NGT Sprint Cup - Season 2, Round 3, Enna - Nov 15th

[Jamera]

Congrats to Mo (no-one else matters  ), in clocking up more points for the K`Crawlers.

*uh hum* *cough cough, 10th place, 5 points*

[Mike Wrightson]

Dave, can you move me to reserve in NGT sprint please?  Thanks.

[Don]

Congrats to Mo (no-one else matters  ), in clocking up more points for the K`Crawlers.

Yes thanks Rob thats the "Team spirit".
Don.

[greg130]

I can understand how you felt, Greg did that to me in race 1 so I nicked the idea!

Now look what iv'e started.
Pops there is a small difference between the two moves, I waited until after the s/f line before I overtook you.

[popabawa]

Seeing as this has been brought up a couple of times it might be appropriate to discuss this 

Disclaimer: I'm totally happy to discuss this incident as I think the start procedure still needs a little clarification. This post is intended to be a discussion point. If the mod's rule that it was against the rules then I'll accept that and take whatever penalty is appropriate.

(Having said that, if this post is contrary to the posting rules, apologies and please delete. I don't think it is though as there's no other driver directly involved.)

What happened was that I waited until Shark had crossed the start/finish line, then accelarated as per this rule;

No driver shall accelerate at the end of the formation lap until the leader crosses the start line.

I'd pulled to the left to get a good view of this (I was in 6th), next bit of the rule is;

Each following driver should only accelerate when the driver ahead does.

Now, I believe that the car in front was accelerating, just not very quickly. This is probably the core of the issue in this case.

The part about it being before the start line is covered by this rule (my bold);

No driver shall pass another until the end of the formation lap (when the leader crosses the start line)

When I overtook, the leader was well over the start line so the formation lap was over and in my interpretation of the rules it was OK to overtake.

So rests the case for the defence m'lud... 

Pops

[Zacari]

I still have an issue with this, primarily because the leader rarely takes it steady out of the last corner!  I've only ever been in pole once in an online race (was at enna funnily enough) and I literally didn't go above about 70-80kph out of the last complex so the filed was nice and stable.  On Tuesday I had to floor it out of the last corner just to catch up to the guy infront, only to have to lift alot because the leader wasn't over the s/f line.  And I was only in 8th, I expect the guys further back just accelerated fully out of the last corner.

It's a pain that GTR has the bugs meaning we have to do a manual warm-up lap.  I'm not sure if using the last corner would be better because it might just move the problem, but if the leader always kept the end of the lap much slower I'm sure there would be less of an issue with the current system.

Each following driver should only accelerate when the driver ahead does.

Now, I believe that the car in front was accelerating, just not very quickly. This is probably the core of the issue in this case.

This is the main issue really as people are accelerating to catch up to the car infront, as well as after the leader's gone, and there's no way of telling one from the other when you're behind!  Only by the leader going slower at the end can we eliminate the need for cars accelerating to catch up.

Maybe we could say 'the leader must maintain the speed from the last corner down the s/f straight until he/she crosses the line to start the race' ,or something.

(edited to add quote)

[greg130]

Now, I believe that the car in front was accelerating, just not very quickly. This is probably the core of the issue in this case.

I agree mate.

[PaulW]

Agree about the core of the issue with this example. There is a little grey area in the otherwise solid rules for when we actually "go" and that is that, with the vaguaries introduced by different drivers getting pole and therefore driving that final last outlap section differently, knowing precisely whether the car in front is properly "going" or just accelerating to catch up with the pack prior to the proper go is difficult.

[Mark J]

For my part (and i know i'm still a relative online newb) but when i came out the last corner i had to floor it to keep up with the cars in front and then it all slowed down again as i got near the start finish straight, then it speeded up again.( ie it wasnt a consistent steady pace)...and i was 11th by the way.

Also, while i'm on my soap box ....has anyone ever given a thought to identifying people on a flying lap during qualifying ? Why not ask those on a hot (timed) lap to put their headlights on so that anyone else dawdling around the track or on an out/in lap can move well out the way in time for the guy on a flyer? It would be especially effective for tracks like Enna where it was all too easy to happen on someone chugging along the racing line when your lining up a chicane to take quickly. I saw many incidents during qualy that might have been avoided with some pre-notice. On the flip side, i know part of the fun/frustration factor can come from meeting traffic on your qualy runs and/or it would rely on discipline of the drivers to turn 'em on/off again, so its just a suggestion thrown out to the floor in a Roman senate stylee ......now dont throw me to the lions
(also appologise if this has been brought up before...hey, i'm new )

[Pedro[PL]]

In my home leage we drive flying laps with headlights on and it works perfectly. On the other hand, some guys added car horn samples to their skins so they can "inform" you well in advance

[Jamera]

Just wondering if prohibiting overtaking until AFTER the first turn  would help, you can still go at the S/F line, but the first corner would act as a buffer for the following cars and by the time you can overtake everyone should be up to racing speed. I also think that whatever speed pole leaves the last corner at should be the speed he/she
crosses the S/F at ie. a constant drag up the S/F straight

[Dave 'Gizmo' Gymer]

Guys, I'm going to lock this topic as the discussion has moved well away from the event in question and towards the starting procedure which is best discussed elsewhere.

With specific regards to lights during qualifying, those on hot laps shouldn't need to advertise the fact. Those who are not on a flyer know who they are and must take responsibility for keeping out of everyone else's way as best they can.