Season 20 Novices Trophy Registration

[blito]

well, your debut went a whole lot better than mine! i whole lot better than most of us! Only 2 laps down at the end and lapping at a respectable pace too! I`m really pleased to see you do better than expected after the way you talked down your chances. keep at it m8, your doing good

[karlisss]

stupid things, what i cant understand... but plz understand me in a right way:
1.
if these are Novices races (slow racers as i understand) then  drivers with laptimes 1-25 at Mosport (if GPL Rank World records are in 1-24), are Novices too?
cmon...
i don't want to talk about baning or etc, but just don't understand line between Novices and GP racers PRO...
2.
ALIENS, plz respect slower cars on track! There is no need to PUSH and HIT from behind, just because you are faster. We are slow ones not because we like to race slow... but because we can't master car so good as you..alien.
It means, we don't want loosing positions (cos we have our slow end battles to) by stopping in grass out of track or frustrating jumping from racing line to other side of track, with higher possibility to cause spin and crash for both of us... just for letting you pas as soon  alien in mirrors at horizion... There are good places on track where is possible to do it in very nice and correct way.
3.
even if you are alien, there is no need to jump in to racing line, after returning on to track from grass.... man, at that moment even slower car noob as me are faster than "FAST CAR"..
no matter am i lap down or in the same lap.
otherwise it was realy great race as all GPL races i participated.
thanks!

[miner2049er]

stupid things, what i cant understand... but plz understand me in a right way:
1.
if these are Novices races (slow racers as i understand) then  drivers with laptimes 1-25 at Mosport (if GPL Rank World records are in 1-24), are Novices too?
cmon...

It's a good point and I know what you mean.

When we get new drivers to UKGPL and we don't really know where to put them they generally go into Novices and in group 1 so the Lotus is available to them.

Some of these people are genuinely too quick and are good racers and move on quickly like Goran or Al Heller and will be given the option of moving to Amateurs mid season or using a slower chassis in Novices.

Occasionally we get a new driver who appears to be what is generally known as a "Hot Lapper" which is somebody used to driving alone offline or against AI which means they are very quick but will crash a lot when they have to account for others or they cannot sit on the racing line for lap after lap. We all know that driving among human drivers online is something totally different, and this is the bit that usually takes the longest time to learn. Some of course never really learn how to race sensibly online.

As you know this was the first race of the season and that usually creates some interesting incidents, and the moderation process is there to help people as well as penalise them.

Remember, I am modding the Novices and I am also racing in them so I am seeing how fast or slow people are in real time, not just by looking at replays, and I too was a victim of being hit last night, on the longest and straightest bit of the track, so I will keep an eye on it as the season progresses.

All you can do to help yourself in the situations you mentioned is to be predictable and stick to the racing line in corners and not move around if you can help it. When I passed you last night, I went off the line to do it, I did not expect you to dive out of my way and nor should anybody else.

[b_1_rd]

The other consideration for the divisions is to try and balance the numbers as even as possible.  It is better to have 14 or 15 drivers in each than 19 in Ams and 10 in Novs or vice versa.  There is always some overlap between divisions and abilities, I know, I'm one of them . Those drivers normally have a choice between faster chassis in Ams or Slower chassis in Novs so hopefully it should balance out (no one in Novs has a BT7....yet ).

As Mike has said, it is under constant review and allocated chassis are reviewed at mid-season (unless it is blatant there is something seriously wrong).

Some good points though Karliss, thanks.

[Artiglietti]

Hey guys, I feel there is some reference to me in a couple of the previous posts, so heres my view.

I did in the entire racing event (practice and race), 2 laps in the 25s. This means, I can easily go in the 26s at mosport (especially while on my own..), and occasionally I pull off a 25 high. Now, last year record is 26.2; I think season 17 or 16 someone did 25.7 in the race. Amateurs best this season is 25.0. Not sure whats the fuss all about, the times I made are in line with the best times in the novices, thats all. If I was running in the amateurs this season, I would have been mid of the pack, I think this is a pretty reasonable overlap.

Also, as you can see I ended up 7th in the race. I do have the quickest lap by a margin, but it didnt account for much when I lost, like, a minute skating on the grass for my lack of consistency and ability to resist the distraction of the other cars driving (and sometimes spinning) around me (thats leaving alone trying to plug in my pc while somehow still racing...). If I were to run among the amateurs, I would probably be dead last.
Unfortunately, that lack of consistency is the one thing you cant practise if not actually racing! Think you are better off doing it among Novices...

My logic was, I will hammer in as much practise as possible, try to build a cushion in speed to the best competitors, so that will make up for the unforeseeable mistakes I am bound to make. So, off I went, banging in hours of practice after dinner pretty regularly in these last 3 weeks. I mean, I was in the 29s when I enrolled for the championship the 20th of September!! Lapped and dead last at my first fun race in Mosport a a couple of weeks ago! Karliss, you can do the same exercise if you want/have time, no need to get frustrated! But mind you, for me it turned out even that wasnt enough!

So, not sure why all these discussions. If I pull my acts together and keep being fast, I will certainly be downsized come the middle of the season or earlier. But thats all to see, isnt it? For now is 7th at 40 secs down, pending moderator review...

As for shoving people around on the fast cars, drivers who are a bit slower than the  quickest one should factor in that we are all pretty much on the limit while driving these things, quick or slow, so what  looks like ruthlessness might well be a driving mistake or just being a bit ragged!

Incidentally, the world record on this track for these mod is actually 1.23.5, so we are all quite a slice off the pace..

[Ross Neilson]

Artiglietti, don't worry too much about the prospect of being put in a slower car. Unless you win a bunch of races by a mile I think Mike will let you carry on in the Lotus.

Last season I was in a similar position to yourself, putting in loads of practice and setting poles and fastest laps for the first half of the season, but spinning off and finishing in the midfield. After a while I learnt to be more consistent and got a few wins under my belt - I'm sure it won't be long before you do the same, at which point we won't stand a chance!!

Karliss makes some good points but just because someone is quick, doesn't mean they should be in Ams rather than Novs. As well as being fast you need to be consistent and avoiding bumping into others. I'm sure AA would admit he's not there yet and so should remain in Novs this season at least.

With regard to lapping other drivers, I made a bit of mess of it with the battling Hondas, who did try to move over. I've got no complaints about blocking and realise this is all part of my racecraft, which needs more work.

A quick note to all Novices - the Spec series on Sunday night is using the 65 mod this time, and is at Imola. It's a great way to get more experience so hope to see you all there this weekend.

[Hristo Itchov]

There were people doing 1:25 in Novices? Uhm, top 8 in Amateurs were into 1:25 in Qualifying... that should tell you a lot.

In my opinion you should either assign slower chassis to some people or move them up to Amateurs.

As Mike has said, it is under constant review and allocated chassis are reviewed at mid-season (unless it is blatant there is something seriously wrong).

I think you should reconsider reviewing allocated chassis on a race by race basis. Waiting until mid-season is way too late, we saw that clearly last season in Amateurs.

[blito]

I think there are good arguments from both sides here - Art is clearly way too fast in his Lotus to be a novice but there is a lot to be said for learning craft too and as such it is right he is in the novice league but maybe should be assigned a slower car. There is a lot to be said for good racecraft - i finished 6th yesterday just by plodding around at 1:29-1:30 and not falling off the tarmac. I`m certainly no novice - i`ve competed in hundreds of online racesbut i am slow.  Art may be 3 secs/lap faster than me but he finished behind me through poor racecraft.  The Novices league is a relaxed, easy going (by ukgpl standards) league where people come to hone their skills before moving up the ladder to the stricter leagues, so I wonder, who is it that has more to learn? Who is the Novice?
For the likes of Badblood and Karliss - in the hayday of GPL there were multiple "lower" leagues that catered for the slower drivers, true Novice leagues but sadly there just arent enough GPLers around these days for that to happen.... for the time being, stick around and learn racecraft the traditional way - by keeping it clean and gradually improving your pace as you do...

[Artiglietti]

Hristo, the a difference between 25.8 and 25.0 is almost a second, and to skinn off that last bit is much more difficult than to get yourself into the leading pace at Novs level.

Also, if it was carnage this way, think what it would be when changing chassis every race or so!! 

I can see you have been competing in these series for years, so you know the cars and probably have setups for each one of them, I havent even tried cars other than Ferrari and Lotus!!

Thanks Ross, I am sure my racing will take its time to get to a decent level (although I expect it to be much less of a shamble next time around..), so you shouldnt worry. Also, I only know the papy tracks, so will have to learn all the others, starting with the next ones in Imola and Zeltweg for the 2 leagues I am taking part to!
By the way, had a look at the link of Villeneuve you posted some time ago, brilliant stuff, although If he had to do something like that driving on 3 wheels nowdays, he would probably be banned for this life and the next one! Only us in Ukgpl league can still apreciate that kind of driving...or not?

Blito, thanks, thats exactly the point I was trying to make. Until I home in behind you, its probably a bit early days to start worrying about slowing me down!

Oh, for the records, tonight I start practising Zeltweg. 

 

[Hristo Itchov]

Hristo, the a difference between 25.8 and 25.0 is almost a second, and to skinn off that last bit is much more difficult than to get yourself into the leading pace at Novs level.

Also, if it was carnage this way, think what it would be when changing chassis every race or so!!  

I can see you have been competing in these series for years, so you know the cars and probably have setups for each one of them, I havent even tried cars other than Ferrari and Lotus!!

Thanks Ross, I am sure my racing will take its time to get to a decent level (although I expect it to be much less of a shamble next time around..), so you shouldnt worry. Also, I only know the papy tracks, so will have to learn all the others, starting with the next ones in Imola and Zeltweg for the 2 leagues I am taking part to!
By the way, had a look at the link of Villeneuve you posted some time ago, brilliant stuff, although If he had to do something like that driving on 3 wheels nowdays, he would probably be banned for this life and the next one! Only us in Ukgpl league can still apreciate that kind of driving...or not?

Blito, thanks, thats exactly the point I was trying to make. Until I home in behind you, its probably a bit early days to start worrying about slowing me down!

Oh, for the records, tonight I start practising Zeltweg.  

 

Well, I was the only one that did a flat 25, the rest were into mid 25s and up. I'm just saying that with your speed in the Lotus you'll have no competition in Novices whatsoever as long as you don't crash or spin off, except perhaps on tracks where slipstream plays a bigger role (i.e. Monza).

It's up to the moderators of course, but given that consistency and race craft (as Blito said) are equally important as outright speed, then you probably belong to Novices for the moment, but maybe not driving a Lotus.

As for other cars, I have no setups for all (you can find my setup pack in the general GPL section of the forum) because I've mostly driven the slower cars. And you might be surprised, but the best handling cars in the 65 mod are the slower ones (BT11, Cooper and BT7), so in a way it's much easier for a novice to drive those cars. They have less power so it's less likely you'd spin on acceleration and they have superb handling. I believe those 3 cars can take corners quicker than any of the faster cars, it's just that they lose that advantage on the straights.

[BadBlood]

And you might be surprised, but the best handling cars in the 65 mod are the slower ones (BT11, Cooper and BT7), so in a way it's much easier for a novice to drive those cars.

You could have told me that before you signed me up for Hiki-Waza 

[Hristo Itchov]

And you might be surprised, but the best handling cars in the 65 mod are the slower ones (BT11, Cooper and BT7), so in a way it's much easier for a novice to drive those cars.

You could have told me that before you signed me up for Hiki-Waza 

Shh, you don't want HER to hear you talk bad about the Wazamobile when you actually have the privilege and luxury to drive it! 

[Statmeister]

There were people doing 1:25 in Novices? Uhm, top 8 in Amateurs were into 1:25 in Qualifying... that should tell you a lot.

In my opinion you should either assign slower chassis to some people or move them up to Amateurs.

I did a table last season that compared Novice/Amateur pole times & might be of interest here. I'm taking a break from statistical duties but seeing this discussion I updated it to include Artiglietti's lap & it shows that his time was not so different to previous Novice poles. You can see that his pole time would have put him #8 on the Amateur's grid & was also within 101% of the Am pole, which is fast but also on a par with previous pole times by D-Rock & Vosblod.

     

[Hristo Itchov]

That's good to know, but it doesn't mean that things could be improved with closer and more competitive racing in mind, giving more people in Novices a chance. I think that this has been greatly improved in the Ams over the past few seasons and has resulted in such closely contested races that we have now.

I have hardly lapped anyone in this last Mosport race and Qualifying on its own proves the battles over the season are going to involve multiple drivers throughout the whole field.

For some reason this is not the case in the Novices, although I guess you could put it down to people making mistakes and not just outright speed.

[vosblod]

For some reason this is not the case in the Novices, although I guess you could put it down to people making mistakes and not just outright speed.

I think you've hit the nail on the head there Hristo.
Mike is a bit of a master on chassis allocations and has a very beady eye () so I'm sure he'll make any changes necessary as the season progresses, don't forget we had five potential champions going into the final race last season.