How about a challenge race/series with GBGPL?

[EvilClive]

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At the instigation of Jack O'Farrell, who is currently cooking up a "Beginners 65" league ( watch out for that one ), I have posted a challenge on the GBGPL forum to have an inter league competition.
Pete stenning ( of GBGPL) is keen but nothing has been decided until we get some feedback and idea of how many are interested. There have been about 24 hrs of brief discussion behind the scenes and generally it is thought that this could be fun.

Phil has suggested (and I like )the idea of the World Cup format, depending on how many come forward wishing to compete, but 7 or 8 drivers from each league, might exclude some of those who are keen but maybe not so quick.

So, in order to keep everyone who wants to be included able to race, there could be a bigger squad which has to be fully used over a series of races?
I am personally keen for this to involve ALL levels of ability and not just the elite drivers battling it out for superiority. So that points scored by the slower drivers might make a significant contribution to the team's point tally.

I think that maybe initially we could table a list of ideas/parameters that can be included/excluded,  so that we get a structure around which the series or individual races are built.

Maybe these could include things such as:-
Number of Races
Team size
Pro rules or not
Race length
Chassis usage
Papy only Tracks
Point scoring ( I would favour points for the whole field and maybe a bonus point for each car still running at the end to encourage the slower drivers to concentrate on finishing in order to collect team points? )

from there we move on to dates , times etc.

We also need to establish a point of contact for and from each of the leagues so tha ideas can be exchanged?

But, these are only my initial thoughts and are entirely open to derision . So what level of interest is there?
evilClive 

[Bully]

I would be interested in this.

Number of races, could this be a mini series or a full season?
Team size. Maybe there could be 2 teams from each league, one for people with tentacles (no not testicles!) and one for normal people (like me).
Pro rules. gets my vote everytime.
Race length. I vote for 40-60 minutes
Chassis Usage. Restricted by Gplrank? Use the same chassis all season?
Papy only tracks. I guess But I do like many others
Point scoring. What you say sounds good.

Bully.

[Art]

Sounds good Clive and I'll be up for this. 

Number of races: I'm up for mini series or full season.
Team size: I don't really mind about this so will go with what is decided.
Rules: Pro rules are good for me.
Race length: I'll go with Bully on this one...40-60 min race.
Chassis usage: With Bully on this as well....restricted chassis all season
Pappy only Tracks: Hmmmm....tough on this as I do like others as well.
Point scoring: No comment as agree on your thoughts Clive.

Cheers

Art

[Jack O'Ferrall]

My initial concept was for a single race, otherwise we might have to merge one of our existing leagues, which would be more difficult to achieve.  A single race would be easier to organise in terms of the availability of drivers on a particular day- if there was sufficient interest we could then run a second tier race (a plate?) on the same day.

If it's to be a 'national championship' race we should go for full grids and GP rules.  I'm not sure why we don't run GP at the top level anyway, probably because I'm not aware of the drawbacks?  Half distance GP, or is that too long? 

Tracks have to be suited to the format.  With team racing we could request cars that are about to be lapped to finish their race.  However, having no lapping would be preferable.  Spa is the track that seems most suitable, if we are to allow for the fastest drivers to drive the fastest cars- and we should- as there are passing opportunities and the laps are long enough.  If instead we go for a mini-series then the longest tracks would seem preferable and I'd drop Watkins and Monaco- at the least- as being too awkward for team races.

I'd also like to use all chassis, with nine cars per team we might then run 2 BRMs 2 Coopers and the other five cars each.  There's probably a different best points system for everyone.  I prefer simpler numbers, 10 pts awards rather than 50pts.  This is my suggestion:
Points:  historic 9 6 4 3 2 1
Two points for defeating your rival in the other chassis, except four for the best Cooper and BRM, making 25 points from places and 18 from rivalries.  If the individual winner had a Cooper or BRM that would be 13 individual points.  If we want draws to be a possibility we could alter this slightly.  We could also reward finishers with a point, that would mean another 18 points for finishers and the maximum individual points at 14.

Finally on team selection, while the majority of the places should reward league commitment (minimum races?) we could also assign one or at most two wild cards...?

[EvilClive]

Blimey Jack, you seem to have given this some thought!!

I have just looked at the GBGPL forum and there are a couple of guys already interested and we have a couple here in UKGPL too.
 So far, longer races seem to be preferred and initialy sticking to papy tracks, purely because everyone  ( noobies included) will have them. Pro Rules are also in favour, and also points for finishing.

 Maybe we should run a one off "prologue" race to prove the format? after which any gripes/anomolies can be tweaked before the idea moves on any further.

I am fully aware that if we are not careful here, we could create another hybrid league which is not really the intention, is it??
Also, although your proposals sound ok, I think it a bit harsh to expect lapped drivers to retire given the possible disparity in abilities we may see.
 After all in any Div1 or Masters race even at Spa the aliens can lap half the field, so on a half distance GP we could be left with about 4 cars circulating?? With pro rules there is always the hope that the fast guys might blow a gasket in the closing laps and even lapped drivers pick up places.
I think someone should draw up a simple format based upon teams of say 9? because we can take 18 starters within GPL.
I think the idea of a fixed chassis list would be good,  so that both sides would have a list of cars that they have to field and can allocate drivers to suit themselves. But the slower chassis would need to be filled first? thus making it an advantage to get all 9 seats occupied? and a full grid.
Maybe we could spread the series out, to once a month? with reserve drivers able to step into any empty seats?

What I am most concerned about is how we allow ALL abilities to have a drive ( and some fun) and not see two teams of the elite from each league battling it out??  So far, other than a gentlemans agreement, I cannot see a fail safe way of getting a wide spread of ability into the teams. Unless we peruse each others internal league listings and check that each level is equally represented?

anyone got any thoughts?
evilClive

[Jack O'Ferrall]

While I realise that fastest times and race times are different, it takes about 15s difference to lap a car over half distance at Spa.....  thats 3:25 for a slow Cooper and 3:10 for the fastest Lotus.  The slow Cooper might be more typical of the second-string race, though?  Allowing lapped cars to continue makes for rules problems as even with the best intentions race cars crash.

A first race would help settle any difficulties.  As it's a one-off I would restrict the range of abilities for the top team or teams.  We could always add a leftovers race to different rules, if required.

Why pro rules?  A challenge race should have GP rules.  We can always fix the length to the equivalent of long if required, its not as if it takes much effort!   

[poacherpete]

As representaive of GBGPL i can go with Pro rules. I cant go with those laped being retired i would not complete half distance as i would be so slow trying not to crash or blow up .

I like Clive want to see a wide variety of skills, i may struggle to get 9 of my fast drivers  to be availible .

I am sure we can come to an agreed set of rules .

Pete

[Steven Foster]

I'd be interested in this too