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  • S19S Porto: May 16, 2010
May 16, 2010, 11:17:26 PM +0100 - Porto - UKGPL Season 19 (2010) Spec Challenge
Driver
 Team
Nat. Make Model Class Qualifying Race
Tyres Pos Time/Gap Pos Time/Gap Laps Stops Best Retirement
reason
Ballast
Clutch4
 Mountside Racing
Lotus 33 (Climax 1965) F1 1965 6 +4.566
114.874mph
1 19:25.280
114.087mph
8 2:24.513
114.992mph
Dunlop  
FullMetalGasket
 Black Night Racing
Ferrari 512 F1 1965 3 +2.653
116.413mph
2 +9.200
113.193mph
8 2:21.470
117.466mph
Dunlop  
kinghiro
 Clark-Hill Racing
Ferrari 512 F1 1965 2 +1.146
117.655mph
3 +14.159
112.717mph
8 2:22.662
116.484mph
Dunlop  
Phil Thornton
 Antipasti Racing
Ferrari 512 F1 1965 5 +3.574
115.667mph
4 +24.250
111.761mph
8 2:24.146
115.285mph
Dunlop  
Al Heller
 Clark-Hill Racing
Ferrari 512 F1 1965 9 +5.373
114.237mph
5 +31.342
111.099mph
8 2:24.687
114.854mph
Dunlop  
b_1_rd
 Clark-Hill Racing
Ferrari 512 F1 1965 8 +5.369
114.240mph
6 +32.011
111.037mph
8 2:23.336
115.937mph
Dunlop  
maddog
 
Ferrari 512 F1 1965 11 +7.803
112.360mph
7 (+2) +51.010
109.302mph
8 2:25.529
114.190mph
Dunlop  
bernie
 Soggy Bottom Racers Club
Ferrari 512 F1 1965 14 +20.531
103.456mph
8 +1:35.409
105.453mph
8 2:30.158
110.669mph
Dunlop  
NHance
 Mountside Racing
Lotus 33 (Climax 1965) F1 1965 10 +7.089
112.905mph
9 (+3) +1:36.764
105.340mph
8 2:26.655
113.313mph
Dunlop  
Billy Nobrakes
 Black Night Racing
Lotus 33 (Climax 1965) F1 1965 12 +8.836
111.580mph
10 +1:46.169
104.560mph
8 2:29.385
111.242mph
Dunlop  
G Poole
 Black Night Racing
Ferrari 512 F1 1965 13 +13.111
108.467mph
11 +2:17.188
102.070mph
8 2:34.263
107.724mph
Dunlop  
EvilClive
 HikiWazaRacing
Lotus 33 (Climax 1965) F1 1965 1 2:20.096
118.618mph
12 +1L
112.961mph
7 2:21.658
117.310mph
Disco
Dunlop  
natan5
 
Ferrari 512 F1 1965 4 +3.521
115.710mph
13 +6L
111.391mph
2 2:29.475
111.175mph
Disco
Dunlop  
Turkey Machine
 HikiWazaRacing
Lotus 33 (Climax 1965) F1 1965 7 +4.602
114.845mph
14 +8L
---
0 ---
---
Disco
Dunlop  
2 UKGPL_T7
 
Ferrari 512 F1 1965 15 17 DNS ---
---
Dunlop  

Moderator's Report

Moderators report as follows. First time we have had penalised incidents in the Spec series. Not trying to dampen the fun spirit but this is a proper championship.


Server replay time: 0h08m09s

Maddog runs into the rear of Phil Thornton going into the last turn.


Server replay time: 0h09m00s

NHnace rejoining track the race after taking a SnG. He loses momentum and is hit by Billy.

May 16, 2010, 11:17:45 PM +0100 - Porto - UKGPL Season 19 (2010) Spec Challenge
Driver
 Team
Nat. Make Model Class Qualifying Race
Tyres Pos Time/Gap Pos Time/Gap Laps Stops Best Retirement
reason
Ballast
kinghiro
 Clark-Hill Racing
Lotus 33 (Climax 1965) F1 1965 2 +0.887
117.693mph
1 19:07.424
115.826mph
8 2:21.141
117.703mph
Dunlop  
EvilClive
 HikiWazaRacing
Ferrari 512 F1 1965 1 2:20.266
118.437mph
2 +18.652
113.974mph
8 2:20.954
117.859mph
Dunlop  
maddog
 
Lotus 33 (Climax 1965) F1 1965 11 +11.157
109.711mph
3 +23.886
113.464mph
8 2:22.887
116.265mph
Dunlop  
b_1_rd
 Clark-Hill Racing
Lotus 33 (Climax 1965) F1 1965 4 +3.525
115.534mph
4 +26.042
113.256mph
8 2:24.214
115.195mph
Dunlop  
Phil Thornton
 Antipasti Racing
Lotus 33 (Climax 1965) F1 1965 7 +4.076
115.093mph
5 +51.516
110.850mph
8 2:24.113
115.276mph
Dunlop  
FullMetalGasket
 Black Night Racing
Lotus 33 (Climax 1965) F1 1965 5 +3.607
115.468mph
6 +1:17.839
108.468mph
8 2:23.899
115.447mph
Dunlop  
Al Heller
 Clark-Hill Racing
Lotus 33 (Climax 1965) F1 1965 6 +3.814
115.302mph
7 +1:26.456
107.711mph
8 2:23.446
115.812mph
Dunlop  
NHance
 Mountside Racing
Ferrari 512 F1 1965 9 +10.273
110.355mph
8 +1:35.258
106.948mph
8 2:28.872
111.591mph
Dunlop  
Clutch4
 Mountside Racing
Ferrari 512 F1 1965 8 +6.847
112.925mph
9 +1:53.127
105.432mph
8 2:27.292
112.788mph
Dunlop  
bernie
 Soggy Bottom Racers Club
Lotus 33 (Climax 1965) F1 1965 12 +13.758
107.858mph
10 +2:03.234
104.593mph
8 2:30.201
110.603mph
Dunlop  
Turkey Machine
 HikiWazaRacing
Ferrari 512 F1 1965 14 +25.238
100.377mph
11 +1L
103.598mph
7 2:28.719
111.706mph
Disco
Dunlop  
Billy Nobrakes
 Black Night Racing
Ferrari 512 F1 1965 10 +10.338
110.307mph
12 +28.422
101.040mph
7 2:34.542
107.497mph
Disco
Dunlop  
G Poole
 Black Night Racing
Lotus 33 (Climax 1965) F1 1965 13 +20.410
103.393mph
13 +3L
94.949mph
5 2:40.826
103.296mph
Disco
Dunlop  
natan5
 
Lotus 33 (Climax 1965) F1 1965 3 +3.073
115.898mph
14 +6L
112.115mph
2 2:25.452
114.215mph
Disco
Dunlop  
NickyIckx
 Antipasti Racing
Ferrari 512 F1 1965 16 15 +34.245
100.502mph
2 2:34.933
107.225mph
Disco
Dunlop  
2 UKGPL_T7
 
Brabham BT11 (Climax) F1 1965 15 16 DNS ---
---
Goodyear  

Moderator's Report

Only one report.


No reports for this race.

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Author Topic: UKGPL Season 19 (2010) Spec Challenge - Porto - May 16  (Read 6824 times)
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Billy Nobrakes
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« Reply #15 on: May 19, 2010, 02:12:57 PM +0100 »

Just a little insight on how much of a difference a set up makes.
I spent quite a bit of time testing the Ferrari at Porto because I really struggle with the red machines. Managed to get into the 2.28’s which was about par with my Lotus time. (Not great but not awful). Realised the day after the race that I’d been a bit of a Muppet & forgot to adjust for a left-handed circuit. Out of interest I did a few laps in the Lotus with adjusted cambers & wheel rate - & took over 2 seconds off my PB (low 2.26’s).
A couple of days before I lent Tom (King Hiro) my Fezza set up. I think he tweaked the gears a bit – but set a great qualification time with 2nd on the grid. There are two possible endings to this tale:
1) Some drivers just accommodate & get the best out of set up OR
2) Tom would have been even quicker with a left-hand biased set up
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bernie
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« Reply #16 on: May 19, 2010, 02:46:29 PM +0100 »

Improved my fezza time significantly with some after race tweaking , didnt think "offset" made much diiference at Porto , the BIG improvement was using the correct gear ratios .

I think they are the single most significant factor to 65's lap times , closely followed by tyre pressures .

All the other tweaks , ride hieght arb's etc help but to a lesser degree ( to me anyway)

One thing I did note, to much f/r toe can kill top end speeds on those long straights  Roll Eyes
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b_1_rd
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« Reply #17 on: May 19, 2010, 07:35:26 PM +0100 »

the BIG improvement was using the correct gear ratios .

How do you mean, Bernie?  Do you even spread the gears or something different?

I have my own method, using Setup Assistant 65, but I'm always interested in what others do with setups.
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« Reply #18 on: May 19, 2010, 08:23:20 PM +0100 »

You need to get from the slowest corner (exit speed)  to fastest part of straight ( Vmax) in shortest time . should be max rpm at end of longest straight . so yes,  spread the gears but look at max power rpm's for each gear and the rpm drop to the next gear , the quickest will drop the revs right on the flat part of the power torque curve. 

I use GRE for that (not tried set up assistant)  but its not the full story ,using taller 1st 2nd gears mean less wheelspin when max acceleration is needed at low speeds then you can have shorter gears at the higher speeds so keeping it "on the cam" more ,

Some longer corners like on Porto's fast sweepers benefit from being geared to suit . you dont want to be shifting during a corner or when going into one as it can upset the handling , There are exceptions like Spa for inst . where a quick downshift mid corner can kick the rear out and counter any understeer which would normally cause you to have to lift off .

But its all a compromise because you need to dial in the diff ratio and ramp angles plus each engine has its own power curve , the fezzer is all top end likewise the BRM whera's the climax is a much flatter curve with a wider spread of power

almost always the way to go is copy some aliens wr gearbox from his set up , then you know its good    Smiley
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« Reply #19 on: May 19, 2010, 08:55:24 PM +0100 »

ok, cool, cheers
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EvilClive
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« Reply #20 on: May 20, 2010, 09:15:59 AM +0100 »

IMHO gearing is very important, just as Bernie has illustrated, and I have discovered that I can shave significant chunks off my PB's if I get it right. ( not that I get it right that often!! )

All I would add to Bernie's wisdom are a couple of factors to consider alongside the ratio issue, because in GPL setups I find altering one parameter invariably affects something else  Undecided........ it is all a balancing act.

The mechanical setup of the suspension/rollbars/diff settings etc will limit, or allow, how much power you can physically stuff through the system without disappearing into the scenery in a spectacular cartwheel.

Sometimes, I find it better to raise the ratio by a notch ( or take a gear higher ) for a certain corner so that it naturally limits the power available and prevents wheelspin and loss of grip. I know it probably is not the optimum solution, but it makes the car much more compliant and very much more predictable. At Porto I was dropping to 1st gear for the left hander at the end of the long straight in the early stages of learning the circuit, but discovered that by leaving it in 2nd I could blend through the corner and get on the throttle much earlier.. and actually carry more speed all the way down to the next sharp left.

At some circuits there are corners that are on their own, absolutely critical to getting a good lap time. The Loop at Watkins Glen is a good example for me. Usually I set up 3rd gear to be exactly right just for this corner, because if I can carry good speed and a very stable car through the Loop, I exit onto the following straight with the throttle absolutely nailed and carry that speed all the way to the Big Bend. It might mean that somewhere else on the circuit I am changing 3rd to 4th very quickly, but personally I find that overall I gain maybe a second or more per lap.
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bernie
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« Reply #21 on: May 20, 2010, 10:21:31 AM +0100 »

So much for the theory , the tough bit as always is applying it .

I would add to what clive says that most hotlap setups aren't good for racing for the same reason of getting the power down smoothly and particularly top gear for draughting , also helps engine life in pro race mode .

But were probably telling you to suck them eggs  Smiley
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« Reply #22 on: May 20, 2010, 12:38:35 PM +0100 »

All good info.  I appreciate a setup is very much developed in-line with the driving style, but information as to how people produce their setup is not talked about enough sometimes.  Hopefully will help someone, somewhere.
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Billy Nobrakes
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« Reply #23 on: May 20, 2010, 10:11:04 PM +0100 »

Here are the Spec Challenge results from Porto.
Usual rules apply i.e. fastest race lap for each driver who completed more than half distance in both chassis. Table again courtesy of the Statmeiseter.
This one produced a fair spread but overall result was the Lotus bested the Fezza by an average of just under half a second. Graham had a poor run in the Lotus but this was evened out by Billy mistreating the Ferrari.
With Hristo missing there were first wins for Clutch & King Hiro in the Lights. In the Heavies a win for Maddog and Phil keeps up the pressure on Steve. Steve having the record for a podium in every race.

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« Reply #24 on: May 20, 2010, 10:27:12 PM +0100 »

PRESSURE....what pressure  scared  lol well done guys.
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« Reply #25 on: May 21, 2010, 09:58:58 PM +0100 »

Well done Steve , keep it up, must be candidate for the UKGPLMID of the year   Grin


We trained em well in soggies   Grin Grin Grin
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« Reply #26 on: May 22, 2010, 12:27:50 AM +0100 »

Whats great about our sport, is the way it seems to be a perfect blend of science and art.  With the recent discussion of setups on this thread, I thought I'd switch more to the artful side of things.

When it comes to driving art, I think a well worn, and squeaky steering wheel could well be the best way to go. Allow me to elucidate - mine has become that way, through much vital input at UKGPL.  So much so, that I've now been banned from squeaking on-line beyond bedtime . . .and thus was set the stage . . .

It was with some bravado, that I sneaked into Brands Hatch, when it showed up on UKGPL_6 last night, to sort out initial setups.  My driving style has always been somewhat exuberant, so the challenge I set, was to use as little steering input as possible, and try driving with my feet, knowing that any sudden twitch could mean disqualification, dismissal from the track, and a severe repremand!  Bearing this in mind, I set the cars up accordingly.

After a few sighting laps, and a couple of tweaks, I was dancing on my pedals to the tune of, the under 1.40 for 2 step.  Don't know exactly how that stacks up, but seemed adequate?  Just goes to show - there's more than one way to skin a rabbit.  Allow me to demonstrate: http://senduit.com/f6d782 - off limits to the squeamish.  

Could improve very little later, even though outside of curfew hours. Roll Eyes

So, if anyone is interested in my unique,"Hunts - Squeak Tuned Wheel", I dare say I could abscond with any generous offers, if polite.  The evidence suggests, this could well be the perfect training tool to wend ones way to victory, and I'd just have to suffer in silence.  
                                                                                                                       scooter
« Last Edit: May 22, 2010, 12:51:07 AM +0100 by maddog » Logged
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« Reply #27 on: May 22, 2010, 11:52:39 AM +0100 »

Seems like Porto proved a difficult track to get right as most people's laptime consistency scores were pretty dire. A perfect score would have been 40 but only a handful of drivers even scored above 30:

Top 5 laptime consistency (both races-Light & Heavy combined)

1. Clutch (race 2) - 0.334 average deviation
2. Maddog (race 1) - 0.680
3. King Hiro (race 1) - 1.087
4. Steve Bird (race 1) - 1.550
5. Phil Thornton (race 1) - 1.553

Heavy:




Light:



* 0.00 in Consistency table denotes average laptime deviation > 5 secs cutoff
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Billy Nobrakes
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« Reply #28 on: June 07, 2010, 11:52:56 PM +0100 »

Moderators report now posted.
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