replay time: 0h23m09s

Warp incident involving Bob and Billy. No one at fault.

  • Racing incident

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Author Topic: UKGPL Season 19 (2010) Graduates Cup (67) - Monaco (1929-71) - Apr 11  (Read 9683 times)
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Turkey Machine
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« Reply #15 on: April 11, 2010, 08:59:16 PM +0100 »

Sorry to hear Fulvio and Hristo have injured themselves. Speedy recovery to both, especially Fulvio. I know skiing accidents can take a while to recover from.

I managed to injure my knee running this weekend, so this race should be an interesting test of stamina for myself.
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Everyone knows that million-to-one chances happen 9 times out of 10. Why the hell do I keep crashing then?!
Hristo Itchov
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« Reply #16 on: April 11, 2010, 09:57:56 PM +0100 »

OK, this was a complete joke. This is the worst track you chose to combine the two grids on one server.

I could barely get a clean lap in Qualifying, there were people 20 seconds off the pace.

Then in the race I caught up a backmarker on lap 5 (!), I slowed down, waited for him to decide what to do, man, he was cruising on the straight after T1, I tried to show myself in his right-side mirror and gradually went on his side, but he hit me and I lost a wheel and retired from the lead.

Please rerun this race... what a joke.
« Last Edit: April 11, 2010, 09:59:39 PM +0100 by Hristo Itchov » Logged

kinghiro
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« Reply #17 on: April 11, 2010, 10:35:36 PM +0100 »

I survived some laps but then got caught behind the backlapper for 2 laps or so. got hit from behind just after that and lost a wheel. I think it could be indirectly related to the frustration after those two laps.
. No bad feelings to the new guy. He s most welcome, but we should have some kind of test maybe? at least an approval from somebody before someone new enters a competitive race where we struggle for points.
this doesn t happen often so it s not a big problem at least Smiley. And I can see issues with reruns..the podium finishers etc..
And get well soon Fulvio and Hristo..
« Last Edit: April 11, 2010, 10:45:23 PM +0100 by kinghiro » Logged
Rick Nauman
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« Reply #18 on: April 11, 2010, 10:48:26 PM +0100 »

I agree totally but I would throw in the "F" word about 5 times.  No need to "sleep on it", or "wait a while" before posting.  It's plain and simple, H. Hurricane (and possibly some others) should simply not have been allowed to race in a "Graduates" Cup race.  Her (Is it Hanna?) driving in qualifying was that of someone with about 1 hour's GPL experience.  That is NOT an exaggeration.  His/Her "race" driving was just as bad.  He/she ruined my f 'ing race on about lap 10.  Are we that desperate to fill the grid?  If any more drivers of this caliber are allowed to drive in this division you can count me out.  I work too hard getting ready for a race just to have some beginner ruin it for me before I even get warmed up.

And Hristo, you can forget about a re-do.  There was good reason last season to do one after we started Zandvoort about 30-45 minutes late with the laps accidentally set for about 12.  Some people saw the length change in chat and some (still qualifying) didn't.  So several guys ran with about 30 laps fuel load.  Twelve lap race, wrong fuel load for several... but no redo.   Huh
« Last Edit: April 11, 2010, 11:53:23 PM +0100 by Rick Nauman » Logged
Turkey Machine
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« Reply #19 on: April 11, 2010, 10:50:31 PM +0100 »

I think a rerun should be concidered at least. No bad feelings to the new guy. He s most welcome, but we should have some kind of test maybe? at least an approval from somebody before someone new enters a competitive race where we struggle for points.
this doesn t happen often so it s not a big problem at least Smiley. And I can see issues with reruns..the podium finishers etc..
And get well soon Fulvio and Hristo..best wishes Smiley
This happens with new arrivals in another league I run in - they get vetted before they run in a competitive race to make sure they're capable of running at a speed which isn't detrimental to other competitors, that they know what the rules are, that they know where the mirrors are, and how to use them, and that they've at least got some experience in the cars. Other drivers, both experienced and inexperienced can sit in on the test race and offer their expertise on whether the new recruit is good enough for a first competitive race.

I think Mr(?) Hurricane would do well to practice off-line with other cars, before entering another Pro rules race. It's OK to be consistently off the pace, but 40 seconds a lap off the pace and scared to use full throttle on the straight bits is dangerously slow, especially at Monaco with Pro rules (i.e. no Shift-R). At least please be aware of where other cars are, and if you are going to be so slow, move OFFLINE and stay there.

As for my own race, after getting the best start and leaping past Al and evil on the run to Ste Devote, I set about not making mistakes. Then the slow car arrived on the scene to ruin H's race and cause my heart to skip a couple beats up the hill to Massenet. I did toy with the idea of punting that car off on the run to Station hairpin, but thought better of it. I then came unstuck on the run down to Tabac, and ended up with 3 wheels on my white wagon. Game over! Move on, I guess. 2 races down, one race finished.
« Last Edit: April 11, 2010, 10:53:14 PM +0100 by Turkey Machine » Logged

Everyone knows that million-to-one chances happen 9 times out of 10. Why the hell do I keep crashing then?!
bernie
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« Reply #20 on: April 11, 2010, 11:05:54 PM +0100 »

Missed this one  :'(

Was  pratting about swapping HDD's looking for old GPL files then for some reason the PC didnt want to recognise my new HD  Undecided

By the time I got it sorted the race was half done , perhaps as well , didn't miss much it seems from the above comments and would probably been just another "mobile chicane" for the aliens to negotiate .

Feel sorry for the Newby , babtism of fire,  no doubt exagerated by having a mixed grid at the toughest track in the world for any newby , not a good idea , IMO of coarse .



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FullMetalGasket
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« Reply #21 on: April 11, 2010, 11:17:26 PM +0100 »

Well, after inheriting 1st from Hristo after his incident all was for naught due to my engine blowing a lap and a half from the finish  Sad

WD finishers  Smiley
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D-Rock
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« Reply #22 on: April 11, 2010, 11:28:11 PM +0100 »

Tried to join but kept timing out on the connection screen. Have to agree with bernie, it doesn't look like I missed much, but it still would have been nice to try and survive and get some decent points.
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Al Heller
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« Reply #23 on: April 12, 2010, 11:56:47 AM +0100 »

Firstly commiserations to Tim - really cruel luck for the engine to let go right at the end when you had the race virtually won. I'd already blown an engine in qually so was uber-paranoid for the race, perhaps a little too paranoid. Had Clive large in my mirrors for the opening laps & then made the classic Monaco mistake of turning in too early at the final hairpin - I lightly bumped the inside kerb which chucked me into the armco on the outside. Dropped 2 places there, then while recovering managed to tangle with John who I hadn't realised was also alongside. Sorry about that John - luckily we both seemed to escape any major damage but after all that I'd managed to drop from 3rd to 8th in the space of 2 laps Undecided. After that Bartosz seemed to run very wide at the Station Hairpin so I took a tight line to overtake which looked OK from my view but perhaps didn't leave Bart with any choice so apologies if that seemed a bit iffy! Got held up a bit behind HH which dropped me further behind the Evil-Rick-John group but with people dropping off the leaderboard like flies I decided to take it a little easier for the 1st half of the race. Was trying not to over-rev the engine through the chicane but had eased off too much as Bob/Baab was closing very quickly so then spent the second half of the race pushing pretty hard in a Prib timing battle with Bob. (The results say that Bob was a lap down but I think that might be incorrect because he started from the pitlane?) Anyway managed to stay ahead to the flag & was lucky to inherit the last podium place after Tim's demise. Congratulations to Evil & JR ahead.

On the other hot topic, I think it's up to us to ensure new joiners are up to speed. When I first joined UKGPL, I was asked to do an online practice with a mod & some seasoned campaigners just to assess my driving & make sure I understood the pitfalls of online racing (which I had never done before). Doing your first race at Monaco, in 67's with PRO rules & a mixed ability grid is truly a baptism of fire. 
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EvilClive
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« Reply #24 on: April 12, 2010, 01:59:06 PM +0100 »

[This happens with new arrivals in another league I run in - they get vetted before they run in a competitive race to make sure they're capable of running at a speed which isn't detrimental to other competitors, that they know what the rules are, that they know where the mirrors are, and how to use them, and that they've at least got some experience in the cars. Other drivers, both experienced and inexperienced can sit in on the test race and offer their expertise on whether the new recruit is good enough for a first competitive race.]

I feel sorry for "Hannah" ( male or female??)  being dropped into such a tough race, but maybe Monaco was not the place for baptism?
Undoubtedly he/she was out of their depth as I almost came to grief trying to lap them on at least 2 occasions. At least I survived, where others did not.

Oddly enough, I was "vetted" ( the bruising soon went down ) when I applied to join UKGPL some years ago. Clive Loynes got me to join a "pick-up" race one Saturday at Monza. At the time I knew none of the names, nor did I have any idea of etiquette or race craft ( nothing much has changed Roll Eyes ) and I was pitted against Nat Wald and John Bradbury  ( I think) . I later discovered that these were bona fide fire breathing aliens and I was expected to keep pace with them..HAHA!! yeah right!!.
 Maybe we should schedule "assesment" races when we have prospective new members who can then be looked at and a decision made?
As for the race...
Lousy start, and Jethro jumped me....but this was a long race and I was happy to take a lap or two to get the tyres up to temp before i started pressing Al who was ahead of me. Slowly I moved up the leader board as various people disco'd for various reasons until I found myself in 2nd spot about 10 secs behind Tim who was flying. The regular encounters with a certain backmarker caused a closing up of my battles with cars trying to catch me until they fell foul of that particular obstacle. I could match Tim for speed but could not close the gap without risking everything including the delicate Waza turbine, so I tried to keep him within range  in case he made a mistake. Our pace drew us away from John who was in 3rd spot but with 5 laps to go I settled for 2nd spot and started short shifting to ensure I had fuel to last to the flag.
Then with 3 laps to go suddenly there were yellow flags and Tim was no longer in front...I was leading!!! It seems that Tim's efforts had trashed the Brabham engine and he had retired.
So, Waza  technology survived to the end of a race that saw all but 5 cars fall by the wayside. Harsh luck on Tim but I have been there and I know how frustrating it feels.
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bernie
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« Reply #25 on: April 12, 2010, 03:51:48 PM +0100 »

Can't decide which is worse ?

trying to pass a wobbly newby  Roll Eyes

jethro coming up behind  Shocked

or evil leaning on yer doorhandle  Cheesy












I'll get me coat  Smiley

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maestro57
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« Reply #26 on: April 12, 2010, 04:31:37 PM +0100 »

[ Maybe we should schedule "assesment" races when we have prospective new members who can then be looked at and a decision made?

I would suggest three other options for consideration

1 Evidence to be provided of online racing history and this be assessed by a moderator and the new driver either accepted or sent to race in 65's Nov's for first few races

2 All new drivers start in 65 Nov's for at least a few races.

3 Run the 67's series as per 65's series. Have a Nov's with shiftR, and AMs at Pro level

Personally I would like to see races for Nov's in 67's with shiftR. I am put off trying 67s on a regular basis knowing I am going to crash and end not only my race but feel guilty probably wiping someone else out with me. Ok I know I should practice 67's more and get used to them, but I haven't yet.
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b_1_rd
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« Reply #27 on: April 12, 2010, 05:44:56 PM +0100 »

Shocking race for me, which ended up in taking a teamy out, so very annoyed with that.  Sorry Tom.

I too feel a bit sorry for our new member.  Perhaps a little more advice and guidance and a little less criticism may help our newer drivers.  It's not the easiest thing to drive after all, and very bloody daunting the first online races.  I still get nervous after few years of doing this.

Having said that, perhaps a review of new drivers abilities is worthwhile, and then followed up by encouraging newbies to reach a suitable level to race effectively and safely.  Some might do well to remember, we all had to start somewhere!

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FullMetalGasket
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« Reply #28 on: April 12, 2010, 06:29:40 PM +0100 »

It seems that Tim's efforts had trashed the Brabham engine and he had retired.
So, Waza  technology survived to the end of a race that saw all but 5 cars fall by the wayside. Harsh luck on Tim but I have been there and I know how frustrating it feels.


Sadly the Repco lump hadn't even been thrashed into submission Clive  Sad - Owing to my total lack of knowledge re. how sturdy it was (and blowing an engine within the first lap while following Tom in practice! Shocked ) I was actually taking it easy on the engine from about the 3rd lap on - reasoning being I wouldn't catch Hristo unless he blew up or crashed no-matter what I did, and I was fast enough while taking it easy not to worry too much about advances from the rear (ohh err!)
Don't know if my replay shows it but I actually missed 3rd exiting Tabac and that's what blew my engine  Embarrassed


As for our new member; I feel their best bet given their obvious lack of experience would be a season in the Novs to get a better handle on how to drive these beasties - a 312 isn't the hardest of chassis at Monaco IMO but as has been mentioned, a full on Pro rules battle is perhaps not the best place to start carving out a GPL career.
Hope Hannah isn't put off too much by the harsher comments above but if I were in Her (his?) shoes I'd seriously consider the Novs to get me a good grounding and some help and advice away from the Aliens  Smiley
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Michael Turner
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« Reply #29 on: April 12, 2010, 06:33:26 PM +0100 »

I've no wish to anticipate the moderator's review of the two Hs incident but in HH's defence and having watched the replay several times I have to say that blame for the incident does not seem to be entirely one sided. As has been said many times, the most important element of safe overtaking is patience and choosing the right moment.
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